ADVrider

Go Back   ADVrider > Bikes > Old's Cool
User Name
Password
Register Inmates Photos Site Rules Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 10-17-2013, 02:48 PM   #31
Mercury264
Once you go Triple...
 
Mercury264's Avatar
 
Joined: Nov 2005
Location: Masshole
Oddometer: 21,852
Quote:
Originally Posted by Benesesso View Post
Ever hear of constructive criticism? Look it up. And remember, no matter how hard you try, you can't make a silk purse from a sow's ear.
He's not posting so someone can post some 'constructive criticism'. He knows what he's doing, he doesn't need your advice.

Again, please just go away and leave this thread to those that enjoy it.

I'm done with you.

To the OP - my apologies, I just hate people shitting in great threads like this. I'm done responding to him.
__________________
'12 Tiger 800XC
'07 TE510
'02 Sprint ST
'99 XR650L
'99 Speed Triple
Mercury264 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-17-2013, 03:03 PM   #32
Twin-shocker
Beastly Adventurer
 
Joined: Jan 2012
Oddometer: 1,673
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dewey V View Post
Obviously anything that would be reused was checked before any effort was put into the parts. I never stated that any parts were not properly checked before being worked on - YOU stated that in your post, and quite definitively, as if you were actually here watching.

The cylinder head has been trued, top and bottom, look again, and a Serdi is not the only way to get a three-angle valve seat.

Let's see some of what you've done.

What checks did you use on the parts for this engine? And why no mention of fitting hardened seats?
Twin-shocker is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-17-2013, 03:11 PM   #33
KustomizingKid
Studly Adventurer
 
Joined: Nov 2012
Location: Minneapolis
Oddometer: 680
The assholes in this thread are going to scare away the op who is posting some fantastic stuff. Shut the fuck up and just listen, you learn a lot more that way.

Eagerly waiting for more pics.
__________________
2000 Xr650r!
KustomizingKid is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-17-2013, 03:12 PM   #34
aclundwall
Gnarly Adventurer
 
Joined: Sep 2013
Location: Rowlett, TX
Oddometer: 101
I love this thread...Well, most of it.

Couple questions for the OP...just out of curiousity.

First, when you're measuring the volume above the pistons (after hand finishing the domes), how do you know they're at exactly the same height relative to one another? I'm guessing one would have to put a wrist pin in the piston and support it from below (the known surface plate) with a 123 block or something similar?

Second, were those nicks in the con rods typical? They look pretty significant to just be tool marks, but for all I know they all looked like that back then! I have done a few very basic rebuilds, on much newer engines, but I don't recall the rods having nicks and gouges like these did.

Please don't stop posting pictures...I'm learning interesting new stuff!
aclundwall is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-17-2013, 03:45 PM   #35
fritzcoinc
Enjoying my last V8
 
fritzcoinc's Avatar
 
Joined: Apr 2008
Location: Cypress, Tx
Oddometer: 6,544
Quote:
Originally Posted by aclundwall View Post
I love this thread...Well, most of it.


First, when you're measuring the volume above the pistons (after hand finishing the domes), how do you know they're at exactly the same height relative to one another? I'm guessing one would have to put a wrist pin in the piston and support it from below (the known surface plate) with a 123 block or something similar?

Please don't stop posting pictures...I'm learning interesting new stuff!

When in the engine assembly.
__________________
Regards
Fritzcoinc
96 XR650L, 96 Guzzi Sport, 07 BMW K1200GT,
86 Husky 400 XCE, 00 Husky Te 610 e, 1999 Husky TC610 SM, 2000 Cagiva GC; Google: TX7
fritzcoinc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-17-2013, 04:16 PM   #36
aclundwall
Gnarly Adventurer
 
Joined: Sep 2013
Location: Rowlett, TX
Oddometer: 101
Quote:
Originally Posted by fritzcoinc View Post
When in the engine assembly.
sorry..I don't understand your reply.

Forgive me if you already see what I was driving at...but in case you did not, I was referring to the pictures above when he was filling the area above the pistons with measured amounts of liquid to determine the differences in volume above the piston domes. Since he's measuring fractions of milliliters, It's critical that the piston be located accurately and identically for each. But there are few places on the piston itself he can use to control how high it's being held! He's altered the domes of the pistons, so they're no longer identical, which means he can't use a simple measurement from the top of the cylinder! The bottom of the piston skirts are likely not accurate enough for this purpose either, so he can't just let the skirt rest against the surface plate. And since the volume above the piston, in the completed engine, is ultimately controlled by the wrist pin anyway, it seems logical that this is the feature he'd use to locate the pistons prior to taking this measurement.

I'm just trying to get his method straight in my head, and then file it away in my memory bank for future reference! :-)
aclundwall is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-17-2013, 04:18 PM   #37
KustomizingKid
Studly Adventurer
 
Joined: Nov 2012
Location: Minneapolis
Oddometer: 680
I would guess with a dial indicator off the deck measure to the top of the dome? Or maybe a degree wheel to accurately measure tdc?

Do you do any measurement of squish clearence and area, in relation to matching the volumes? In my understanding of combustion engines volume=cr but squish area and clearence also has a substantial impact on combustion.
__________________
2000 Xr650r!
KustomizingKid is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-17-2013, 04:32 PM   #38
aclundwall
Gnarly Adventurer
 
Joined: Sep 2013
Location: Rowlett, TX
Oddometer: 101
Quote:
Originally Posted by KustomizingKid View Post
I would guess with a dial indicator off the deck measure to the top of the dome? Or maybe a degree wheel to accurately measure tdc?

Do you do any measurement of squish clearence and area, in relation to matching the volumes? In my understanding of combustion engines volume=cr but squish area and clearence also has a substantial impact on combustion.

It's true that he's trying to verify that when the piston is at TDC, the volume above each is identical. But since the piston and cylinder are on a surface plate, and not connected to the crankshaft, how does he know if the piston is at TDC? Like I said...he's polished the tops of the pistons...so you can no longer assume that the top of one is identical to other anymore. For that matter, who's to say they were identical to begin with? Point is, it would seem to me that you can't measure down to the piston from the top of the cylinder.

I say that like it's fact...but really, you might be right! The tops of the pistons might be close enough to identical for the purpose of this test. That's why I'm asking...just to learn something.
aclundwall is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-17-2013, 05:32 PM   #39
ozmoses
Ride On
 
ozmoses's Avatar
 
Joined: Jul 2009
Location: USA
Oddometer: 2,797
Hey OP-

I don't know enough about this kind of stuff to know what I don't know- but I like it & I appreciate you posting this up.

Please don't get sidetracked by the commentary.

Put a few of these dipshits on ignore and let's roll!
__________________
Opinions are like internet connections- everybody has one.
ozmoses is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-17-2013, 06:34 PM   #40
sailah
Lampin' it
 
sailah's Avatar
 
Joined: Aug 2005
Location: Turning expensive metal into scrap
Oddometer: 5,412
I love stuff like this. I wish I was more confident when it comes to internals.

Hate to admit my entire knowledge base for what you were doing comes from the show horsepower

Great work, it appears you walk the talk.
__________________
We're not out here to rough it. We're here to smooth it . Things are rough enough in town.

Nessmuk
sailah is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-17-2013, 08:10 PM   #41
aclundwall
Gnarly Adventurer
 
Joined: Sep 2013
Location: Rowlett, TX
Oddometer: 101
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dewey V View Post
Each piston dome is up tight against the acrylic plate that is sealed to the deck surface of the barrels and held in place with a chunk of modeling clay from underneath.

A smear of grease seals the plate to the deck and the same grease is used to seal the piston to the bore.

Interesting! Now that you say that, looking at the photos I see the plate, and the hole through which to drop the fluid! Thanks for the reply!
aclundwall is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-17-2013, 09:56 PM   #42
Beezer
Beastly Adventurer
 
Joined: Oct 2004
Location: Anchorage, formerly Spenard (hub of the universe)
Oddometer: 5,418
"Everything in these engines were rough. Apparently the factory didn't think that simply being dull was reason enough to replace cutting tools. "

no shit.

having many years experience with Brit bikes I can confirm that. they were truly "blunt objects" in many respects, and it's not just the tooling, the finish processes were usually only the minimal it took to make the part work. if it would work without machining.... then they painted it. they had great chrome though (and paint)

almost everything I ever did on a Brit bike required hand fitting... hence my reference to his file collection... BTDT. also, most Brit guys I know to run Avgas at least once in while for the lead. (glass tanks is a whole 'nother story)


p.s. == the OP must be a Brit vet just to work on this stuff.... '67 would have been all Whitworth & BA etc... they "changed over" starting in '68, but in reality thre mostly changed frame hardware... engine parts with Brit thread pitch lingered well into the 70's. that means special wrenches & tooling. they were great machines... they conquered the world. I learned to ride on them and did a lot of exploring on them for many years... I love them, but mostly in remembrance because I moved on. still... ya gotta respect them. (and they look kool) (most of them)

Beezer screwed with this post 10-17-2013 at 10:10 PM
Beezer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-17-2013, 11:36 PM   #43
Twin-shocker
Beastly Adventurer
 
Joined: Jan 2012
Oddometer: 1,673
Quote:
Originally Posted by Beezer View Post
"Everything in these engines were rough. Apparently the factory didn't think that simply being dull was reason enough to replace cutting tools. "

no shit.

having many years experience with Brit bikes I can confirm that. they were truly "blunt objects" in many respects, and it's not just the tooling, the finish processes were usually only the minimal it took to make the part work. if it would work without machining.... then they painted it. they had great chrome though (and paint)

almost everything I ever did on a Brit bike required hand fitting... hence my reference to his file collection... BTDT. also, most Brit guys I know to run Avgas at least once in while for the lead. (glass tanks is a whole 'nother story)


p.s. == the OP must be a Brit vet just to work on this stuff.... '67 would have been all Whitworth & BA etc... they "changed over" starting in '68, but in reality thre mostly changed frame hardware... engine parts with Brit thread pitch lingered well into the 70's. that means special wrenches & tooling. they were great machines... they conquered the world. I learned to ride on them and did a lot of exploring on them for many years... I love them, but mostly in remembrance because I moved on. still... ya gotta respect them. (and they look kool) (most of them)

I worked on Brit bikes for many years as a job, and would agree with you completely. However when the Honda Super Cub came out in 1952, the writing was on the wall for the prehistoric Brit bike industry.
Twin-shocker is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-17-2013, 11:52 PM   #44
Twin-shocker
Beastly Adventurer
 
Joined: Jan 2012
Oddometer: 1,673
I do find it surprising that the OP feels that measuring and adjusting the combustion volumes, and polishing the crowns of what look like shoddy far eastern pistons, is suggestive of blueprinting?

What he has done will certainly help a road machine run a bit smoother, but not fitting hardened valve seats, and failing to properly check parts such as the rods, are not things that I think should be overlooked on any fairly high standard rebuild on one of these old motors.
Twin-shocker is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-17-2013, 11:57 PM   #45
jeep44
junk collector
 
jeep44's Avatar
 
Joined: Mar 2008
Location: Canton,Michigan
Oddometer: 2,024
Quote:
Originally Posted by Benesesso View Post
They look nice, but why not simply have them shot peened? Seems like a lot of work going into such a low power, 2 valve 360 deg. aircooled lump.
They didn't call that model a "Daytona" for no reason-it won there in '66


Anyway, I have a '67 T100R also. A very interesting thread for me, because it currently has a single-carb head on it, and I have what I hope is the correct head on the shelf, waiting for the day I get sufficiently motivated to change it. (It does run so nicely with a single carb)

edit: Fortunately, the casting number visible in some of your photos matches the one on my head, so it looks like I have the right item.

jeep44 screwed with this post 10-18-2013 at 05:17 PM
jeep44 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Share

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

.
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump


Times are GMT -7.   It's 04:25 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.5
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ADVrider 2011-2014