ADVrider

Go Back   ADVrider > Fluff > Shiny things
User Name
Password
Register Inmates Photos Site Rules Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Reply
 
Thread Tools Rating: Thread Rating: 21 votes, 4.81 average. Display Modes
Old 10-26-2013, 11:07 PM   #16
xymotic
Beastly Adventurer
 
xymotic's Avatar
 
Joined: Jun 2008
Location: Federal Way, WA
Oddometer: 8,367
Quote:
Originally Posted by victor441 View Post
MAYBE...the rules for out of state vehicles might be different, currently 1975 or older is smog exempt in CA but initial registration of an out of state vehicle may use another year...some years ago I bought a '55 Pontiac in WA and had to have a PCV system added in order to pass inspection and get it registered in CA
Anyway, a very cool vehicle, looking forward to reading about the build!
Interesting I guess I mis-read it anyway and it's a '76.

So then how does that affect if you do a total transplant on it?

Like if you put a new EFI 5 liter or something in it, does it just have to beat the OEM version?
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by Just_Sean
Oh for ***k's sake Aaron. Please link us to my fascist, racist or homophobic posts.
"Anyone who doesn't take truth seriously in small matters cannot be trusted in large ones either."
Albert Einstein


Baja trip to the tip
6:10 to Yuma
trials and tribulations in the Mojave
Baja Blitz Yard sale
View Current Location via Spot Tracker
xymotic is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-26-2013, 11:36 PM   #17
troidus
Beastly Adventurer
 
Joined: Sep 2010
Oddometer: 13,354
Quote:
Originally Posted by xymotic View Post
Interesting I guess I mis-read it anyway and it's a '76.

So then how does that affect if you do a total transplant on it?

Like if you put a new EFI 5 liter or something in it, does it just have to beat the OEM version?
The rules were changed back in the 80s, I think, such that you have to meet specs for the engine in the year it was produced, not for the chassis in the year it was produced. They did that to clamp down on the guys stripping smog gear from 80s engines and dropping them into pre-emissions chassis.
troidus is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-26-2013, 11:51 PM   #18
troidus
Beastly Adventurer
 
Joined: Sep 2010
Oddometer: 13,354
I missed the CA aspect of this vehicle. I think he'll be dumping a small fortune in this thing to get it to pass inspection. I was thinking about all of the mid-70s emissions gear and how there were two versions of everything, one for Federal and one for CA.

I don't remember if the engine has its original EGR manifold on it, but he'll need that and:

1. a period-correct Quadrajet or CARB-approved replacement
2. electric choke with the proper heat riser tubing
3. Thermactor (air cleaner with a thermally controlled vacuum motor for the heat riser)
4. Early Fuel Evaporation Valve (to force passenger-side exhaust up under the carb to heat the plenum, and on a '76 not sure if it's a bimetallic coil-driven valve or a vacuum motor driven valve)
5. Evaporative Emissions Control System (charcoal canister, with CA-only purge valve, IMS)
6. Catalytic Converter.

Plus a couple of thermal vacuum valves, many feet of vacuum line, probably a couple of bleed valves, and who knows what else I've forgotten from back then.

That homebuilt fuel tank is probably a no-go, too, because it won't pass safety and probably doesn't have the EECS plumbing in it.

OP may be better off "moving" to NV and registering it there.
troidus is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-27-2013, 12:01 AM   #19
larryboy
Chopper Rider
 
larryboy's Avatar
 
Joined: Jan 2005
Location: On a set of 50,000 mile tires.
Oddometer: 14,241
He bought the van in Seattle and is moving to Oregon, can't you fawkers read?

Oh and it's a Ford 205 case to a Ford Dana 44, the heat riser stuff for the intake is in the van.

Good luck with the trans Alex, that sucks!!
__________________
Be sure the safest rule is that we should not dare to live in any scene in which we dare not die. ~Lewis Carroll~
larryboy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-27-2013, 02:00 AM   #20
troidus
Beastly Adventurer
 
Joined: Sep 2010
Oddometer: 13,354
Quote:
Originally Posted by larryboy View Post
He bought the van in Seattle and is moving to Oregon, can't you fawkers read?
Apparently not. I saw the part about living in SD. I guess the emissions part is going to depend on whether he tries to register it in CA before he moves or what the regs are in OR. Regardless, he'll still want a factory air filter housing with all the plumbing installed and working if he wants it to behave well.
troidus is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-27-2013, 04:03 AM   #21
Twin-shocker
Beastly Adventurer
 
Joined: Jan 2012
Oddometer: 1,673
Looks to me like a money pit, and may end up costing almost as much as buying a more recent used van ready to roll.
Twin-shocker is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-27-2013, 04:22 AM   #22
xymotic
Beastly Adventurer
 
xymotic's Avatar
 
Joined: Jun 2008
Location: Federal Way, WA
Oddometer: 8,367
Quote:
Originally Posted by Twin-shocker View Post
Looks to me like a money pit, and may end up costing almost as much as buying a more recent used van ready to roll.
Boy it sure is lucky you didn't buy it then! Whew that was close! It may well be a money pit, but it's WAYYYYYYY cooler than a new one
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by Just_Sean
Oh for ***k's sake Aaron. Please link us to my fascist, racist or homophobic posts.
"Anyone who doesn't take truth seriously in small matters cannot be trusted in large ones either."
Albert Einstein


Baja trip to the tip
6:10 to Yuma
trials and tribulations in the Mojave
Baja Blitz Yard sale
View Current Location via Spot Tracker
xymotic is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-27-2013, 10:01 AM   #23
larryboy
Chopper Rider
 
larryboy's Avatar
 
Joined: Jan 2005
Location: On a set of 50,000 mile tires.
Oddometer: 14,241
Quote:
Originally Posted by troidus View Post
Regardless, he'll still want a factory air filter housing with all the plumbing installed and working if he wants it to behave well.
I can see most of the parts in the back of the van, man. I bet the air cleaner lower section is buried in that box.

He'll figure it out.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Twin-shocker View Post
Looks to me like a money pit, and may end up costing almost as much as buying a more recent used van ready to roll.

Priced a 4x4 van with a solid front axle lately? I found a similar Chevy Van for $3500 and a 1994 Ford for 7k, but that's pretty old too...found a 1997 Ford 4x4 van for $15,000...that's pretty old too. It'd take $50,000 to buy something made in the last ten years.

This van is a score!!
__________________
Be sure the safest rule is that we should not dare to live in any scene in which we dare not die. ~Lewis Carroll~
larryboy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-27-2013, 11:40 AM   #24
CallMeBoog
hi functioning idiom
 
CallMeBoog's Avatar
 
Joined: May 2010
Location: NSLC
Oddometer: 5,944
Quote:
Originally Posted by Twin-shocker View Post
Looks to me like a money pit, and may end up costing almost as much as buying a more recent used van ready to roll.

Oh good, are you going to shit all over this thread too?

http://advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=927573
__________________
Don't Ride With Nate!

CallMeBoog is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-27-2013, 01:36 PM   #25
broncobowsher
Beastly Adventurer
 
broncobowsher's Avatar
 
Joined: Apr 2010
Location: Baking in AZ
Oddometer: 1,419
Quote:
Originally Posted by larryboy View Post
... It'd take $50,000 to buy something made in the last ten years.

This van is a score!!
New van, $~30k. Send to Quigley for conversion, $11-13k. Brand new with warranty for under $45k.

If you promise to buy it used in 9 years for $50k, someone would make a killing getting a new van for 9 years and sell it to you for $10k more then it was new.

I know local off-road shops that can make one with junkyard parts every bit as good as they were made in the 70's for a lot less then what Quigley does for new work.
broncobowsher is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-27-2013, 02:54 PM   #26
Parepin OP
The Filthy Nomad
 
Parepin's Avatar
 
Joined: Dec 2007
Location: That's... a tough one to answer
Oddometer: 1,096
Holy crap, this thread blew up. Let me continue on a bit with the story before I reply to anyone directly, as where I left off on my first post was a month ago.

Anyway, so my transmission slips. I coast off the highway and into a parking lot where I let it sit, thinking "Maybe I just need to let it cool down a bit and it will hook up." I was only a handful of miles from my buddy's shop, which is where I was heading anyhow so I could give the van a good once-over before heading south. Twenty minutes later, it starts and moves. I get back on the highway but find myself parked on the shoulder before I am even able to exit the on ramp. Rinse and repeat until I find myself sleeping in the back, alongside my bike, at 3 in the morning.

The next morning I caught a tow for the remaining 7 miles.


So I meet up with my buddy Tom, an Ex-moto racer and, before this incident, a mere acquaintance and friend of a friend. We BS around and I start wrenching. I drop the tranmission while Tom makes a few phone calls. By late that night, he knows of a guy who knows a guy who just gave a guy a functioning 350 tranny. I was able to buy it off of him for $120, delivered. I spent the next day crawling around and installing the new tranmission. I got it up and bolted on, but when I went to insert the tail end adapter for the transfer case, it won't fit. It just gets jammed. Low and behold, this isn't the "Right" Turbo 350. Cue dropping it back to the concrete before rolling down to the store for a six pack.

Tom's shop, garage, and private collection. Crappy cell phone pics.







The next day I borrow a truck and cart BOTH transmissions down to a local shop where their tech is willing to take the two units and assemble one that I can use, for a mere $100 (under the table). Deal. In the meantime, I went through what I could without parts in hand. I pulled the thermostat and flushed the cooling system, which looked discolored but not as bad as you might expect. The oil came out, black as sin, and was replaced with fresh and a filter. I fixed some wiring issues, a few vacuum lines that were assembled out of sheer jackassery, and just kind of hung out for the day. That evening I picked up the new tramission, and by 3 AM, I had it installed.

I was on the road the next day. The van rumbled along, doing over 3K at lower highway speeds. The body rattled like a tin can, forcing me to wear earbuds the entire trip. The engine had a wicked knock to it (Detonation), which required that I use high octane fuel WITH octane boost to keep the experience somewhat tolerable. It took me two days to drive back to San Diego. I used up several quarts of oil along the way, and managed a mileage of just over 10 MPG.

Back at the shop, I told the tale and got quite a bit of flak in return. Oddly enough, I'm unmoved by it all. Considering all the issues I've had, I still feel really good about the purchase and have no regrets. My mother hates it, my dad loves it, my buddy hates it but can't drive it without a big shit eating grin. I got back to work.

I decided to address the PING first, which got noticeably better the more I drove it. I did a full can flush of Seafoam into the vacuum lines and replaced the plugs, which got rid of the pinging all together. And, as it turned out, two cylinders weren't firing. Clueless as I was, with my earbuds in, this no doubt contributed to the poor performance. Three plugs were installed finger tight, one had an exploded electrode, and another had an electrode that was bridged with a chunk of Carbon. On the plus side, the remaining two plugs looked good.



Over the past few days, I tackled the motor. Another can of Seafoam, this time into the engine oil, and an oil change 60 miles later. I dropped the oil pan as well, for peace of mind more than anything else. I noticed quite a bit of magnetic residue, but nothing gritty. No filings, no shavings, no sludge or gasket scrap. I'm pleasantly surprised with how the engine looks so far, at least from what I can see. I also spent some time trying to find some ID numbers in the block so I can have somewhat of an idea what engine I'm dealing with, but was unable to find it. I hear they're often behind the alternator, which in this case, kept it quite hidden.







I've also spent some time with a couple rolls of Peel N Seal in an effort to quiet the cab somewhat for my run back up north. I re-insulated the doghouse with some mylar bubblewrap and filled in around the firewall and floor pans, on the inside, as much as I could manage. It seems to have helped somewhat, but now I notice all the other rattling that much more.
Parepin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-27-2013, 03:03 PM   #27
Parepin OP
The Filthy Nomad
 
Parepin's Avatar
 
Joined: Dec 2007
Location: That's... a tough one to answer
Oddometer: 1,096
Quote:
Originally Posted by broncobowsher View Post
Interesting home made (probably a custom fuel tank shop) gas tank.
Looks like the common 350/350 combo. 350 Chevy V8 with a turbo hydromatic 350 transmission.
The driver's side drop on the transfer case is interesting, they didn't use off the shelf GM parts for that. GM didn't go to driver's side differentials until '88.
The transfer case looks cast iron. What does that tag on it say? Random guess, New Process model 205?
I am questioning what is going on with the angle iron attached to the front tie rod.
Front axle looks like a Dana 44. Being of that vintage and the setup, probably a custom built part made for the conversion shop. I also see it is an 8-lug set up. So ¾ton setup. I see a bit of ID tag on one of the bolts holding the front cover on. What are all the numbers on it?
The gas tank is an aftermarket add on, I think. And, amazingly enough, it works. You flip a switch on the inside and not only do the lines switch, but the fuel gauge does as well. However, the filler neck is under the rear wheel well, opposite the stock filler location. What a jackass...

The transfer case is, indeed, cast iron. The tags also ID it as NP 205, spot on. I'm told these things are indestructible, and I've heard stories of people slamming them down on rocks when offroading and just destroying the rock. Also, if you notice on the tag, the date is listed as '76, which leads me to believe this is not a home made rig.


I know nothing of the final gearing of this setup. I wasn't able to find a tag anywhere.

Rear




Transfer case adapter


Quote:
Originally Posted by troidus View Post
Obviously you have bigger near-term problems with a dead tranny, but if you're going to take this thing out in the sticks and want it to be reliable, I'd put a factory air cleaner housing on it (with a functioning heat riser and cold air duct) to keep water out of the filter element and to keep the carb from icing at altitude. Then get some skidplates.
I plan on redoing that air cleaner when the time comes. Also, skidplates, yeah. I like it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DirtyDog View Post
That van is you, dude. Hope this story has a happy ending.

Everyone says this. Once the initial disbelief wears off and they have time to digest it, I always hear "This is something you'd do."
Parepin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-27-2013, 03:47 PM   #28
Parepin OP
The Filthy Nomad
 
Parepin's Avatar
 
Joined: Dec 2007
Location: That's... a tough one to answer
Oddometer: 1,096
Quote:
Originally Posted by MacNoob View Post
I see a Seca Turbo and a sailboat (?) in the background. You can haul those with the van.
The Turbo is mine, the sailboat is not. That turbo is actually another project of mine. I intend to turn it into a adventure tourer. I've already put a bunch of work into it, and have just a few more details to work out including: Luggage, tires, suspension, brakes, front end, lighting, electrical, engine rebuild (I've got two), turbo rebuild (two as well), and carb rebuilds (dos, as well). You know, little stuff.

Quote:
Originally Posted by troidus View Post
If you're willing to do a bit of work, you could put a 4L60 (no E) in it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by beemerkid View Post
So a 700R4. But is the back of a th350 the same as a 700r4? The motor is an easy matchup, but how do the output shaft and flange compare?
I intend on doing a tranmission swap down the line. This thing needs overdrive. I think the 4L60 is what I was looking at, but I'll have to check my notes. I want this rig to be, for the most part, as simple and computer free as I can get. I'm a KLR dude, after all.

Quote:
Originally Posted by broncobowsher View Post
Before you go all crazy about the transmission there is the fact that the transfer case is NOT a standard GM unit. An off the shelf (or junkyard) transmission may or may not work. At this point there is no telling what transfer case bolt pattern or shaft spline count you may encounter.

As for the 4l60 (more commonly known as a 700R4) suggestion, you really need to know the axle gearing first. If it is already too tall adding that overdrive will be a big expense and added complexity for no gain.

As for the air cleaner bits... He did mention he brought it into California. Getting all the California emissions stuff on it and working good enough to get it registerable will probably be the next big challenge after getting it to drive again. Part of that will be the correct air cleaner.
The overdrive tranmission should be a direct bolt on TO the 350 motor (obviously), and I'm sure the gearing is low enough to handle it, turning nearly 3.5K at 65mph. I will need a different adapter to the transfer case, which is made and readily available for $400-$500. The rear drive shaft will need to be shortened, the front lengthened, and I don't doubt I'll have to fab up some sort of mounting bracket for it, as well.

Emissions, Titling, and all that crap
Here's the deal on this. I'm living in San Diego, CALIFORNIA for the next couple of days. From there, I will be moving just outside of Coos Bay, OREGON. However, my place of residency, where I get my mail, and where I title my vehicles, is Lyons, NEW YORK.

Wrap your head around that one. I'll have NY plates (vintage orange and blue), NY reg, NY insurance. So emissions shouldn't be an issue seeing as the cutoff age for emissions is 25 years. That won't matter anyway, as I won't be visiting a New York inspection station anytime soon.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Twin-shocker View Post
Looks to me like a money pit, and may end up costing almost as much as buying a more recent used van ready to roll.
There is truth to what you say.

Quote:
Originally Posted by xymotic View Post
Boy it sure is lucky you didn't buy it then! Whew that was close! It may well be a money pit, but it's WAYYYYYYY cooler than a new one
I choose to live by this truth, however.

Quote:
Originally Posted by broncobowsher View Post
New van, $~30k. Send to Quigley for conversion, $11-13k. Brand new with warranty for under $45k.

If you promise to buy it used in 9 years for $50k, someone would make a killing getting a new van for 9 years and sell it to you for $10k more then it was new.

I know local off-road shops that can make one with junkyard parts every bit as good as they were made in the 70's for a lot less then what Quigley does for new work.
I have reason to believe this IS a Quigley conversion. There's a lot of attention to detail in this rig that you just wouldn't expect from a home made rig. Granted, there are plenty of back yard additions that have been done, but the platform is a well thought out and well executed conversion with no rust, straight panels, and a few quirks. It's right up my alley.

Even if I were to buy a newer one that had already been done up, I don't doubt that I would be tearing into it just as bad as this. It's just my nature. So I might as well start with a good platform and get exactly what I want out of it. I can guarantee you that a good chunk of what I want to do with this isn't exactly available out of a catalog, anyway. There will be rebar, fish net, rope, and all that bullshit that's gonna be needed to go well with my KLR.
Parepin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-27-2013, 03:56 PM   #29
Parepin OP
The Filthy Nomad
 
Parepin's Avatar
 
Joined: Dec 2007
Location: That's... a tough one to answer
Oddometer: 1,096
I also wanted to take a moment to thank you guys for the feedback. That's the reason I really started this thread. I'm venturing into uncharted territories here. I know nothing about big V-8's, Chevy's, or overlanding. I welcome and encourage all constructive criticism and ideas. This is gonna be a big project, done on a budget, but done well.
Parepin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-27-2013, 04:24 PM   #30
MiteyF
Beastly Adventurer
 
MiteyF's Avatar
 
Joined: Jul 2010
Location: Michigan... temporarily
Oddometer: 1,957
I dig it.

One question I have with all the NY stuff. I just moved to MI from WA and, without a business, CANNOT get insurance for my 32' box van. I was going to just keep my WA insurance, but insurance is usually determined by where the vehicle is kept/garaged, NOT where your "permanent address" is. The way I understand it, if I'm living in MI with my truck, and have WA insurance, and get into an accident, I have, for all intents and purposes... no insurance.
__________________
People tell me I have a motorcycle problem. I tell them, I may have problems, but motorcycles are the solution.
MiteyF is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Share

Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump


Times are GMT -7.   It's 06:15 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.5
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ADVrider 2011-2014