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Old 10-27-2013, 05:07 PM   #31
pdxmotorhead
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Those vans were very very common with the Phone company in OR and Washington back then, it even looks like the phone company ladder rack on the top.

Even though its 8 lug, its very likely what they called a Light 3/4 ton which was Dana 44 axles front and rear with a heavy duty outer, Fairly tough and decent parts. Chevy also sold suburbans to the forest service with the same setup.

The neg side of jumping to the OD trans is it also screws up drive line length.. the 700R4/4L*0 is just enough to make the rear too long and the front too short. It can also muck with the location of the cross member.. I'd just put 32x9.50 BFG MT tires on it. that will drop your RPM and quite things down.

I've run a 454 with about 500HP and 650 lbs of torque through a NP 205 they are really really tough..

Advanced adapters has lot o good info on tranny swaps on their website.

No emissions testing in OR outside of PDX and Bend far as I remember..
I live in PDX so I forget which zones get screwed too. LOL

There are GM restoration specialty suppliers that supply all the rubber for that beast.. You definitely want the factory rubber for the dog house or you will suck oil fumes forever..

The Edelbrock is a great carb if set up EXACTLY as their instructions tell you.. If not its a fuel hog. They almost never are correct out of the box.
Its way better if the fuel is plumbed as a recirculating system not dead headed as the fuel lines can get hot on the vans if they are in the stock frame location.

A brand spanking new stock quadrajet is > 900 bucks.. and I've seen them go upwards of 1200.. They are not good for rebuilds unless you can find a guy who can re-bush the throttle shafts. BY the age of that van the stock carbs are usually a basket case.

If you put dual 2" exhaust with nice walker mufflers it will be stealthy quiet and get good mileage. the mufflers should be 42" from the exhaust manifolds and have a min of 30 inches of tail pipe after them for best sound control and power.. The factory chevy exhaust manifolds are where you want to stay unless you add a cam. There are numerous sources of reproduction corvette cast iron for that motor and they are way less trouble than headers on a van.. !!!!

A buddy of mine had one and he cleaned the inside out completely and had Rhino Coat done on the whole interior.. Tough and quiets things nicely, plus hides all the dings and dents..

If you floor the roof rack with a 1/8 sheet of aluminum if will help keep the van cool in the summer, SW OR can get hot.. Especially over towards Grants pass and Medford..

Oh,, and they are nearly helpless in snow, be careful they DO NOT have the Offroad ability of the Pickups don't know why but I grew up around them and the 4x4 only really made them safer to drive than the 2 wheel version in the snow.. My theory is they just dont have the weight distribution right and have so much weight up high they oscillate too much when a tire spins.. Youll figure it out this winter.. LOL


Cheers Have fun with it!

Dave
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Old 10-27-2013, 05:49 PM   #32
larryboy
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Originally Posted by pdxmotorhead View Post
Even though its 8 lug, its very likely what they called a Light 3/4 ton which was Dana 44 axles front and rear with a heavy duty outer, Fairly tough and decent parts. Chevy also sold suburbans to the forest service with the same setup.

Cheers Have fun with it!

Dave

Nope, the front is a Ford Dana 44.

The rear BOM(3977323) comes back as a GM Corp 14 bolt with 4.56, date of mfg is 1974.

I bet that poor 350 is screaming with those little tires and 4.56 gears.
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Old 10-27-2013, 06:59 PM   #33
boardrider247
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Originally Posted by Parepin View Post

Transfer case adapter

What you have there is not a Quigley, however it is a factory done conversion. I believe in the 70's Pathfinder was a bigger player in the 4x4 van game then Quigley was.

http://www.pathfinder-vans.com/

Good luck it looks like a fun project
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Old 10-27-2013, 07:16 PM   #34
PineyMountainRacing
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Originally Posted by MiteyF View Post
I dig it.

One question I have with all the NY stuff. I just moved to MI from WA and, without a business, CANNOT get insurance for my 32' box van. I was going to just keep my WA insurance, but insurance is usually determined by where the vehicle is kept/garaged, NOT where your "permanent address" is. The way I understand it, if I'm living in MI with my truck, and have WA insurance, and get into an accident, I have, for all intents and purposes... no insurance.
FWIW, Florida is my permanent residence, but I have a second home in NC. I keep my F150 in NC, its registered in FL and the State Farm policy shows the FL address. My NC home is insured by State Farm as well, obviously a different policy and different agent. But my FL agent, and the one before him, are aware that I keep the truck in NC full time. Maybe states have different regulations.

OP, very cool rig!
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Old 10-28-2013, 11:06 AM   #35
Purcell69
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Originally Posted by larryboy View Post
Nope, the front is a Ford Dana 44.

The rear BOM(3977323) comes back as a GM Corp 14 bolt with 4.56, date of mfg is 1974.

I bet that poor 350 is screaming with those little tires and 4.56 gears.
Hah, I was going to guess the gearing is 4.10:1! I had a 78 Dodge W-200 Power Wagon that turned about the same highway RPM, Dana 44 front and Dana 60 rear. Factory gearing was 4.10.

Parepin, that van is a nice find. A 700R4 or 4L60 will be a nice swap and can be run without a computer. The only change to your wiring will be a different brake switch to lock and unlock the torque converter and some internal wiring in the trans. You'll get a little lower first gear and overdrive (about 30%), so cruising RPM will drop by about 1,000. 10 MPG isn't too bad for '70s tech. The OD tranny will get you a few more.

Years ago, I had a C-10 with a 454 I had built to replace a tired 350. The stock rear end was a 3.73 GM 12 bolt and at 70 MPH the engine was turning 4k. I found a junkyard 3.08 rear end and was able to slow the engine a bit at highway speed. Corrected fuel mileage was 12 MPG on any given day. The change in engine speed was similar to what you will get with OD.

-Joe
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Old 10-28-2013, 12:22 PM   #36
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Originally Posted by Purcell69 View Post
Hah, I was going to guess the gearing is 4.10:1! I had a 78 Dodge W-200 Power Wagon that turned about the same highway RPM, Dana 44 front and Dana 60 rear. Factory gearing was 4.10.

Parepin, that van is a nice find. A 700R4 or 4L60 will be a nice swap and can be run without a computer. The only change to your wiring will be a different brake switch to lock and unlock the torque converter and some internal wiring in the trans. You'll get a little lower first gear and overdrive (about 30%), so cruising RPM will drop by about 1,000. 10 MPG isn't too bad for '70s tech. The OD tranny will get you a few more.

Years ago, I had a C-10 with a 454 I had built to replace a tired 350. The stock rear end was a 3.73 GM 12 bolt and at 70 MPH the engine was turning 4k. I found a junkyard 3.08 rear end and was able to slow the engine a bit at highway speed. Corrected fuel mileage was 12 MPG on any given day. The change in engine speed was similar to what you will get with OD.

-Joe
Sounds like a plan, then. I don't mind doing some wiring. To be honest, a good chunk of the wiring that's in there now will be stripped out and replaced. 40 years of crimp on splices, speaker wire, and hose clamps make for a trashed appearance and make troubleshooting an absolute shit show. Seriously, it's a mess in there.

Fuel Mileage is very much a concern of mine. It's all a compromise, though. If I'm going with a van, a 350 is the smallest motor i'd consider as anything with less displacement is going to be a danger on the highways. You've gotta be able to get out of your own weight, you know. With that in mind, I figure I've got two options as far as the drivetrain goes.

Keep and rebuild the 350, tune the 4 barrel and swap out the heads with some Vortech ones. I hear this alone will not only give me better mileage, but more power. Vortech heads can be found everywhere, from what I've seen, in every imaginable condition and price. It's kind of a no brainer. I've even got a buddy with an intake in his closet that should match up with the vortech. Combine this with an overdrive transmission and some intelligent decisions regarding overall weight and I figure I should be sitting pretty. If I could get 14, I'd be happy. 16 would be awesome. 18, downright unrealistic, though I've got a buddy with a similar 2wd setup that pulled off 18mpg every now and then. I've also looked a bit into some of the back-yard fuel improvement techniques, including hydrogen generators and the like, but I've pretty much concluded that it's all snake oil.

The second option I've been looking at, ignoring how blatently unrealistic it may sound, is a diesel transplant. For some reason, I've this obsession with Diesel motors. Well, maybe not an obsession, but it's something I've always wanted to play with. If I could find a comparable diesel to the 350, I could rig up an alternative fuel system utilizing the secondary fuel tank. With a decent setup, I could run anything from Biodiesel, to waste veggie oil, to old motor oil. Obviously this is rife with problems, the first being a motor that would even fit, yet provide enough power to move the rig. Maybe a Mercedes Turbo diesel or the like. Second would be a portable and efficient way to filter the alternative fuels on the go, though I've got a notebook full of sketches, designs, and part numbers that should come together to form a nice system. I've just got to put it into practice. Also, as far as the fuel goes, I know around here (California), you can no longer just cruise out behind City Wok and find jugs of fuel. In some parts of the country, you very much can, but around here it's not really an option.
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Old 10-28-2013, 12:31 PM   #37
xymotic
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Originally Posted by Parepin View Post
Sounds like a plan, then. I don't mind doing some wiring. To be honest, a good chunk of the wiring that's in there now will be stripped out and replaced. 40 years of crimp on splices, speaker wire, and hose clamps make for a trashed appearance and make troubleshooting an absolute shit show. Seriously, it's a mess in there.

Fuel Mileage is very much a concern of mine. It's all a compromise, though. If I'm going with a van, a 350 is the smallest motor i'd consider as anything with less displacement is going to be a danger on the highways. You've gotta be able to get out of your own weight, you know. With that in mind, I figure I've got two options as far as the drivetrain goes.

Keep and rebuild the 350, tune the 4 barrel and swap out the heads with some Vortech ones. I hear this alone will not only give me better mileage, but more power. Vortech heads can be found everywhere, from what I've seen, in every imaginable condition and price. It's kind of a no brainer. I've even got a buddy with an intake in his closet that should match up with the vortech. Combine this with an overdrive transmission and some intelligent decisions regarding overall weight and I figure I should be sitting pretty. If I could get 14, I'd be happy. 16 would be awesome. 18, downright unrealistic, though I've got a buddy with a similar 2wd setup that pulled off 18mpg every now and then. I've also looked a bit into some of the back-yard fuel improvement techniques, including hydrogen generators and the like, but I've pretty much concluded that it's all snake oil.

The second option I've been looking at, ignoring how blatently unrealistic it may sound, is a diesel transplant. For some reason, I've this obsession with Diesel motors. Well, maybe not an obsession, but it's something I've always wanted to play with. If I could find a comparable diesel to the 350, I could rig up an alternative fuel system utilizing the secondary fuel tank. With a decent setup, I could run anything from Biodiesel, to waste veggie oil, to old motor oil. Obviously this is rife with problems, the first being a motor that would even fit, yet provide enough power to move the rig. Maybe a Mercedes Turbo diesel or the like. Second would be a portable and efficient way to filter the alternative fuels on the go, though I've got a notebook full of sketches, designs, and part numbers that should come together to form a nice system. I've just got to put it into practice. Also, as far as the fuel goes, I know around here (California), you can no longer just cruise out behind City Wok and find jugs of fuel. In some parts of the country, you very much can, but around here it's not really an option.
I'm no expert by any means but isn't the 6.2 & 6.5 the exact same block as a 350?

That said, I had a g30 (box van) with a 6.2 and it was a dog. 13mg

I dunno if it's even possible, but hey, while yer dreamin: http://www.4btswaps.com/

Someone sent me that link in the Vans! thread for a mercedes bus project I'm dreaming of. But I think I have more room to deal with :)
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Old 10-28-2013, 12:32 PM   #38
xymotic
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Originally Posted by Parepin View Post
Sounds like a plan, then. I don't mind doing some wiring. To be honest, a good chunk of the wiring that's in there now will be stripped out and replaced. 40 years of crimp on splices, speaker wire, and hose clamps make for a trashed appearance and make troubleshooting an absolute shit show. Seriously, it's a mess in there.

Fuel Mileage is very much a concern of mine. It's all a compromise, though. If I'm going with a van, a 350 is the smallest motor i'd consider as anything with less displacement is going to be a danger on the highways. You've gotta be able to get out of your own weight, you know. With that in mind, I figure I've got two options as far as the drivetrain goes.

Keep and rebuild the 350, tune the 4 barrel and swap out the heads with some Vortech ones. I hear this alone will not only give me better mileage, but more power. Vortech heads can be found everywhere, from what I've seen, in every imaginable condition and price. It's kind of a no brainer. I've even got a buddy with an intake in his closet that should match up with the vortech. Combine this with an overdrive transmission and some intelligent decisions regarding overall weight and I figure I should be sitting pretty. If I could get 14, I'd be happy. 16 would be awesome. 18, downright unrealistic, though I've got a buddy with a similar 2wd setup that pulled off 18mpg every now and then. I've also looked a bit into some of the back-yard fuel improvement techniques, including hydrogen generators and the like, but I've pretty much concluded that it's all snake oil.

The second option I've been looking at, ignoring how blatently unrealistic it may sound, is a diesel transplant. For some reason, I've this obsession with Diesel motors. Well, maybe not an obsession, but it's something I've always wanted to play with. If I could find a comparable diesel to the 350, I could rig up an alternative fuel system utilizing the secondary fuel tank. With a decent setup, I could run anything from Biodiesel, to waste veggie oil, to old motor oil. Obviously this is rife with problems, the first being a motor that would even fit, yet provide enough power to move the rig. Maybe a Mercedes Turbo diesel or the like. Second would be a portable and efficient way to filter the alternative fuels on the go, though I've got a notebook full of sketches, designs, and part numbers that should come together to form a nice system. I've just got to put it into practice. Also, as far as the fuel goes, I know around here (California), you can no longer just cruise out behind City Wok and find jugs of fuel. In some parts of the country, you very much can, but around here it's not really an option.
I'm no expert by any means but isn't the 6.2 & 6.5 the exact same block as a 350?

That said, I had a g30 (box van) with a 6.2 and it was a dog. 13mpg And I swear to god if I ever meet the guy that designed the 6.2 I will hurt him.

I dunno if it's even possible, but hey, while yer dreamin: http://www.4btswaps.com/

Someone sent me that link in the Vans! thread for a mercedes bus project I'm dreaming of. But I think I have more room to deal with :)
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Old 10-28-2013, 12:33 PM   #39
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Originally Posted by xymotic View Post
I'm no expert by any means but isn't the 6.2 & 6.5 the exact same block as a 350?

That said, I had a g30 (box van) with a 6.2 and it was a dog. 13mg

I dunno if it's even possible, but hey, while yer dreamin: http://www.4btswaps.com/

Someone sent me that link in the Vans! thread for a mercedes bus project I'm dreaming of. But I think I have more room to deal with :)

I've played around a bit with the 6.2. I almost bought a military surplus Blazer with the 6.2 in it. Without A-LOT of help (ie, turbo charged), those things are fucking lame. On the plus side, they'll run on straight up urine and pancake syrup.
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Old 10-28-2013, 12:33 PM   #40
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It has 2 too many wheels?
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Old 10-28-2013, 12:44 PM   #41
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I've played around a bit with the 6.2. I almost bought a military surplus Blazer with the 6.2 in it. Without A-LOT of help (ie, turbo charged), those things are fucking lame. On the plus side, they'll run on straight up urine and pancake syrup.
This. The 6.2's are useless dogs.
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Old 10-28-2013, 03:10 PM   #42
Purcell69
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This. The 6.2's are useless dogs.


The 6.5 turbo can be made to be serviceable. The 4BT Cummins could get the job done as well, but it is a very heavy motor. I have considered using one in a build I am playing with, but the added weight and expense vs. what I really need has left me with a gas V-8.

I don't think that 15 MPG is an unrealistic figure on flat ground with a proper tune and OD. Painless Wire Products makes a lock-up harness for the 700R4 and 4L60 that is under $100 and is pretty much plug and play.

Vortec heads are a great upgrade, just be sure you have the proper rocker arms and possibly pushrods, as well as the matching intake. Edelbrock makes a 4bbl Vortec intake. The only other change would be to pick a cam that is heavy on torque and works well at lower RPM. This will give you the most grunt when starting from a stop or rolling along in OD, and the best shot at reasonable fuel economy.

-Joe
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Old 10-28-2013, 03:20 PM   #43
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Killer square tube tie rod.

Nice start to a mobile rape shack you have there
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Old 10-28-2013, 03:40 PM   #44
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Killer square tube tie rod.

Nice start to a mobile rape shack you have there
mmmmm free candy.
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Old 10-28-2013, 03:44 PM   #45
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Not only is the 4BT really heavy, but it vibrates like no tomorrow. Without the right mounts you are looking at quite the shaker. That being said, it's a fantastic diesel and it's easy to get real power from. 4BT swaps . com for all your info there.
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