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Old 12-08-2013, 05:46 PM   #16
cogitate
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Go see another doctor. I broke my arm when I totaled my bike, thought I could leave it heal. MRI showed it was shattered into hundreds of pieces. And it didn't hurt that bad . The scaphoid has little blood supply and a break of it often goes undetected.

A friend of mine left his broken ankle to its own devices, break was MUCH worse than he could have imagined, a decade of intense pain and multiple surgeries later, he still can't move his leg as it should.
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Old 12-08-2013, 06:02 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GearHeadGrrrl View Post

Red flags went up soon as I entered the place- Roof covered in solar cells but still snow and ice on the sidewalk leading in.
Any advice?
Go on back to him and fall as you walk up his unshoveled sidewalk....
Terribly unsafe conditions for his patients....

You might end up owning the joint

Hope you heal fast!
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Old 12-08-2013, 07:00 PM   #18
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2nd opinion

I would definitely get a second opinion, the sooner the better. Get a copy of your xray, it is your property. Most places will burn it to a disc for free or nominal fee or a hard copy might cost a few bucks. Go to the nearest teaching hospital ER or ortho clinic. It doesn't sound too bad and for a closed reduction you may only need numbed up at the least or conscious sedation at the most. I would not, like you be pulled into the first ortho office, just because it is close. Unless you are over 50 or have a heart condition you do not need the EKG. He is trying to feather his nest if you do not fit those categories. Good luck
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Old 12-09-2013, 01:58 PM   #19
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So nobody here can see your fracture, you don't know what is really broken, but I can assure you there are some type of fractures that need to be taken care of, surgically or otherwise or you might have a problem that stays with you. So I'm not saying you should go along with the first proposition, but do have somebody knowledgeable look at it and the X-Ray.
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Old 12-09-2013, 02:00 PM   #20
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The EKG is a prerequisite for surgery.

Like others I would get a second opinion, but I would not be surprised if surgery was the right thing to do.

I had a get-off a couple years ago and broke my left hand. I saw a hotshot surgeon and the first thing he did was schedule me for surgery. I also broke a bone in the right hand and we debated surgery - he said I would probably develop arthritis if I didn't. I didn't, and two years later I have arthritis in the right hand... The left hand BTW is great, and I was back on my dirtbike within a couple months.
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Old 12-09-2013, 03:27 PM   #21
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I agree on getting a second doctor to look at it. I think getting something like this fixed correctly is very important, as long as it is with a doctor you like.

For an idea of time and expense (one example, your experience may be different)...

I broke my throttle wrist September 8 of this year when a car ran out in front of me. I hit the car at 55 and was "totally ejected" as the police report states. Broken right radius just above the wrist (along with two cracked ribs, sprained knee, sprained clutch hand, and bruised balls). Bike and car both totaled. Had surgery same day to install a metal plate. Got a replacement bike right away (arranged from the Denver airport as I travelled home from where the crash happened), but was not able to ride it until October 16 when I rode all the way down to my local neighborhood coffee shop. I did physical therapy for about a month, which I do believe helped. In November I made a 620 mile day ride, and a 710 mile day ride, without any issues other than stiffness (it was a bit cold). Range of motion is a little reduced (-20%), but is still better than the motion my drinking buddies in their 70s have. Strength is not what it was, but continues to get better. They said 6-12 months before full strength would be back. It was about 6 weeks before I could ride, and 8-10 weeks before I could make some longish day rides. I am 38, if age factors into speed of healing.

Medical bills are over $40k, but they include two ambulances, two hospitals, sheriff and fire department responses, X-Rays of many parts, and an MRI and other fancy testing you shouldn't need. The actual surgery came to about $12k, and I am glad I had it done! I didn't have a lot of choice as the broken bone was pushing out, but the recovery was fast and I am back to riding.

Unfortunately, surgery is no guarantee you will not develop arthritis. My break goes into the actual joint, so the docs told me I could for sure count on arthritis later in life. My doctor let me shoot an iPhone pic of the X-Ray on the monitor, saving me a few bucks for the CD. And no, the plate is not a functioning bottle opener (I know how you ADV people think!).



Good luck as you decide what to do next. The winter months would be better for recovering from a surgery than the summer riding months! IMO you should go get a second medical opinion, but with a different doctor than the first one you saw.

TheRoss screwed with this post 12-09-2013 at 03:54 PM
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Old 12-09-2013, 03:51 PM   #22
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The point is, the knife man never clearly explained WHY the OP needs surgery. Before anyone agrees to a surgical procedure, this should be absolutely clear to the patient, unless it's a matter of life and death. I've known too many people that have gone in for "simple" surgeries, and have spent months recovering from the complications. Antibiotic resistant strains of bacteria are simply too common to take surgery lightly. Surgeons tend to think the only option is the knife, and ignore less invasive options.

My son's life was saved by an emergency surgery a few years ago. Because of complications, he was in the hospital for a month. In this case, the initial surgery and the two subsequent ones were necessary. He just had his 13th birthday, and I'm forever thankful he was there to join us for it.

However, I've seen too many people go in for simple procedures and take months or longer recovering from complications. One gal I know is an avid runner. She when in for orthrascopic surgery on her knee. She was up and walking three days later. However, a staph infection set in which took her months to recover.

It's extremely important to know what you are paying for, and why.
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Old 12-09-2013, 04:39 PM   #23
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5 days post injury, doin' OK

No bits o' bone stickin' out and a digits still working, though I don't push it.

Still haven't seen another Dr., and let me explain why... Orthopedic surgery is a boom business around here, and they've got the fleecing down to an art. I'm in the Sioux Falls TV market, and there are 3 different orthopedic clinics advertising on TV, all promising quick treatment and they all have shiny new buildings. The "hotshot" doc I saw is still small time by comparison, doesn't even have a TV ad yet. And I suspect that no matter how simple a fracture you walk in with, you and your insurance company will end up with at least a $10k bill. Pretty atrocious considering that setting broken bones has been part of the skill set of every physician for over a century...

And even if I can't work a clutch in the spring, my $3k share of the bill goes a long way towards the cost of Honda's new 700 twin with the automated manual transmission.
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Old 12-09-2013, 04:59 PM   #24
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I crashed my dirt bike back in July . Pushed my left hand up and on top of left wrist. Went to the ER, was lucky, no surgery, hand/wrist was reset, all is well. These are the types of injuries you pay for ins. to protect you. USE IT. Get a 2nd opinion, whatever it takes but get it taken care of. Or spend the rest of your life with limited mobility/use/pain.
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Old 12-09-2013, 06:22 PM   #25
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Wish it was that simple...

I went to urgent care, all they did was take x-rays, give me a splint, and refer me across the street to the hotshot specialist in his Taj Mahal surgery center. They don't set fractures around here, there's more profit in doing surgeries and installing hardware.

I get 3 free clinic visits a year, and after that have to pay a thousand dollars until the insurance kicks in and covers 80%. So even if I drive 180 miles to my HMO's clinic, I've got just one paid clinic visit left. First of the year and the counter is reset, and I've switched to a zero deductable 10% copay plan.
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Old 12-09-2013, 09:13 PM   #26
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Eek

Quote:
Originally Posted by GearHeadGrrrl View Post
I went to urgent care, all they did was take x-rays, give me a splint, and refer me across the street to the hotshot specialist in his Taj Mahal surgery center. They don't set fractures around here, there's more profit in doing surgeries and installing hardware.

I get 3 free clinic visits a year, and after that have to pay a thousand dollars until the insurance kicks in and covers 80%. So even if I drive 180 miles to my HMO's clinic, I've got just one paid clinic visit left. First of the year and the counter is reset, and I've switched to a zero deductable 10% copay plan.
The major risk of waiting is that things may start to knit incorrectly. If that happens, it normally means that the bones will have to be re-broken so that they can be properly re-aligned and set. I'm not a doctor, but have broken plenty of bones and seen many more broken on race days.

The best thing you can do it seek expert advice.
Hope it all works out for you.
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Old 12-10-2013, 05:50 AM   #27
TheRoss
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Bones grow back together quickly. The docs all told me that after about 6 weeks the bone and plate would be one and I couldn't hurt it again (unless I completely broke it again). So.... while I understand your reasons for waiting, your breaks may start to grow back together in a less than ideal way over the next few weeks.

You asked for opinions, and you are getting them. But... I have not read an opinion from a doctor. Is there an Ortho in the house who could chime in here?

I really hope this works out well for you in the end. And I am thankful you didn't break something like your hip in the fall!
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Old 12-10-2013, 09:33 AM   #28
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Get a second Opinion for sure.

Keep in mind that up until recently fractures generally went untreated.
Im sure many people have had mild breaks and wrote it off as a sprain.
I know a logger who apparently broke his elbow at some point and it was not found until years late in a cat scan for a different injury.

According to the New England journal of Medicine Doctors misdiagnose 50 percent of the time and do unnecessary surgery 30 percent of the time.

Dont be afraid of a third opinion as well, despite what I said remember being able to be mobile in the future is a very important thing, arguably the most important.
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Old 12-10-2013, 02:55 PM   #29
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I broke my left wrist crashing my 525 EXC last December 9, distal radius fracture, broken in 2 places. I hiked out of the woods, as I thought (rightly as it turned out) that trying to ride the bike out may have knocked bits out of place worse then they already were. X-ray & CT scan showed that everything stayed almost were it was supposed to be, one piece of bone was displaced about 1 1/2MM, not enough to open me up. And no "setting" was required at all.Thing is, the Ortho was suspect of just the x-ray and wanted the CT scan, which showed the other broken bit that the x-ray DIDN'T. He wanted me to see a hand specialist to be sure. And Hand Doc said the displaced bit wasn't "out" enough to warrant cutting me open. Good News!
Unless your Doc is a hand specialist, I'd be wary of his opinion.
I went to Re-hab exactly twice. All they did was bend my wrist more than they thought I'd do myself. ROM ain't what it used to be, strength is back to where it was before, and the other riders I've talked to since all tell me the same thing....................it'll be a LOOOONG time before it feels like nothing ever happened.
Get it looked at again..................QUICK! I was upset that I had to wait almost a week to see the hand doc knowing just how quick bones start to knit.

Good Luck!
Chris
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Old 12-10-2013, 04:00 PM   #30
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I would recommend that you go back to or call the Urgent Care Clinic that you first visited and ask them for a copy of your X-ray and explanation of what is broken. Or call the Hot Shot Doc back and ask if he can explain the break and the need for surgery vs a cast or splint setting to correct. Or the pros and cons of each. As some others have said the scaphoid bone can be very difficult to get to heal properly in those that smoke or those of us that are beyond or teens or twenties ar there is little blood supply to some of these bones in the wrist. My understanding is a break in the radius or ulna just below your wrist will heal quicker and easier then
one of the smaller bones that is in your wrist primarily due to blood flow/supply. It is also easier to immobolize the longer bones in your forearm then some of these smaller ones in the wrist.

So in summary I would push for those that have already been paid to evaluate or confirm the break to provide you with more complete information about your injury and the pros and cons of multiple options to address this. Then hopefully you can better evaluate your options or collect more information on the specific break that you have.

I have experience a few broken bones in my life. I have never had an issue with them healing until I broke my scaphoid about a year ago. I went through several months with a few different casts and ultimately had to have surgery done to get a proper union of the broken scaphoid bone pieces.
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