ADVrider

Go Back   ADVrider > Bikes > Orange Crush
User Name
Password
Register Inmates Photos Site Rules Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 12-16-2013, 08:00 AM   #1
COXR650L OP
Beastly Adventurer
 
COXR650L's Avatar
 
Joined: Nov 2009
Location: Denver
Oddometer: 1,359
950 resurrection, aka I have a lot of ongoing questions??

I wanted to use this thread to document the overhaul of my 2004 950, and have a place to ask questions throughout the rebuild. I have done a lot of engine work before on thumpers/cars but never on an LC8 so I wanted to use this thread to document what Im doing, and most importantly, as a running thread to post questions before I royally screw something up

The goal is to completely go through the bike, within reason (not spending a ton of $) and make it a good reliable bike for many more miles to come.


A little about the bike:
I have always wanted a 950, and fortunately this summer inmate Tha Rick, sold me his 2004 for a great price. It's a high milage bike (75k+ now) and I knew it would need some work eventually. I rode it all summer and had a blast but did identify some issues so this winter the engine will be getting pulled. To make it more interesting some pictures from this summer on the 950.....

In May on the Canyonlands ADV Ride I never thought I'd have a 950 a few weeks later....


Around camp Tha Rick told me about this and a few weeks later I was test riding my soon to be 950...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tha Rick View Post
Some serious negotiations also happened during the ride.

The atmosphere was so tense you could taste the brat's cooking, the tensions were almost unbearable as I yearned for a hottub, and the taste of the ice cream sandwich earlier were all but a memory, but with the good nature of mankind, we persevered through.

The deliberation's- "Would you like a 950A? It's a mechanic's special!...--- OK, send me a PM"
We toasted to a deal like diplomat's.

Someone likes drinking the coolaid, brisk mountain rides, and picturesque scenery.

A bit of the test ride:





He has a bright future indeed, gonna need sunglasses.
I was stoked to have one of my dream bikes

Throughout the summer I did several overnight trips off the bike including scouting for Westfest around Buena Vista....




and over the Flat Tops and around Dinosaur National Monument...



a little mishap. Turns out riding with hard side cases requires a little more forethought when riding through rocks Nothing like the first crash on a new bike....






And there were a lot of short day rides....




Known issues
After getting some miles in I feel these are the known problems...
-Leaking oil, I believe base gasket on back cylinder
-Oil getting into coolant. Maybe water pump, maybe head gasket????
-Lacks power. Even with a 16CS it is almost impossible to get the front end up. PO told me it had a jet kit, but I feel it is lean and pops on decell.
-Replump faucet ful pump. Lines are corroded.
-New coolant hoses


The rebuild

I plan on pulling the engine. Do you guys think I can get away with lapping the valves? Not rebuilding the heads would save a ton of many. Is that reasonable at 75k miles???


Here is what I am looking at ordering in the next few months.

-Coolant Hoses. THinking about this KIT

-Piston rings. Hopefully will reuse the pistons.

-Engine gasket kit. I was going to use an Athena Kit like this ONE

-Water pump. I am torn between the CJs kit vs a new updated KTM one. What do you guys think? GIven money is tight is it worth an extra $100 or so for the CJ's one??


Updates to be checked What else am I missing????
-Clutch Push Rod
-Shift Drum

Any thing else I should be considering. Input, advice etc. Thanks for the help so far......
Ben
__________________
Dubinky.com Enduro, Trail, Dual-Sport and Adventure Riding Apparel.

Westfest 2013
Canyonlands Adventure Ride

COXR650L screwed with this post 12-16-2013 at 12:51 PM
COXR650L is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-16-2013, 08:23 AM   #2
MortimerSickle
Semi-Adventurer
 
MortimerSickle's Avatar
 
Joined: Dec 2005
Location: Rainville, Orygun, where moss is a road hazard.
Oddometer: 11,592
Glad to see you got the fastest color.
__________________


I miss round headlights.

"When I was a young man, I liked to race my horse...." -
G.H.W.S. 1878-1962
MortimerSickle is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-16-2013, 09:05 AM   #3
Dan Diego
Studly Adventurer
 
Joined: Dec 2010
Location: San Diego, CA
Oddometer: 623
Will be watching this thread as I recently picked up the same bike, albeit a fewer miles on the ODO.

I'm ashamed to say I watched that entire video. Sad that the tires never got off the pavement! But the photos of the following ride were encouraging.

A couple of things I'd recommend--and I intend to do these mods as well:

1. The CJ oil sump drain kit. $75 and it'll make oil changes that much easier.

2. The crash bar bolt mods to enable easier access without fear of stripping the base bolts.

Both mods are covered on ADV.

Let's see what ya got!
__________________
Triumph Rocket III Touring, KTM 990 ADV

When I finished high school, I wanted to take all my graduation money and buy myself a motorcycle. But my mom said no. See, she had a brother who died in a horrible motorcycle accident when he was 18. And I could just have his motorcycle.
Dan Diego is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-16-2013, 09:08 AM   #4
bikyto
Dans le doute...gaz!
 
bikyto's Avatar
 
Joined: Jun 2009
Location: Northern Cali
Oddometer: 2,128
+1 on the coolant hoses from Samco
CJdesigns sells them too

We'll be here to help you along and enjoy your rebuild
__________________
The race is long and, in the end, it's only with yourself...
bikyto is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-16-2013, 09:20 AM   #5
effensteve
Enjoying the ride
 
effensteve's Avatar
 
Joined: Feb 2010
Location: The far east (of Oregon)
Oddometer: 540
Keep this thread updated, just picked up mine about 6 weeks ago. Though is has about 65k less on the clock than yours. I'm always interested to see what others are working on
effensteve is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-16-2013, 09:35 AM   #6
DirtyADV
Beastly Adventurer
 
DirtyADV's Avatar
 
Joined: Jan 2007
Location: SWEDEN, Skellefteċ
Oddometer: 1,884
ARRRGH stupid computer at work, removed all I had written!!!!

I would start with making sure its the base gaskets and not just the oil pressure sensor that is more common to leak.

If there is leak at base gasket(s), mine was just leaking from the rear but was damage on the engine cases near the front also.

Called the problem "Pyndon Syndrome" since he was the first I saw writing about the problem.

But the question is how much to invest in a high mileage engine? I choose to just lift the jugs with piston in them and head attached, some sealant and new base gaskets, slapped it togehter and plan to run it until it dies!

Will be a streetmachine with motard wheels from now on.

And bought a brand new 990R that will be the gravel eater.

If you go deep into the engine, splitting cases, shift drum is a weak spot on early LC8 engines.

Small stuff like balancer shaft seal might be good to add a new if digging into the engine.

Check cam chains for wear?

Clutch push rod if it has the old 3 piece part still?

/Johan
__________________
Have changed name, was previously Dirty950

www.dirtyadv.com (under construction)
DirtyADV is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-16-2013, 11:34 AM   #7
COXR650L OP
Beastly Adventurer
 
COXR650L's Avatar
 
Joined: Nov 2009
Location: Denver
Oddometer: 1,359
Thanks guys for the support!


DirtADV.....
Thanks for the feedback. I forgot all about updates. I am going to edit the first post with possible updates. I will start will looking at:
-Clutch Pushrod. I may consider shift drum as well as long as they are not too much $$$

What other engine updates should I look at to see if they have been done?


I have already replaced the balancer shaft seal after I first got the bike.

Thanks for the cam chain suggestion I will be adding that to the list

I have replaced the oil pressure sending unit. I am 90% sure the oil is from the base gasket. I found that post about the Pyndon Syndrome when I was trying to diagnose it. It seems to match about what mine is doing





I cant afford a new bike for a long while so I would rather get as many RELIABLE miles as possible out of this. I really feel the bottom end is robust in most modern engines so if I address the top end I really think I could get another 75k out of it. Still runs good, just some issues that require the engine to be pulled so I may as well fix as much as I can.

I will also be:
-checking wheel bearing
-swing arm bearing
-steering stem bearing
-electrical connectors/dialetic grease
-true wheels


Thanks guys keep it coming. Any idea of the condition of the heads for people that have had higher mileage engines apart?? That could be a big expenses and I am trying to get a budget figured out.
__________________
Dubinky.com Enduro, Trail, Dual-Sport and Adventure Riding Apparel.

Westfest 2013
Canyonlands Adventure Ride
COXR650L is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-16-2013, 11:47 AM   #8
MortimerSickle
Semi-Adventurer
 
MortimerSickle's Avatar
 
Joined: Dec 2005
Location: Rainville, Orygun, where moss is a road hazard.
Oddometer: 11,592
Quote:
Originally Posted by COXR650L View Post
...
Any idea of the condition of the heads for people that have had higher mileage engines apart??
...
I don't remember what all was discussed in this thread, but you should find it interesting, in any case. http://www.advrider.com/forums/showt...ight=100%2C000
__________________


I miss round headlights.

"When I was a young man, I liked to race my horse...." -
G.H.W.S. 1878-1962
MortimerSickle is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-16-2013, 12:48 PM   #9
COXR650L OP
Beastly Adventurer
 
COXR650L's Avatar
 
Joined: Nov 2009
Location: Denver
Oddometer: 1,359
Quote:
Originally Posted by MortimerSickle View Post
I don't remember what all was discussed in this thread, but you should find it interesting, in any case. http://www.advrider.com/forums/showt...ight=100%2C000
Thanks for the link, Ill read through it. 100k's pretty good!



One more thing I forgot to ask.....Any special tools for LC8s Ill need?

THanks
__________________
Dubinky.com Enduro, Trail, Dual-Sport and Adventure Riding Apparel.

Westfest 2013
Canyonlands Adventure Ride
COXR650L is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-16-2013, 12:59 PM   #10
DirtyADV
Beastly Adventurer
 
DirtyADV's Avatar
 
Joined: Jan 2007
Location: SWEDEN, Skellefteċ
Oddometer: 1,884
Quote:
Originally Posted by COXR650L View Post
Thanks for the link, Ill read through it. 100k's pretty good!



One more thing I forgot to ask.....Any special tools for LC8s Ill need?

THanks
For flywheel removal there is a grub screw and an extractor needed.

Not sure about sizes right now but can check later if no one else can fill in.

(Was the same bolt to pull the flywheel of the XR400 but that was smaller bolt holding it in place to no grub screw required, that was lucky =)

If you have a local source for metric bolts that is probably cheaper then buying the OEM tools.

For locking the engine I went with OEM for peace of mind when locking engine for undoing stuff, started with just a pointed threaded rod for locking it during valve adjustments but worried if it would break when undoing stuff during camchain replacement.

If doing a case split some big sockets will be required.

Is it a 14mm allen needed for flywheel bolt? Think it is and 12mm for the shock mounting bolts, might be bigger then what the average garage have.

Im sure I am missing someting, and I have not gone as far as a split, but I am worried about the shift drum, would suck having that fail since I just plan to run it with minimal maintenance until it dies on me.

/Johan
__________________
Have changed name, was previously Dirty950

www.dirtyadv.com (under construction)
DirtyADV is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-16-2013, 12:59 PM   #11
MortimerSickle
Semi-Adventurer
 
MortimerSickle's Avatar
 
Joined: Dec 2005
Location: Rainville, Orygun, where moss is a road hazard.
Oddometer: 11,592
Quote:
Originally Posted by COXR650L View Post
...
One more thing I forgot to ask.....Any special tools for LC8s Ill need?
...
Crank locking bolt. Some guys make them, but they don't cost much.

There is also some kind of clutch holding tool, but I just put the transmission in gear, and set the rear brake instead.

Flywheel puller, if you get into that.

Edit: DirtyADV's post reminded me that I already had the engine back in the bike when I did this. I guess it would be a little hard to use the brake trick on the bench.
__________________


I miss round headlights.

"When I was a young man, I liked to race my horse...." -
G.H.W.S. 1878-1962

MortimerSickle screwed with this post 12-16-2013 at 01:18 PM
MortimerSickle is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-16-2013, 01:05 PM   #12
DirtyADV
Beastly Adventurer
 
DirtyADV's Avatar
 
Joined: Jan 2007
Location: SWEDEN, Skellefteċ
Oddometer: 1,884
Quote:
Originally Posted by MortimerSickle View Post
Crank locking bolt. Some guys make them, but they don't cost much.

There is also some kind of clutch holding tool, but I just put the transmission in gear, and set the rear brake instead.

Flywheel puller, if you get into that.
TOOO SLOOOOOOOOOW!!!

Never used a clutch holding tool, gear or pennie between sprockets:

Some tips on locking stuff up from me working on the XR400 engine:





Bolt for pulling flywheel can be seen here, its like a fine thread M20 or something, it the same as the LC8 needs but a grub screw i needed, M12? As said before can measure them up if needed:

EDIT: Grubscrew is M16 with a 2 mm thread pitch and puller bolt a M20 with 1,5mm thread pitch.



/Johan
__________________
Have changed name, was previously Dirty950

www.dirtyadv.com (under construction)

DirtyADV screwed with this post 12-18-2013 at 06:07 AM
DirtyADV is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-16-2013, 06:48 PM   #13
Scribe
£Bob£
 
Scribe's Avatar
 
Joined: Nov 2004
Location: In my natural state
Oddometer: 6,449
Looking forward to reading about your refresh. I have he same bike with 50k and its staying in my garage.
__________________
"Do or do not. There is no 'try.'"
— Yoda
Scribe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-16-2013, 09:23 PM   #14
VxZeroKnots
Beastly Adventurer
 
VxZeroKnots's Avatar
 
Joined: Jun 2008
Location: Durango CO
Oddometer: 2,372
Ben,

I have a 950 which is getting some winter loving too, we should do some big bike rides when they are both all better!

Drew
__________________
I say we take off and nuke the entire site from orbit. It's the only way to be sure

No bike does everything perfectly. In fact, no bike does anything until someone gets on it to ride.

VxZeroKnots is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-17-2013, 06:21 AM   #15
COXR650L OP
Beastly Adventurer
 
COXR650L's Avatar
 
Joined: Nov 2009
Location: Denver
Oddometer: 1,359
Quote:
Originally Posted by VxZeroKnots View Post
Ben,

I have a 950 which is getting some winter loving too, we should do some big bike rides when they are both all better!

Drew

Hey Drew,

Ya that would be a good time. Although if Im trying to keep up with you a small bike sound a lot more fun Im thinking about doing a spring ride around Rabbit Valley, White Wash and TT, Monkey Butt style, you interested

Anyway back on track for the big bikes what all are you doing to your's this winter?


I ordered a valve spring compressor last night so Im starting to move forward. I have a DR350 I need to get back together and am using the proceeds from its sale to fund the 950 rebuild. Hopefully I will get the engine pulled by the 1st and see what all I need to order.

I was looking at parts diagrams last night and did not realize the 950 uses standard auto style bearing for the crank and rods. I was thinking it was going to be roller or ball bearing so I should probably split the case and replace those correct?. I dont know for sure but it seems roller/ball bearing on the crank and rods are more reliable????

I am also going to replace the shift fork roller bearing and probably the shift drum as well as check specs on oil pumps etc once the cases are split. $100 for the shift drum is not too bad so might as well seeing its an update.....


I really hope the pistons/jugs and heads are in good shape. Like most things this will cost more than I expected but if those items need replacing it will really drive up the cost

DirtyAdv thanks for the pics!

Thanks guys
__________________
Dubinky.com Enduro, Trail, Dual-Sport and Adventure Riding Apparel.

Westfest 2013
Canyonlands Adventure Ride

COXR650L screwed with this post 12-17-2013 at 06:29 AM
COXR650L is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Share

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

.
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump


Times are GMT -7.   It's 09:56 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.5
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ADVrider 2011-2014