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Old 12-26-2013, 04:57 PM   #16
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There would seem to be very little to change about a scooter while still keeping it a scooter. Every scooter I have owned has functioned just fine. There is one change I would like to see that I would call revolutionary. In the beginning, most scooters had manual transmissions. Now they have CVT transmissions. I think the next step should be a true automatic transmission, like the DCT, which would eliminate the belt, rollers, and other wear parts, and hopefully provide a wider gear range. While some of the large displacement scooter/motorcycle hybrids already have something like this, I would like to see it on small displacement scooters. It would likely increase the cost to begin with, but in the long run, it should not be any more expensive. It would eliminate constant parts replacement, and should make for a much longer lasting scooter in general.
I am a little apprehensive as a result of the recommendations I have been getting. This is a one owner scooter with 12,000 miles. A lot of parts are being brought into question, and I am going to start removing things and inspecting them. 12,000 miles is not a lot of mileage. I really don't expect I will have to replace all this stuff, but better to check it out. The belt looks quite clean and sound, but I measured the width, and it is worn down to 16mm, so a new one is on its way. I am fortunate to have bought the needed service tools long ago, and the shop manual.
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Old 12-26-2013, 05:47 PM   #17
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A CVT is a very simple device. I found everything on mine to be fine, with over twice the mileage, other than the broken belt, which is why I tore it down in the first place. Even the clutch was fine. I took the opportunity to put grease on all the parts of the rear pulley that needed it. The problem with older scooters seems to be a lack of parts availability. While looking on cheapcycleparts.com for Aero 125 parts, I found that most of the oem CVT parts were no longer available. You can get complete aftermarket variators for many late model scooters, but I don't know about the older ones.
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Old 12-27-2013, 06:47 AM   #18
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I have been advised to replace my rollers with sliders. The rollers seem to be in good shape, round and smooth. The sliders are new to me. I would appreciate advice on this.
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Old 12-27-2013, 10:46 AM   #19
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Originally Posted by scootrboi View Post
I have been advised to replace my rollers with sliders. The rollers seem to be in good shape, round and smooth. The sliders are new to me. I would appreciate advice on this.
Don't fix what is not broken.
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Old 12-27-2013, 10:59 AM   #20
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Don't fix what is not broken.
On taking all the parts out of the variator and cleaning them, I find the rollers are in need of replacement, along with three broken roller spacers. Also, I find no definitive reference for how much they weigh. So I used a small scale I have. The six rollers weigh 95g. total, and I checked the scale with 95cc of water. Looks like the rollers are 16g.
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Old 12-27-2013, 11:02 AM   #21
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Don't fix what is not broken.

I have to agree. I have never used sliders, but know what they are. My rollers work fine. I believe the only time to make changes is when you are not satisfied with what you have, and have a specific goal in mind when you make a change.

16g seems a bit heavy. I believe my Yamaha 125s use 12g rollers. But if the variator was designed for 16g rollers, they would work just fine. I hope you can find new rollers that size. And the spacers.
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JerryH screwed with this post 12-27-2013 at 11:09 AM
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Old 12-27-2013, 11:18 AM   #22
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Reminds me of the old phrase, Just because you can do something doesn't necessarily mean you should do it.

I so agree...
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Old 12-27-2013, 12:18 PM   #23
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I so agree...
Well I ordered the sliders and I will let you know how they work!
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Old 12-28-2013, 08:14 AM   #24
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The biggest change I see in scooter design (that has not been mentioned yet) is moving the fuel tank from over the engine to in between the riders feet. That, together with turning the cylinder from vertical to horizontal, made the wheelbase longer. It also freed up a large luggage storage space under the seat, and that's a big deal to me. The difference between an 85-88 Honda CH250 and an 89-90 CH250 is amazing. In later years Honda made the Helix, with an upright engine and storage way back and higher up, and a Reflex, horizontal engine and internal storage. To me there's no doubt the newer design is better.
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Old 12-29-2013, 08:15 AM   #25
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The biggest change I see in scooter design (that has not been mentioned yet) is moving the fuel tank from over the engine to in between the riders feet. That, together with turning the cylinder from vertical to horizontal, made the wheelbase longer. It also freed up a large luggage storage space under the seat, and that's a big deal to me. The difference between an 85-88 Honda CH250 and an 89-90 CH250 is amazing. In later years Honda made the Helix, with an upright engine and storage way back and higher up, and a Reflex, horizontal engine and internal storage. To me there's no doubt the newer design is better.
Has this layout been adopted for the smaller scooters (smaller than the Reflex)? Does the Elite 110 have a longer wheel base than the old Elites?
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Old 12-29-2013, 08:36 AM   #26
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Originally Posted by JerryH View Post
There would seem to be very little to change about a scooter while still keeping it a scooter. Every scooter I have owned has functioned just fine. There is one change I would like to see that I would call revolutionary. In the beginning, most scooters had manual transmissions. Now they have CVT transmissions. I think the next step should be a true automatic transmission, like the DCT, which would eliminate the belt, rollers, and other wear parts, and hopefully provide a wider gear range. While some of the large displacement scooter/motorcycle hybrids already have something like this, I would like to see it on small displacement scooters. It would likely increase the cost to begin with, but in the long run, it should not be any more expensive. It would eliminate constant parts replacement, and should make for a much longer lasting scooter in general.
I totally agree. That is just one reason I want the Honda Integra, the DCT!! Man, I hope it arrive here in the U.S. soon!
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Old 12-29-2013, 09:22 AM   #27
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Originally Posted by scootrboi View Post
Well I ordered the sliders and I will let you know how they work!
Did you get lighter sliders than the stock rollers? If not, you may not get the advantage of the sliders. I think many people go about 10% lighter.
Also, they have a certain orientation in which they must be installed. Look at the picture on the container they come in.
I have sliders in both of my Reflexes, along with a inner variator face from a Big Ruckus Honda. The ruckus face has all equal ramps, as opposed to the two-stage face on the reflex. I've tried both rollers and sliders with this setup. The sliders give great acceleration, and allow the scooter to cruise at lower rpms at high speeds.
If your sliders end up being too heavy, they are fairly easy to lighten if you have a gram scale.
Hey! It's all fun and a great learning experience.
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Old 12-29-2013, 10:32 AM   #28
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Originally Posted by bikeridermark View Post
Did you get lighter sliders than the stock rollers? If not, you may not get the advantage of the sliders. I think many people go about 10% lighter.
Also, they have a certain orientation in which they must be installed. Look at the picture on the container they come in.
I have sliders in both of my Reflexes, along with a inner variator face from a Big Ruckus Honda. The ruckus face has all equal ramps, as opposed to the two-stage face on the reflex. I've tried both rollers and sliders with this setup. The sliders give great acceleration, and allow the scooter to cruise at lower rpms at high speeds.
If your sliders end up being too heavy, they are fairly easy to lighten if you have a gram scale.
Hey! It's all fun and a great learning experience.
One helpful change is that there will be very little grease in the CVT if I have to go in again soon.
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Old 12-29-2013, 12:31 PM   #29
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One helpful change is that there will be very little grease in the CVT if I have to go in again soon.
You don't have to mess with the driven end at all to change rollers/sliders.
Shouldn't be ANY grease near the drive end.
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