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Old 01-13-2014, 08:04 PM   #31
KASUYAHO
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JCR / American Honda to DAKAR ?
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Old 01-13-2014, 08:15 PM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Baja Dad View Post
The TRUTH HURTS !!!!!!


Roger Norman HATES the bikes.


heard in the wind that the Hefei's in Baja Don't like Roger
and his contracts with San Felipe and Ensenada have Expired
anybody have any hard info????
San Flippy is governed by Ensenada. Not an Ejido but more like a county like government. Apparently there is more of a problem with Oscar than Roger and a local newpaper is on the rampage against Oscar.
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Old 01-13-2014, 09:45 PM   #33
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Originally Posted by Baja Dad View Post
He was the first guy let go!
Ha. I really should stop posting in the racing forum.

Thanks for straightening me out.
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Old 01-13-2014, 09:47 PM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Strong Bad View Post
San Flippy is governed by Ensenada. Not an Ejido but more like a county like government. Apparently there is more of a problem with Oscar than Roger and a local newpaper is on the rampage against Oscar.
Actually, SF is part of Mexicali...
And stop spreading smack about Oscar. Chilango attorney's are cool man.
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Old 01-13-2014, 11:58 PM   #35
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I'm thinking a three or four bike team to Rally on HRC bikes
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Old 01-14-2014, 07:44 AM   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scotty Breauxman View Post
Actually, SF is part of Mexicali...
And stop spreading smack about Oscar. Chilango attorney's are cool man.
You are right, my bad. I thought Mexicali stopped up by Hwy 3 but apparently it stops down around the SF airport. Ensenada wraps around San Flippy and goes south all the way to BCS. I'm ah huge fan of Oscar Ramos, but apparently not everyone is.
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Old 01-14-2014, 10:00 AM   #37
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This is what I heard exactly Baja Dad...

Any team that wants to continue will need to buy insurance. Can you imagine that conversation with a broker? And that bird ride is relatively cheap!

Dean has also said he is out since Honda isn't there to beat. Caselli's death surely has something to do with Dean's decision and SCORE's decision also.

That leaves the SoCal offroad racing community (the largest in the world) without a real race in Baja (spare me the drivel about the Baja Rally as rally style events have been tried in Baja and the US with cars and for bikes and they never work and younger generations are moving away from burning fossils for fun - those are the facts.) I don't hear anyone talking about doing a rally instead of the 1000. Perhaps that will change. I'd like to see more rally's (I've done a few and they were fun) and more interest in that here in the USA but I don't see any facts or trends to suggest that is more than my wish. And the rally style is really 180 different from the racing that has historically been done in SoCal; fastest anywhere, few rules, little structure, aimed at working class people and machines. There are plenty of competent guys on here with well equipped rally style bikes but are they gonna risk totaling that in Mexico for a rally story? Yes, I know this is a negative view about the Baja Rally and anytime anything negative is posted those involved with the Baja Rally come out and flame away so pile on you two...


After the debacle that was Caselli's death many of the old timers were talking about how the race had outgrown the location and the course and I think that has been under-mentioned in all this. Norman has been pretty upfront about turning SCORE into an F1 style Trophy Truck race sans the annoying stuff Sal liked to do, like make it about the racers.

And the loss of Honda pits is a huge blow. Baja Pits is the completely incompetent (though the guys in the actual pits are pretty good guys trying the best they can) and they are constantly screwing up everything including their promised locations.

Perhaps the races go back to privateer efforts. I don't see that happening because the costs and the insurance and the population growth and development in Baja.

I don't see JCR as a good fit for Honda's Dakar effort for alot of reasons. And American Honda has been pulling money out of JCR since it started but Johnny always comes up with a way to do it because he is a winner and winners find a way. Like getting the Rockstar sponsorship in Baja and charging for Honda Pits and so forth. I just don't think the SCORE series sold many bikes. I mean, look at the XR650R. That is the lesson for Honda. They built the only purpose driven SoCal/Baja/Nevada desert racing bike ever and sales were dreadful despite huge penetration with their marketing message about the King of Baja or whatever. Half were sold into the SoCal area. Many/most dealers outside SoCal traded theirs (Ogilvie made every dealer take one XR650R) for something they could sell. So what is the lesson there for Honda management who, I assume, are judged on motorcycle sales? And how is winning any rally on a derivative of their 10 year old SX/MX 450 gonna help Honda sell their adventure bike in the USA? I don't see many scenarios where any of this is worth Honda's time and that is made more obvious because Kawi has pulled out of nearly all support for offroad and they are now #1 in motorcycle sales. KTM has used their smallness to go after niche markets and is now #1 in offroad bikes (not sure about any profitability there for them) but companies the size of Honda cannot act like niche bike manufacturers and win; the bigger a company is the higher the bar on what is worth their time. Moreso when a billion Chinese and another billion Indians want pizza bikes.

And I think Honda is behind the ball with offroad racing in the west in general. KTM has Blaise, Kawi has Precision Concepts, Husky has Ty, but Honda has been pretty focused on SCORE so a refocus on the US West will be a real effort. They could start a program of developing Honda's Adventure 700 into a rally winner but who would pay for all that development?

My advice is that if you want this test then do the V2R because once Casey is gone the BLM will close that race for good.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Baja Dad View Post
INS cost is what is killing the sport
Score dropped it INS from $50.000 to $10.000 per insentient
a bird ride from San Felipe to San Diego cost about $20.000

Trust me !! I was flown out a few years back !!!


Honda Pits are by FAR better then Mag 7 and Baja pits ( that's why you see more Hondas racing in Baja then any other brand )
I think JCR will do a GNCC rider and a few special events

Thank you American Honda and JCR and for ALL you Support over the years


RID RED !!!!!!

bump screwed with this post 01-14-2014 at 10:47 AM
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Old 01-14-2014, 10:46 AM   #38
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And now the official reason.

Quote:
January 14, 2014

Torrance, CA: American Honda and Johnny Campbell Racing (JCR) are pleased to announce a multi-year sponsorship agreement that will see JCR Honda competing in the Grand National Cross Country series (GNCC), the largest and one of the most prestigious off-road racing series in the U.S.

“For us, it’s really all about new challenges,” said Ray Conway Motorcycle Race Director. “Honda has dominated the SCORE series for decades, and has won the Baja 1000 23 times, including the last 17 consecutive events. JCR has spearheaded this effort for years, and Johnny has a long record of victories in Baja, including 11 Baja 1000 wins. Now it’s time for us to look for new challenges, just as Honda has with our recent involvement in the world rally championship, and the GNCC series is one of the most professional and competitive off-road series here in the U.S.”

“I am very excited for the new direction and new challenges,” said Johnny Campbell. “I have always admired the GNCC series, from the professionalism of the series directors, the extraordinary attendance at each round, the high levels of media exposure and the teams and racers. I am also excited to announce that we recently signed top GNCC rider Chris Bach. Chris is a fast, young talent and a very methodical racer who fits our program perfectly. I’m really looking forward to racing in a new atmosphere with new fans at some great venues. I have no doubt that this will be an amazing year.”
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Old 01-14-2014, 11:15 AM   #39
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New challenges? Just when they started to get seriously challenged in Baja they leave? More to it than that. That is simple bull shit PR.

I heard that there is a new top guy at Honda and he has "shaken the tree". I'm thinking the real story is that the budget was cut and GNCC can be done for what they have been given to work with and Baja can't.
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Old 01-14-2014, 11:26 AM   #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bump View Post
Any team that wants to continue will need to buy insurance. Can you imagine that conversation with a broker? And that bird ride is relatively cheap!

Dean has also said he is out since Honda isn't there to beat. Caselli's death surely has something to do with Dean's decision and SCORE's decision also.

That leaves the SoCal offroad racing community (the largest in the world) without a real race in Baja (spare me the drivel about the Baja Rally as rally style events have been tried in Baja and the US with cars and for bikes and they never work and younger generations are moving away from burning fossils for fun - those are the facts.) I don't hear anyone talking about doing a rally instead of the 1000. Perhaps that will change. I'd like to see more rally's (I've done a few and they were fun) and more interest in that here in the USA but I don't see any facts or trends to suggest that is more than my wish. And the rally style is really 180 different from the racing that has historically been done in SoCal; fastest anywhere, few rules, little structure, aimed at working class people and machines. There are plenty of competent guys on here with well equipped rally style bikes but are they gonna risk totaling that in Mexico for a rally story? Yes, I know this is a negative view about the Baja Rally and anytime anything negative is posted those involved with the Baja Rally come out and flame away so pile on you two...


After the debacle that was Caselli's death many of the old timers were talking about how the race had outgrown the location and the course and I think that has been under-mentioned in all this. Norman has been pretty upfront about turning SCORE into an F1 style Trophy Truck race sans the annoying stuff Sal liked to do, like make it about the racers.

And the loss of Honda pits is a huge blow. Baja Pits is the completely incompetent (though the guys in the actual pits are pretty good guys trying the best they can) and they are constantly screwing up everything including their promised locations.

Perhaps the races go back to privateer efforts. I don't see that happening because the costs and the insurance and the population growth and development in Baja.

I don't see JCR as a good fit for Honda's Dakar effort for alot of reasons. And American Honda has been pulling money out of JCR since it started but Johnny always comes up with a way to do it because he is a winner and winners find a way. Like getting the Rockstar sponsorship in Baja and charging for Honda Pits and so forth. I just don't think the SCORE series sold many bikes. I mean, look at the XR650R. That is the lesson for Honda. They built the only purpose driven SoCal/Baja/Nevada desert racing bike ever and sales were dreadful despite huge penetration with their marketing message about the King of Baja or whatever. Half were sold into the SoCal area. Many/most dealers outside SoCal traded theirs (Ogilvie made every dealer take one XR650R) for something they could sell. So what is the lesson there for Honda management who, I assume, are judged on motorcycle sales? And how is winning any rally on a derivative of their 10 year old SX/MX 450 gonna help Honda sell their adventure bike in the USA? I don't see many scenarios where any of this is worth Honda's time and that is made more obvious because Kawi has pulled out of nearly all support for offroad and they are now #1 in motorcycle sales. KTM has used their smallness to go after niche markets and is now #1 in offroad bikes (not sure about any profitability there for them) but companies the size of Honda cannot act like niche bike manufacturers and win; the bigger a company is the higher the bar on what is worth their time. Moreso when a billion Chinese and another billion Indians want pizza bikes.

And I think Honda is behind the ball with offroad racing in the west in general. KTM has Blaise, Kawi has Precision Concepts, Husky has Ty, but Honda has been pretty focused on SCORE so a refocus on the US West will be a real effort. They could start a program of developing Honda's Adventure 700 into a rally winner but who would pay for all that development?

My advice is that if you want this test then do the V2R because once Casey is gone the BLM will close that race for good.


The XR650R came way to soon for the US market. Today people buy them up right and left as mid level light adventure bikes. I know 3 guys who picked up plated ones in the last 2 years and they are great dependable bikes with good power for that. Unfortunately Adventure riding was not as big as it is now.
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Old 01-14-2014, 11:35 AM   #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Strong Bad View Post
New challenges? Just when they started to get seriously challenged in Baja they leave? More to it than that. That is simple bull shit PR.

I heard that there is a new top guy at Honda and he has "shaken the tree". I'm thinking the real story is that the budget was cut and GNCC can be done for what they have been given to work with and Baja can't.
Lots more exposure doing GNCC than Baja I would think from a grass roots point of view.
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Old 01-14-2014, 11:46 AM   #42
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For Immediate Release, January 14, 2014

San Clemente, CA:

JCR/Honda is excited to announce a multiyear partnership with American Honda to compete in the United States largest and most prestigious Off-Road racing series, the Grand National Cross Country series known as the GNCC. With this bold move from American Honda the statement is clear that it is moving forward in Off-Road motorcycle racing here in the US.

"I am ecstatic for this opportunity with JCR/Honda. American Honda and JCR have such a rich and successful heritage in racing together and words can't describe how thankful and excited I am for this opportunity to go GNCC Racing in 2014 as a part of their continuing Off-Road racing efforts." -- Chris Bach

"I am very excited for the new direction and new challenges. I have always admired GNCC's, from the professionalism of the series directors, the extraordinary attendance at each round, the high levels of media exposure, the teams and racers. With Honda's renewed interest in the series, it shows the value and prestige of America's largest Off-Road racing series. I am also excited to announce that we recently signed 2013 #3 GNCC rider Chris Bach. Chris is a fast, young talent with a lot of maturity and is a very methodical racer that fits our program perfectly. We have already begun working with him and are committed to building a successful program. One of the energizing points for me is the opportunity to race in a new atmosphere with new fans at some great venues. I have no doubt that this will be an amazing year. We will be racing the 2014 Honda CRF450R and our goal is to be on the podium and show the GNCC world the capability, durability, handling and performance of the Honda brand." -- Johnny Campbell
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Old 01-14-2014, 11:49 AM   #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Baja Dad View Post
INS cost is what is killing the sport
Score dropped it INS from $50.000 to $10.000 per insentient
I'm not sure I understand what you are saying. $10,000 per each time a participant becomes unconscious?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Baja Dad View Post
RID RED !!!!!!
So you're saying get rid of Honda?
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Old 01-14-2014, 11:52 AM   #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lostsaffa View Post
For Immediate Release, January 14, 2014

San Clemente, CA:

JCR/Honda is excited to announce a multiyear partnership with American Honda to compete in the United States largest and most prestigious Off-Road racing series, the Grand National Cross Country series known as the GNCC. With this bold move from American Honda the statement is clear that it is moving forward in Off-Road motorcycle racing here in the US.

"I am ecstatic for this opportunity with JCR/Honda. American Honda and JCR have such a rich and successful heritage in racing together and words can't describe how thankful and excited I am for this opportunity to go GNCC Racing in 2014 as a part of their continuing Off-Road racing efforts." -- Chris Bach

"I am very excited for the new direction and new challenges. I have always admired GNCC's, from the professionalism of the series directors, the extraordinary attendance at each round, the high levels of media exposure, the teams and racers. With Honda's renewed interest in the series, it shows the value and prestige of America's largest Off-Road racing series. I am also excited to announce that we recently signed 2013 #3 GNCC rider Chris Bach. Chris is a fast, young talent with a lot of maturity and is a very methodical racer that fits our program perfectly. We have already begun working with him and are committed to building a successful program. One of the energizing points for me is the opportunity to race in a new atmosphere with new fans at some great venues. I have no doubt that this will be an amazing year. We will be racing the 2014 Honda CRF450R and our goal is to be on the podium and show the GNCC world the capability, durability, handling and performance of the Honda brand." -- Johnny Campbell
This is quoted from an official JCR group email


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Old 01-14-2014, 01:20 PM   #45
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It is simple
Score's INS only covers up $10.000 now
it was $50.000

You must be to young to remember the Honda
RID RED campaign back in the 80's and 90's

Telling everyone to RIDE RED (get on a Honda!! )
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