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Old 01-29-2014, 04:46 AM   #91
JohnCW
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[QUOTE=troops;23338785]
Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnCW View Post
Hi BC,
Can I recommend you progress to moving you butt. To do this effortlessly you need to ride with the balls of your feet on the pegs if not already doing it. Just ride along in a straight line and shift you butt half way across the seat, and drop you shoulder and knee on that side, what happens? The bike just starts to turn in that direction....... magic!!

Took your advice and and changed my style today. Felt like I was riding a different bike, awesome! Seems I was getting into some bad habits, two hour commute everyday, starting to ride lazy. I realized my feet were too far forward on the pegs and had stopped using my weight as an advantage, thanks for the reminder. My commute today, much more enjoyable.
Hi Troop,
You've made my day. I write the stuff in the hope that just one person will at least give it a try and decide for themselves.

Riding with you feet forward on the pegs toes hanging down on a road bike can actually be very dangerous. Hook into a sweeping bend cranked over, and the front of your boot will touch the road long before your pegs. This can pull your foot from the peg and leg gets jerked back. Being unbalanced like this right in the middle of a high-speed sweeping bend, not good.

Watch how someone like Marc Marquez really tucks his inside boot up out of the way in a turn. That's to complicated for the average rider I reckon, so just staying on the balls of you feet most of the time is the better option for us mere mortals.

And the more you practice it the smoother and more natural it'll become.
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Old 01-29-2014, 06:01 AM   #92
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnCW View Post
Fundamental skills - Why does everyone assume the rider who didn't take the corner was a beginner?
I've known people who have been riding for decades who still think "lay 'er down" is a promising way to deal with any emergency situation. Are they beginners?

Why would anyone assume that only a beginner might need to brush up on fundamental skills?

Or, that the OP is the only one who might get something from reading this thread?

I guess that when I contribute to a thread like this I try to offer information that more than just the OP might be able to use. When digging through ADV looking for something specific I always appreciate it when the topic's contributors have offered enough detail to be useful. Just returning the favor.

As interesting as the explanation about how you weren't writing about hanging off and the associated historical content was, it was a bit redundant as I had mentioned how I realized I was mistaken in thinking that was your point.

I think you and I are more in agreement than not. We just see similar solutions from slightly different perspectives.
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Old 01-29-2014, 07:26 AM   #93
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In a recent column in Motorcyclist , California Superbike School head honcho spoke of a student that showed uo thinking he couldn't possibly learn much from the experience. He said "I already have 27 years worth of experience ! What can I get from one day ?"
After the school his attitude had flipped.
He said" What I had was one year of experience , 27 times. "
So, learn something new, push your boundaries , go to the track and learn.
If I crash again, which will likely happen if I ride enough It won't be from giving up ,laying her down or whatever. It will be from gravel,dirt, slime or whatever on the road and it will happen after fighting for sucess all the way to the ground.
As they rule in AHRMA , if your handlebar touches the ground , you're done racing , you've crashed.
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Old 01-29-2014, 09:10 AM   #94
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I have only one take on this "the bike would not turn" phenomenon,

A vast majority of the riders out there learned to operate a motor vehicle in a car.

There instinct is to turn the wheel in the direction of the turn. When in panic mode on a motorcycle, they do exactly that. They turn the bars towards the direction of the turn, effectively counter, counter steering.
Boom, off the road excursion.
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Old 01-29-2014, 10:09 AM   #95
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I watched a harley go down on at a big turn on the way to Mancos one day. After stopping he said his "steering locked up" Guy was ok, but bike had to be trailered out of there. massive damage to all the chrome and goodies.

I attribute it to not paying attention and inexperience and its eaiser to attempt to lay blame to the equipment than his own ineptitude.
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Old 01-29-2014, 10:46 AM   #96
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bollocks View Post
I think all modern day sports bikes can out perform 90% of there riders.
A forty year old motorcycle well ridden can outperform 90% of modern sportbikes with their inexperienced and untrained riders. I especially enjoy passing them in a corner with chunks of mud flying off the knobbies.
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Old 01-29-2014, 12:53 PM   #97
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When I was a young guy in the early 70's, the riding style of Paul Smart was considered a revelation, "jeeze, he's hanging his bum off the seat, he's got his knee sticking out in the breeze!"

There's some famous shots of Smart at Imola in '72 on the Ducati 750ss being followed by teamate Bruno Spaggiari. Smart wearing a full face helmet, bum partially off the seat, hanging a knee out, Spaggiari wearing open face helmet and goggles, riding in the "classic" upright style. It really did seem to be a changing of the guard, the new replacing the old.
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Old 01-29-2014, 02:43 PM   #98
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Quote:
Originally Posted by merickk View Post
I watched a harley go down on at a big turn on the way to Mancos one day. After stopping he said his "steering locked up" Guy was ok, but bike had to be trailered out of there. massive damage to all the chrome and goodies.

I attribute it to not paying attention and inexperience and its eaiser to attempt to lay blame to the equipment than his own ineptitude.
Steering locked up. Mmmmkay.
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Old 01-29-2014, 03:13 PM   #99
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Originally Posted by steelerider View Post
Steering locked up. Mmmmkay.
Something locked up...
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Old 01-29-2014, 03:24 PM   #100
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bk brkr baker View Post
In a recent column in Motorcyclist , California Superbike School head honcho spoke of a student that showed uo thinking he couldn't possibly learn much from the experience. He said "I already have 27 years worth of experience ! What can I get from one day ?"
After the school his attitude had flipped.
He said" What I had was one year of experience , 27 times. "
So, learn something new, push your boundaries , go to the track and learn.
If I crash again, which will likely happen if I ride enough It won't be from giving up ,laying her down or whatever. It will be from gravel,dirt, slime or whatever on the road and it will happen after fighting for sucess all the way to the ground.
As they rule in AHRMA , if your handlebar touches the ground , you're done racing , you've crashed.
There's a saying I heard years ago along the line of "you show me a man who thinks he knows everything, and I'll show you a man who probably doesn't know much". When we stop learning we are actually going backward as the rest of the world is still going forward.
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Old 01-29-2014, 03:29 PM   #101
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Old 01-29-2014, 03:37 PM   #102
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bk brkr baker View Post
So, learn something new, push your boundaries , go to the track and learn.
Why do you think you can only learn on a track?

Quote:
If I crash again, which will likely happen if I ride enough It won't be from giving up ,laying her down or whatever. It will be from gravel,dirt, slime or whatever on the road and it will happen after fighting for sucess all the way to the ground.
Why not start by learning to spot those early and avoid them?
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Old 01-29-2014, 03:50 PM   #103
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tkent02 View Post
A forty year old motorcycle well ridden can outperform 90% of modern sportbikes with their inexperienced and untrained riders. I especially enjoy passing them in a corner with chunks of mud flying off the knobbies.
I ride a well maintained, setup, and slightly improved 25 year old retro bike that looks like a 40 year old bike. I just love passing those new expensive (often red coloured) sports bikes in the corners. I don't know for sure, but I imagine it really pisses em off.
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Old 01-29-2014, 04:08 PM   #104
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shovelstrokeed View Post
I have only one take on this "the bike would not turn" phenomenon,

A vast majority of the riders out there learned to operate a motor vehicle in a car.

There instinct is to turn the wheel in the direction of the turn. When in panic mode on a motorcycle, they do exactly that. They turn the bars towards the direction of the turn, effectively counter, counter steering.
Boom, off the road excursion.

This +1
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Old 01-29-2014, 06:00 PM   #105
bk brkr baker
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dwoodward View Post
Why do you think you can only learn on a track?

reply

Where did I say anything like that ? I had over 150,000 road miles behind me before ever getting on a track. The thing is, on the track you can push harder safer than on the street. Try it sometime.

Why not start by learning to spot those early and avoid them?
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Come ride with me sometime. If you're doing fun speeds over the hills and around the bends gravel happens without prior notice.
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