01' gs 1150 fuel maintenance

Discussion in 'GS Boxers' started by turbojugend208, Aug 18, 2012.

  1. turbojugend208

    turbojugend208 Been here awhile

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    does anyone have a part number for which fuel filter to use i'm switching to an external filter so I need to know what filter to use and where to get it, also should I get new internal lines from bmw or is their an alternative place to get cheaper lines???? thanks in advance for any and all help, Turbojugend
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  2. vintagerider

    vintagerider Long timer

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    Wix 33323 in the front frame hollow above the horn. Eliminates one fuel disconnect. Easier on, off tank r-r and fuel line routing. I use Gates submersible exclusively inside which is available from Napa and other stores 5/16" i.d. BMW rubber U. BMW screw fuel clamps. BMW "tvpe V" is anecdotaly o.k. for internal or external. Dorman long fuel injection male x male barb nipple to replace the BMW filter. The nipple comes in bag marked "fuel injection repair kit" at a-zone. Note that yo need the 3/8" nipple not the 5/16" nipple. This is because black nylon is sold in tube sizes rather than hose.
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  3. PARATOAD

    PARATOAD Paratoad

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    I have a 2000 R1150GS and will be replacing my fuel filters (and likely fuel lines...) soon. I think moving them to an area that's easier to access sounds awesome. Can I get one of you to talk me through that process? How costly is it? Is it worth the expense and hassle? Thanks.
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  4. vintagerider

    vintagerider Long timer

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    edit: Paratoad seeks help with filter change...
    If you are still lost after reading threads here, draw a schematic for the fuel system. You will understand it when you open it up. If still any questions feel free to pm one of the resident experts. Leave the fuel sys to an expert if you have the slightest doubts?

    orig post: If you had an under-sink water filter then decided you wanted a faucet style or a whole house style, well if you can understand the concept of re-routing fluids through rubber tubes then you'll be fine. If you are competent with changing the in-tank filter then inserting a "blank" for the factory filter plus good workshop practice you'll be fine. On the other hand, if your fuel system seems slythy toves, beware of bandersnatch and the queens hatchet.
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  5. def

    def Ginger th wonder dog

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    "Hey Andy". "Hey Gube. Whattcha doin?"

    "Well Andy, Wally asked me to adjust the bandersnatch on the truck. Instead, I bent the hoitengroiten a little bit and the truck runs fine now. Ya think I shud tell him?"

    "Guber, it always pays to tell the truth, right Barney?"
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  6. def

    def Ginger th wonder dog

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    Whaaaaaa? :dunno :confused
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  7. turbojugend208

    turbojugend208 Been here awhile

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    thanks man, all went well and smooth until i got to the filter in the frame hollow, love the idea of it and the fuel routing but i'm stumped on the filter placement??? do you have a picture maybe? thanks again
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  8. vintagerider

    vintagerider Long timer

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    Hope that you removed the glued on bracket that comes with the Wix!! Twist it off. Sent you a pm. Tank should be removed for initial installation. After that filter can be drained w/o tank removal. (cold engine).

    Should be straight forward, was for me at least. Took me a while to play with the hose routing. Ran the two lines outboard of aftmkt ss brake hoses to keep clear of shock.

    Position the two filter barbs so they are are facing down and parallel to front engine cover. HD hook-loop tape between front side of filter and inside face of frame hollow.

    Supply from filter outlet to lower black nylon fuel dist passes under metal oil and above frame support- small gap there. Then routes just under crankcase ven those but clears top of telelever. Keep off the engine. This hose is permanent , stays in place with tank removal, no QD. Care must be taken so that moving or hot parts do not rub on the hoses. Insulate with split rubber tube as necessary. No QD's up front!!! None required. Pull hose off filter barb for tank removal (engine cold). Pump check vlv will prevent fuel outflow.

    Feed from forward facing pump plate nipple passes over top of oil line to parallel first line up to filter in a wide gentle arc outboard of brake hose. Split bit of hose to insulate the fuel line from moving brake hose. No QD used here up front because pump check vlv prevents outflow if tank removed.

    Fuel return from dist to tank is as original factory. QD may be used as typical.

    Cost for all new external hoses and 50k mile Wix SS, welded seam, 10 micron filter was minuscule. OEM BMW fuel line from VW aftermarket shop= $1/ft. Filter less than $20 and has capacity to last 50k est miles. Easily back-flushed if required.
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  9. def

    def Ginger th wonder dog

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    "Hey Andy". "Hey Gube".

    "Andy, I did like you told me, I told Wally about the hoitengroiten. Andy, that Wally, he laughed and laughed and then he fired me. He said that I had no business messing with the hoitengroiten on his truck. Andy, I was just tryin' to help. What should I do now?"

    "Guber, just be patient. Wally will come around. Why don't you and Oppie go to the drug store and have a soda. Take Barney along too.

    Hello Sarah.....yes, I'm fine, Aunt Bea is fine...yes Sarah, Oppie is fine too....Sarah, please ring Wally's garage....Wally? Sheriff Taylor here. I'm fine Wally. Yes, Aunt Bea is fine too. Wally, ahem, I was wondering how is your truck running after Guber fixed the hoitengroiten? It's running fine and the mileage has improved? I see. Well, Wally, I just wanted you to know that Guber may take a job in Mount Pilot repairing big diesel engines and trucks and it would be a loss to Mayberry if he moves away. Yes Wally. Guber is down at the drug store having a soda with Barney and Oppie. You're welcome Wally...it never hurts to leave well enough alone...Yes Wally, I would give Guber a raise to make sure he doesn't move to Mount Pilot".

    I never understood why you would want to move the fuel filter out of the tank where it could potentially leak and cause trouble.
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  10. vintagerider

    vintagerider Long timer

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    Stock set up does not have external lines which can leak Def?

    If you are that worried about leaks then should scrap the stock plumbing, scrap toy oem fuel distributor and go with AN type shielded lines and a real fuel distributor.

    External filter if installed properly is less likely to leak than stock, does a better job of filtering, offers faster diagnostics on trail, eliminates one QD, ect.

    Crap oem filter clogs, splits, passes dirt, plugs injectors cost $105 at current price for 72k miles, parts only, if it gets changed at all- history proves that it doesn't.

    A single Wix does better job at a tenth the parts cost plus labor saved. Could easily save $1,000 in reduced parts and maintenance. Never had any leaks from Wix filter or non-existent QD. Appreciate the mod every time the tank comes off and every time I twist the throttle.
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  11. def

    def Ginger th wonder dog

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    "Hey Andy" "Hey Guber"

    "Gube, I've been smellin' gasoline lately when I first start the squad car. Whaddya suppose it is?"

    "Well Andy, it could just be that fancy external fuel filter that Wally put on a few weeks ago. If you like, I take a look at it for ya".

    "Guber, I don't think that'll be necessary. I see the car on fire across the street and Barney is trying to put it out with a garden hose. I hope Wally has good insurance"

    "Gooooolly Andy, I'm sure sorry about the fire and all. I knew it....I just knew it...changing that filter from inside the tank to outside the tank was a fire hazard. I knew it....I just knew it".

    "Sarah, get Wally on the phone please......................Wally? Its Sheriff Taylor......we've got a problem............."

    "Hello sheriff.....what's up?"
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  12. roger 04 rt

    roger 04 rt Long timer

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    Serious question def, what are your thoughts on QDs?
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  13. def

    def Ginger th wonder dog

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    The fewer joints, fittings an a system the better. If my bike had an external filter and QDs, I return it to the tank where it belongs.

    But....let's ask an expert......

    "Hey Gube" "Hey def" "Guber, I trust your judgement regarding fuel systems. What do you think about taking the fuel filter out of the tank and mounting it externally?"

    "Gooooooooooolly, I would never do that def. It's too risky.....waaaaay too risky. Hey, how long are ya gonna be here in Mayberry...maybe we could tune up yer motorsickle".

    "Thanks for the offer Guber but, it runs fine".

    Well, there you have it....that's as serious as I can get tonight.....Bears-Packers, you know.
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  14. vintagerider

    vintagerider Long timer

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    Getting back to op's original question here is the link to Bill Dennes 2002 mod:
    http://www.ibmwr.org/r-tech/oilheads/external_filter_R1150RT/index.shtml

    This link gives you the plumbing but not <del> the best </del> acceptable materials or methods. edit: If you are going external then do it correctly. The China filter is for a car with carburetor. Even if it doesn't split it can not protect the injectors. Note the probable interference of the hose with throttle wheel. Then there is heat soaking to the fuel from the location. Common variations: stuffing the China carb filter under the the tank plastic cover or using this filter in the tank "because its cheap and widely available". Let's face it, the pump plate used on the 11xx is crap. The aluminum stock filter is undersized and plugs fast especially when tank liner is flaking. A mc that has chocked up and stalled is neither safe nor fun if you've burned a valve from under-fueling.

    Common fuel leak failure modes on the 11xx and how to avoid them:
    No shortage of threads on pp getting stranded with completely stock fuel system or having leaks with internal filters.

    - Stock BMW plastic fuel distributor (aka fuel spider) fails. Can crack, develop pinhole leak. Injector top cracks off. Attachment to regulator housing leaks

    - QD failure

    - Internal filter pressure leak down (aggravated by numerous internal filter changes or by insufficient changes causing filter to burst)

    Understand which risks are real and which are imagined. Several of the risks are alleviated by switching to external.

    The stock config results in tweaking or pulling on the distributor line while trying to remove tank, increasing failure rate. Original BMW fuel distributors are getting quite brittle by now and they were weak from day one. The oem distributor is a unitized assembly which is pita to replace. Helps to understand this thing because when it does break you may have a long hike out. With a little care you can reduce breakage.

    Best advice is simply not to tweak the spider when removing the tank. Easier said then done. QD's reduce tweaking but can themselves leak.

    Since QD's can leak, having a remote barbed joint is the next best solution for when you need to r-r the tank. An external filter gives you that joint. To remove tank pull here not on the distributor. Therefore, properly installing an external filter of the correct type actually reduces a common fuel leak on 11xx. Emphasis here on "correct type" and "properly installed".

    Filter should be burst-proof, thick walled and welded seam designed for fuel injection not carburetor.

    Unacceptable filter types for mc use:
    not designed for fuel injection
    not 10 micron filtration
    not thick walled
    not burst-proof
    not welded seam
    aluminum body

    Do not use any of the above. Note that even the o.e.m. BMW filter is not to be used externally. Just because three hundred 11xx riders will tell you "used it for years, never a problem" does not make it right. They are riding around on half plugged injectors.

    The rider who doesn't get stranded because he has taken the time to disassemble and upgrade his fuel system properly is safer in my mind than the one who just mindlessly bolts on "authorized" repair parts.

    A badly engineered or improperly installed mod IS a hazard. Most here are happy to help. If you aren't sure of your workmanship because you are learning then post a picture or have a professional inspection. External lines on the 11xx are a fact whether you go external or not. The only" risk" for externalization is improper materials and hose routing. These ARE significant but retaining the oem system will eventually catch up. Opinions abound on the net. Best to review specific issues rather than rely on a parody of a TV show. Weren't all car fuel filters external in the 60's?

    Good luck with your project.
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  15. def

    def Ginger th wonder dog

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    ^^^^ Good points but, I'm stickin' with Guber's recommendation.
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  16. roger 04 rt

    roger 04 rt Long timer

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    Here's a temporary version of an add-on pressure regulator in the fuel return line for testing. It has worked out well. This will be better mounted, and with Oetiker clamps, in a fashion similar to the IBMWR external filter mod. Hoses will be dressed away from all moving parts. Any thoughts on a better location ... other than in the tank? ;)

    [​IMG]
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  17. def

    def Ginger th wonder dog

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    We all know what Goober thinks.
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  18. vintagerider

    vintagerider Long timer

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    Roger, it seems like you've read the posts on increasing fuel pressure for better atomization. 3.2 bar has been reported as sweet spot. Too much pressure is counter-productive.

    Why are you still using the oem fuel distributor if you have new external?

    Hasenwerk posted his mod here, check out his pics as well as those on RB Racing. Most won't need external fuel pressure regulator but it is a cool mod which seems to have several benefits. Others should at least request a new BMW fuel distributor when the frame is lifted and where the old one is > 7 years. That is arbitrary number since exposure to UV light, chemicals, physical stress determine how fast the black nylon ages.

    Thermal Over-Tube available:
    Just discovered a source for thermal over-tube: Reno Hydraulics. Incredible abrasion resistant outer layer plus what looks like asbestos inner weave. Dark orange in color, not sure if available in black. Use of this over-tube/sheath should completely alleviate any fear of fuel hose damage from heat or rubbing. Seems to be oem on some cars and on O2 sensor wires.

    BTW, Jo Momma, the Basement is the correct forum on here to write parody of TV sitcom. POV can be welcome but 8 times in one thread? Most will prefer to read tips on employing proper technique, use of better materials and of preventing known failure modes.
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  19. def

    def Ginger th wonder dog

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    I see.

    Goober has left the building...........
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  20. def

    def Ginger th wonder dog

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    Asbestos...really?
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