06 Beta REV 250

Discussion in 'Trials' started by thegraydog, Oct 4, 2012.

  1. thegraydog

    thegraydog 2 wheels X 6 ways

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    Was my first trials bike, and is now the backup unit. Compared to the GGs it is a good chassis, steers tighter, heavier in front/lighter in back. But it's really anemic; the expert kids don't want to ride it. Chainslap says it's the slowest revving motor ever made...

    I'm ready to sell it, get the next new bike, and have my 09GG280 become the backup. Lord knows that bike is thrashed enough.

    But I could also take (the Beta) to Big Joe, get a new piston, maybe even make it a 270? What do we know about this?

    I don't know if it has flywheel weights. It's jetted for 7000'. Seems to prefer race gas, at least every other tank.
    #1
  2. laser17

    laser17 Been here awhile

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    I would check to see if it has the "extra" primary side FWW installed. If so, you might prefer the power w/o it. I doubt it will ever compare to the super snappy 280 though.
    #2
  3. Sting32

    Sting32 Trials Evangelist

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    Dont know much about Beta, but in general if that engine isn't just rattling like hell, has good compression, rings might do something, carb setup could change how it runs.

    it is new enough I think you could spend a bunch of money with parts from Beta, or rather, sell it to a new guy you have met, and get him into trials... :freaky

    Nothing is baggin on beta, above, if it was a GG or whatever, you could spend a lot to refresh it, and find out, that it was the design that year, to not be as snappy as maybe the bikes that it is getting compared to?
    This has to do with porting, flywheel weighting, ignition maps, carb and exhaust design...

    I know my 2010 Raga 300 is "slower" than my 2011 raga 300, they change little things all the time it seems, because my 08 raga 300, seemed it was "hotter" and quicker than my 10, but less than my 11, and the 11 seems less than dad's 12 raga 300. Even though each bike was equipped the same, from flywheel weights, to carb jets...

    just sayin, maybe...
    #3
  4. lineaway

    lineaway Long timer

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    Always rode a Beta in second, first gear was always too low to go. Have seen a few run like 125`s instead of a big bike!:eek1
    #4
  5. DerViking

    DerViking Shred

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    At sea level it might be a nice bike. At 7000 feet you have to wind it all the way up, then explode on anything sizeable. I am sure I could adapt to it, but I just dont want to have to. I want my Gasser back.

    The biggest problem in my opinion is the way you cannot accelerate on the throttle once you are into a section. If you dont have the flywheel spinning, bleeding off bits of power with the clutch, you cannot get more RPM under load.

    Hops nicely though.
    #5
  6. Sting32

    Sting32 Trials Evangelist

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    Id suggest playing with jets and needle settings... it is too lean or too rich? No idea, but heck playing is cheap. Just write stuff down, lol. Someone has to know how to tune the dang thing?

    BTW, I hear high altitude they play with jets a lot, I cannot recall what the setup for my gasgas was going to be, but it was NOT just dropping both jets sizes Like I think we used to do... I should have written it down when someone explained it to me though, lol. But it was different than I had heard before...

    Hmmmmm, Where's that record conversation button/app on my droid? :wink:
    I cant give out carb/altitude tuning secrets when i have CRS (cant remember sheit).
    #6
  7. thegraydog

    thegraydog 2 wheels X 6 ways

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    Yes to all the above. I'll mess with it some, at least until next year's econos are out.

    Bob, you're right on both counts: we run in second, and it is just not in a hurry.

    Laser, we'll get around to checking on the flywheel weight.

    This was a good bike to start on, since I wasn't a young beginner. The (super snappy)GG would have killed me while I was still thinking about clutch-and-throttle...

    Sting, I'm inclined to agree that it is what it is. But considering the wide range of response one can coax out af a KTM motor, I thought I'd let you-all speculate.

    [DerViking is one of the experts that doesn't want to endure another trials on the plugger...]
    #7
  8. 2whlrcr

    2whlrcr gooligan

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    I had a 2005 Beta 250 and I'm at 1100MSL. Yes the motor is soft and super smooth, but works well here, for all but the biggest stuff. I'm sure at 7000' it's a dog. I've ridden enough at 10K plus on regular dirt bikes to know how altitude really effects the power.

    I bought a new GG 250 and it took me awhile to get used to the snappier power, even though it's also a 250. My guess is your bike is stock and running fine, but just weak at altitude. Sell it to somebody at seal level and buy a bigger bike.
    #8
  9. thegraydog

    thegraydog 2 wheels X 6 ways

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    Okay, Big Joe went over it.
    Moved a needle, advanced the timing, chewed me out about using enough oil on the air filter.
    Repacked exhaust, put new o-rings in the exhaust sections, welded the busted bracket.
    New throttle assy, new rear fender -- just cleaning up.
    Put more oil in the front forks, so they ride a little higher -- today they felt a little stiff but showed much less inclination to tuck.
    Took it down to Brian at the machine shop -- the flywheel on this bike is six inches in diameter and six pounds! They turned off a half pound!

    I rode it an hour in great terrain today, 5500', cool weather. I think it's an honest Beta 250 again. Main impression is that it still spools up slower than I expect, and then tractors up the steps better than I expect. Very different dynamic than my GG280.

    I finished the afternoon on the GG. Such different machines.
    #9
  10. lineaway

    lineaway Long timer

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    Reality is the Gasser feels funner to ride! In a trials I could probably score better on the Beta due to traction and it holds a line better. For me the gasser goes up things better that I am just lazy about. The Beta can hold a finer line that nobody should try. Two distinct worlds, on any given trials one works better till the next time!:huh
    #10
  11. joe cool

    joe cool Been here awhile

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    Graydog, Did anyone check the reeds?
    #11
  12. thegraydog

    thegraydog 2 wheels X 6 ways

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    joe, Joe didn't think the reeds were at issue. He leaned out pilot and richened the main, to get it to not bog on accel. He had me do a plug test, quarter throttle and then three quarter throttle; don't guess I ever had a bike at three quarter throttle for twenty seconds, at least on flat ground.:eek1 It came up lean, hence the adjustments.

    Leaned with the needle, I shoulda said...
    #12
  13. lineaway

    lineaway Long timer

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    So do you know what jets you have? At 7000 ft a mikuni should have a 135 main and 30-35 pilot.
    #13
  14. thegraydog

    thegraydog 2 wheels X 6 ways

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    The idle jet is 27.5, with a 30 in the box from previous owner. Main in the box is 150, so something smaller. Joe wasn't interested in the main, so didn't identify it.
    I thought about going over to the shop to verify whether it's a Mikuni, just so you know you you're coaching here :lol3.
    #14
  15. lineaway

    lineaway Long timer

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    Pretty sure Beta went mikuni from 1990-2006 with a brief lapse to delorto early `94-95 and they ran like crap. In 2007 went to kehien I believe. And yes the main makes a difference!!!! Don`t know joe, but I had a Beta or two.:D
    PS. I used to jet like Joe, but no more!
    #15
  16. thegraydog

    thegraydog 2 wheels X 6 ways

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    Okay, I will go see what carb it is.
    Not to be defensive, but just to set the baseline: Joe ain't just the neighbor. Colorado enduro champ in, oh, probably the sixties. Our best local mechanic for a quarter century. And his son Pat, also a national treasure, had the same Beta until a couple months ago.

    So any incongruities in this discussion are mine. I'm having one conversation with the bikes, another with Joe, and another with you-all. And I'm a carpenter, not a motorhead. Thanks for the encouragement.

    You'd get along great with Joe.

    Mikuni.
    #16
  17. lineaway

    lineaway Long timer

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    I understand why Joe jets the way he does. I have worked with and know plenty of great mechanics, some national champs of many forms of motorcycling. I also know what works in a Beta. :D
    So if it was his bike, how did he fix the carb from over flowing? It was always a problem so wodering if you are starved for fuel also?
    #17
  18. thegraydog

    thegraydog 2 wheels X 6 ways

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    Mmmm, I'm aware that Betas parked at any angle piss fuel. You gotta fix?

    (Corxn: Pat had an identical Beta, bought the same day same shop, but not this bike....)

    So. I have this Beta, messing with it for education. What should I look at next? I think it is now a healthy bike; your post #10 makes a ton of sense.

    You want to put your hands on it? I'll be coming over to San Y sometime this winter...
    #18
  19. lineaway

    lineaway Long timer

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    #19
  20. thegraydog

    thegraydog 2 wheels X 6 ways

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    Oddly, this bike has always started first kick, even after months -- like a Honda vegematic.

    Okay, I'm gonna get the jets, and I'm gonna come see you.

    BTW, good to hear (Garrett?) got the fire. There is a steep spot in the learning curve, or fitness curve, that is pretty fun to ride or watch. Ah, youth.
    #20