'09 KLR Engine Problems

Discussion in 'Thumpers' started by advhound, Oct 29, 2012.

  1. advhound

    advhound Adventurer

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    Hello all,

    I am in need of some direction to troubleshoot my ‘09 KLR. I was riding down the highway going about 75 MPH and I lost all engine power immediately. The starter motor still turns the engine. I had battery power to headlight, tail lights, dash lights etc. Haven’t touched the bike mod-wise except for adding heated grips. Bike has about 11,000 miles.

    Here is what I have done to date to trouble shoot:
    Pulled the spark plug and confirmed I do have spark. Replaced spark plug.
    Visually inspected the fuel lines and all lines are intact and connected.
    Checked the pressure from the engine and when I hold my hand on the exhaust, I can feel a little pressure, but it doesn’t “pop” my hand off. Similarly, when I put my hand over the spark plug hole, I can feel pressure on my finger, but it doesn’t “pop” my finger off. From what I have read, I should have around 90 psi. Does this seem out of line?

    What should I look at next to trouble shoot?
    #1
  2. bomber60015

    bomber60015 Anatomically Correct

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    are you getting gas to the cylinder?<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:eek:ffice:eek:ffice" /><o:p></o:p>

    to the carb?<o:p></o:p>

    seems you have two of the three requirements for combustion . . . . air and spark . . . .fuel completes the triumvirate<o:p></o:p>
    #2
  3. bajadog

    bajadog Running around knees bent

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    Just for a baseline, have you had the valve clearances during the 11K miles.
    #3
  4. itsatdm

    itsatdm Long timer

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    You probably won't feel much pressure at cranking speeds, as the bike raises an exhaust valve a bit to aid starting. Same reason it is difficult to get accurate compression readings unless you disable the automatic compression release.

    I had a similar experience when I burnt some valves on the road. I would check valve clearances and if you find some with none, that could be an indicator.

    Probably not the case, but if you find some valves with excessive clearance, that is a sign of bent valves.
    #4
  5. SkiBumBrian

    SkiBumBrian DualSport Crazy !!

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    Open the carb bowl drain and see if fuel comes out, if not look at your petcock for proper flow. Could be the diaphragm, kinked vacuum hose, etc.
    #5
  6. Beezer

    Beezer Long timer

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    do you get fuel out of the petcock when you crank? if yes, I would pull the air cleaner off & shoot some starting fluid in to carb (open the throttle). If it pops & runs briefly it's the carb.

    If that makes no difference it would be time to check the valve timing.

    Did you change the "doo"? If so, how long ago & was it the whole works, etc.
    #6
  7. advhound

    advhound Adventurer

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    @bomber60015 and @SkiBumBrian - I will check getting gas to the cylinder and I will also open the carb bowl drain to confirm fuel comes out.

    @bajadog - No, I haven't taken valve clearance baseline measurements. Is there a resource of what they should be set at?

    @itsatdm - That is interesting that the bike raises an exhaust valve a bit to aid starting. Good info. Will check valve clearances, hopefully valves are not the issue! One question - please see [​IMG]; what is this? It seems I need to remove this to remove the valve cover plate? I think it is a coolant line, do I need to drain the coolant so I don't spew cooolant?

    @beezer - I will confirm petcock fuel flow. You are saying if it pops and runs, the air flow through the carb is the problem? Clear air path? I have never changes the doohickey. I understood that 2nd gen KLR's aren't succeptible to this problem and the doohickey fix isn't a common fix needed?

    Thanks for the help guys, really wanting to get her running again!
    #7
  8. Okie Rider

    Okie Rider Avid Motorcyclist

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    Kickstand cutout switch?
    #8
  9. advhound

    advhound Adventurer

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    Wouldn't the starter fail to turn the engine if the kickstand kill switch was failing? The starter will turn the engine with the clutch pulled in.
    #9
  10. willijas

    willijas .............

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    what you have highlighted is the Air Injection System (AKA AIS) a lot of people remove this. No you don't have to drain the coolant to remove it and yes you have to remove it to get to the valves. Something you might check is the petcock. it is vacuum operated and it is not unheard of to have the diaphragm that operates the petcock to wear out and leak which equals no fuel. If that is the case you have 3 options 1. fix the petcock with a rebuild kit, 2. put in a yamaha raptor petcock (non vacuum), 3. buy or build a kit to remove the diaphragm from the OE petcock.

    willijas
    #10
  11. Duas Rodas

    Duas Rodas Been here awhile

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    Someone sugested spraying started fluid into the intake...so what happened?:deal

    I would do this before tearing into it any further. You do want to eliminate the simple stuff first...spark-yes, gas-we don't!!! Do the above and if it runs for a sec, you a have fuel delivery issue...
    Always eleminate the simple stuff first!
    #11
  12. Outwardbound

    Outwardbound Been here awhile

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    Electrical problem; I'd betcha a beer.
    #12
  13. whisperquiet

    whisperquiet Long timer

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    +1 Electrical on 2008 and some 2009 KLRs. Read this: http://www.klr650.net/forums/showthread.php?t=58585 I would be looking up around the right radiator overflow tank support bracket or near the fuses on the left side under the gas tank...........common areas for rub through/shorts points. Check the fuses to see if one is blown.

    You can easily check gas flow to the carb........open the drain screw on the right side of the carb with a 3mm allen, crank the bike's starter, and see if it continues to flow gasoline out the carb.
    #13
  14. Beezer

    Beezer Long timer

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    the Gen II "doo" lever is stronger but the spring is too long & gets loose. if the bike has more than a few thousand miles on it the spring will have no tension. many are so loose they literally fall off. they have been known to go through the timing chain and make timing jump. (BTW, the lever is a poor fit to the shaft which lets the whole works stay in motion while the bike runs). actually the whole design is piss poor & then built with crappy parts.

    anyway, what I was getting at is that if you have spark & shoot some fuel into the carb & it runs, then the fuel system is at fault.

    if you have a spark & shoot fuel in and it still doesn't run.... either:

    (1) there isn't enough compression due to tight valves, jumped valve timing (with possibly bent valves), broken rings, blown head gasket or most likely a broken compression release. (a head gasket that bad prolly leaks coolant too)

    or:
    (2) the spark is not at the right time. this sometimes happens when replacing the doo. in the process the rotor has to come off... when it goes back on it has to engage a woodruff key on the crank, if that gets knocked out during assembly the rotor will eventually slip on the shaft. it might still spark, but the timing is way off
    #14
  15. Beezer

    Beezer Long timer

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    also, if the safety switches are in the kill mode for the Ignition system, the starter won't turn
    #15
  16. advhound

    advhound Adventurer

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    Quick update: Not getting much or any suction that I can feel from the vacuum hose. Put a spare tube on the vacuum port on petcock, gave it a little vacuum and fuel came right out of fuel supply of petcock, no hesitation. Petcock seems functional. Drained a couple ounces of fuel from the carb bowl drain. Fuel was very clean. A couple very small white drops sunk in the cup of drained fuel. Next stop, starter fluid in carb to see if she'll turn over! Thanks for all the ideas fellas.
    #16
  17. advhound

    advhound Adventurer

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    I took off the valve cover and discovered this piece broken off from the valve assembly towards the front of the motorcycle on the right side:
    [​IMG]

    Here is where the piece broke off from the assembly:
    [​IMG]

    Here is a shot of the entire front valve assembly:
    [​IMG]

    A shot from the left of the motor. The valve assembly with the broken piece is to the left (front of the motorcycle).
    [​IMG]

    Glad to finally have found something that is definitely broken so I am clear as to what the problem is, but wondering what else I need to look into. The starter was turning the engine decent before, but now it seems the starter is seized up and the cam chain and gears in that last picture are not turning at all. What part is that that broke? What more do I need to investigate besides replacing that one part?
    #17
  18. Beezer

    Beezer Long timer

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    from post 14 "or most likely a broken compression release." which is what you have. my guess is that the threads are pulled out of the head on that one cam cap. remove the exhaust cam & check out the caps & cam journals and the holes. be careful... each hole has a dowel that sometimes falls out & can go into the engine (I Locktite them in). you may be able to Helicoil the damaged hole(s) in place, and if the rest isn't too beat up it can be reused. the compression release isn't really needed, remove the residue & fly on.

    if you can't fix the hole in place or there is other damage, the head will need to come off... that actually has advantages. it will let you clean things up & do a Stage I (or at least 1/2).... then it tempts you to 685/688 as well. think it over, all worth while mods

    for sure I would pull off the left side engine cover(s) and look for damage to the cam drive train. I suspect the cams may have jumped time, check to see if that happened. if so, valves may be bent. I would seriously consider replacing the cam chain since it was stressed. might as well do the doo while you are in there... worth the piece of mind.
    #18
  19. Beezer

    Beezer Long timer

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    ya, hard to tell in that last pic, but the cam lobes don't look right to me. when you have the piston at TDC on the compression stroke, the intake lobes point aft and the ex lobes point forward (like when you set/check valve clearance)..... so when the intakes are forward, the exhausts should point back & they don't look like they do. in fact, looking at the first couple pix the ex lobes are pointing down... I don't think thats right

    see the line on the intake gear with the blue dot.... there is a similar line on the ex gear. at TDC compression stroke, those 2 lines should be parallel to the gasket line on the head

    first.... undo the cam chain tensioner, it may be overly tight

    get the timing reset & do a compression check & see if valves are bent
    #19
  20. GreatWhiteNorth

    GreatWhiteNorth Long timer

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    Sorry for not re-reading entire thread - has the doohickey been done? Sometimes, when the stock spring or doohickey breaks, the broken parts will migrate and get caught in the cam chain or counterbalancer chain path. My understanding is this will usually result in catastrophic failure much like you seem to have experienced, but...

    - that cam cap bolt that's backed out is not good at all. If that cap is loose, the cam may have moved around and ruined the plain bearing surfaces (which ruins the head). Is the rear bolt on that cap tight? You'll need to remove the exhaust cam and inspect the bearing surfaces for damage.

    - even if the cam chain, counterbalancer chains are OK, the exhaust cam and cam bearing surfaces undamaged, the broken KACR may have damaged that exhaust valve (bent valve). Something is locking your engine up. You'll have to dissasemble further to figure it out. Suspect you won't like what you'll find.

    - Suggest removing both cams, suspend the cam chain (keep it tight by tying it up) and see if you can turn the bottom end over.

    Hopefully others chime in too.
    #20