17/17 or 19/17. Anything new?

Discussion in 'Crazy-Awesome almost Dakar racers (950/990cc)' started by PvtIdaho, Apr 1, 2013.

  1. PvtIdaho

    PvtIdaho Deck Spotter

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    When I've got dirt tires on the bike I miss having a street bike. I put Trail Attacks on it last year and now I miss having a dirt bike.

    I'm going to (finally) bite the bullet and get a set of street wheels in either 19/17 or 17/17 so I can leave DOT knobbies on the 21/18 OEM wheels.

    I think I've read most of the old threads on the subject. 19/17 looks like the easier route but limits the choice of tires. 17/17 probably adds the expense of a Scotts to the project.

    I'm looking at wheels from Woody's, KTM Twins, and have a note into CJ Racer regarding his 17/17 set up.

    My goal is to have a set up that can be swapped out quickly so I can save my wrench time for oil changes...

    An adjustable side stand is part of the plan.

    Am I missing anything?

    :ear

    ps If you can't get your bike to run at idle when you break it out in the spring, your 4 year old son may have turned your idle set screw all the way out. :baldy :lol3
    #1
  2. kingrj

    kingrj Been here awhile

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    I have the Woody's 19/17 wheel set and you lose trail when you go that small on the front. Handling was to twitchy until I jacked up the fork pre-load and reduced the shock pre-load to get the front of the motorcycle higher. Now I love the combo and would never go back. If you opt for the 17 front be SURE to ride one or talk to somebody who has because it will probably lose even more trail and that would make the bike scary to ride if you can't compensate for it. A set of fork lowers from the 990 SMT would cure that I am sure though..Just my two cents..

    Kingrj
    #2
  3. cjracer

    cjracer AWD please!!

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    Hi Kingrj, Have you ridden a 17/17 setup?

    I only ask b/c there seems to be a lot of people thinking and saying it's scary that have never even tried it for themselves. :ear



    I read so many posts saying it's "Scary" and it will be "Twitchy", yet every rider that has ridden one of our bikes setup with the 17/17 setups has loved it. None have been returned and when I loan them out, I often have to beg to get them back.

    I have had them setup on 950 ADV S and STD, 990 ADV R and STD, and a 950 SE and it's a blast. This setup is more stable than many sport bikes and comfortable. On the ADV bikes we don't have stabilizers on them and I don't make any suspension changes from dirt to street. It just works. The point of having 2 sets of wheels for me is to make a quick swap with out spending another hour messing with suspension setups and fork heights.

    The 950 SE would be even more Scary, but I love it more than the ADV. It's a light weight street weapon that is an awesome commuter bike by week and a wicked trail bike by on the weekend. My 950 SE has a Scotts stabilizer on it, more for dirt than street, but I find more 950 SE riders already have one installed. So I wouldn't say that just b/c you are going to 17"s you need to add a stabilzer into the price.

    If you are setting this up for TRACK use, well then sure, you may want to dial it in a bit, but my firmer dirt setup has been just fine to grind the pucks off my leathers and pass a few sport bikes with a smile. If you are a serious Track rider and are competitive, well I'd suggest a different bike.

    I have put these kits together for the casual track rider, commuter, back roads fun conversion and I'm working on getting more input from riders of all skill level this season so that real word accurate info can be presented. This has started up again last week. One of our local Road/track trainer coaches has a 990 ADV ABS. I set him up with my demo set of rims to play around on this spring. With his background he was very concerned about suspension setup and ride height change as many have stated around the forums. I told him to just take it for test ride "as is", come back and let me know what you think and then feel free to change as needed.

    After a 5 mile ride home to his house, a route he rides very often. He drove his truck back to my place. A little concerned when I saw that and I asked what's up, where is the bike and are you ok? He smiled and said "I'm just here to pick up the 21/18" rims so they are not in your way. The 17"s are going to be fun." His reply was, " I am shocked at how well it works right out of the box, I had no idea this bike was that versatile. It was more stable hands off the bars and changing direction with just body input than his R6 sport bikes. No tank slapper worries at all."

    I have a feeling he'll be getting this setup very soon for his bike to keep those nobbies fresh for the trails.

    When the 990SMT first came out and I rode it at the KTM dealer meeting, the first thing that came to my mind was, "This is just like my 950 ADV with 17s, but more cramped riding space and less touring range."

    I still feel the same way to this day as I'm a tall rider and need all the leg room I can get.

    How many of you have ridden 250/450/525cc Super moto bikes? This conversion is based on the same idea. I don't feel that the 17" setup is twitchy or scary on those bikes. I feel, and so have many other rider, that this setup is Responsive and it is something that takes a different riding style, but it's a very short learning curve.

    I feel if I'm going to put a set of "Street" tires on it, why not go full "Street" ? The 19/17 is still a compromise. I have ridden the 19/17 setup and it is fun, don't get me wrong, but I still felt like I was on thin dirt wheels compared to the 17". With the 17"s, we run 120 front and 180 rears. The same tire size specs for the 990 Superduke and most 1000CC bikes. Many tread patterns and sticky compounds are available and having a True Tubeless setup is nice for road/ track use. I feel confident at all speeds and types of use.

    It's great that we have such a wonderful bike and chassis setup that can accommodate so many different riding styles and modifications. Not one setup is perfect for everyone and only you can find what works best for you.

    Sorry for the long winded reply. I've been getting many questions about this lately and thought it better to put it in one place that all can find and comment on. If there is interest I will try and come back with more feedback in the future and anyone interested in trying these out locally, let me know. I normally have a bike set up or we can swap them on your bike so you can try them out for yourself.

    Safe travels,
    craig
    #3
  4. Nytro

    Nytro Been here awhile

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    I think CJ's comprehensive reply pretty much covers it, but I'll throw in my .02

    All of the comments I've read regarding the supposedly scary handling that is produced when installing 17" wheels have been made by people who have not actually ridden it and are only speculating based on "calculations" or reading it somewhere.

    I chose to ignore all this mental masturbation and installed the SD set up from CJ about a year ago. Three sets of tires later I can say it is fantastic! Not scary or twitchy or any of the other words people throw out to guess how it handles.

    I don't use a damper, but if I did it would be for the dirt wheels as those are twitchy ones.

    The 17's work.
    Happy deciding. Choices are good!

    Steve
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  5. Nowwhat

    Nowwhat I'll Go Second...

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    sooo scary.....bwahahahaha

    19"

    [​IMG]


    17"

    [​IMG]
    #5
  6. LocuL

    LocuL Gnarly Infantry

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    I have mostly ridden the 19/17 setup which i sold to fund some parts in my project. The 19/17 awsome and they could keep up in the tight corners with the squids.

    Now with my current ride i choose the 17/17 CJ setup, the 21/18 soft original and 21/18 excel destroyer setup. I did only ride 40km with the new 17/17 he other day on my virgin ride and they were inspiring in every bad way you could imagine. That fat rear really helps control some of the power this bike lay down. As the bike were new assembled and the tires where greasy new, i didn´t go hard in the corners. But first of all they were not twicthy, only wobble i could feel was a hard acceleration from 70-150km/t where the front more or less skipped the road road with stretched out forks. But i haven´t been doing the balancing yet. BTW my bike ride the 320mm suspension which should make it more wobbly in my opinion.

    [​IMG]
    #6
  7. PvtIdaho

    PvtIdaho Deck Spotter

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    Thanks for the replies.

    Great Pictures!
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  8. slackmeyer

    slackmeyer Don't mean sheeit. .

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    Craig really nailed it. Bike stability has to do with a lot of things, including weight balance and tire profile. Switching from 18/21 to 18/19 on my bike doesn't seem to make it any more twitchy, though redoing the suspension improved the bike's manners with both wheelsets (a lot).
    #8
  9. DirtyADV

    DirtyADV Long timer

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    Laced my own 17/17 and it works great!

    Have the gold box damper also but only crank that up off-road in sand.

    Can't see it as a must have cause of the Motard wheels.

    /Johan
    #9
  10. kingrj

    kingrj Been here awhile

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  11. -GUV-

    -GUV- Been here awhile

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    I've found 19" 18" combination extremely dangerous too:evil::wink::wink:
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  12. Katoom72

    Katoom72 Been here awhile

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    No fear of losing a foot? :huh
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  13. Nowwhat

    Nowwhat I'll Go Second...

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    Wearing a motorcycle boot (low top)

    Using the outside of my foot to gauge lean angle
    That is far enough with the wife on the back
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  14. Sporting Wood

    Sporting Wood I

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    That's a good idea Nowwhat. My wife punches me when her foot is dragging. Your system is far better!:freaky

    Glad you're still enjoying those wheels.
    #14
  15. Katoom72

    Katoom72 Been here awhile

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    I'm taught to keep the feet clear of the asphalt (tip on the pegs, heels tweaked inside) and use the knee as a gauge. Hard to do that with jeans ofcourse, something else that looks scary to me. :lol3

    To eatch their won i guess, nice to see you 2 having fun with the 990. :freaky
    #15
  16. Nowwhat

    Nowwhat I'll Go Second...

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    I also go swimming without waiting an hour after I eat.....:deal
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  17. Katoom72

    Katoom72 Been here awhile

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    :bow
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