2013 Kawasaki Ninja 300 vs. 2013 Honda CBR500R

Discussion in 'Road Warriors' started by GotMojo?, Nov 13, 2012.

  1. Bugz

    Bugz Been here awhile

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    Bullshit.

    I do agree to a certain extent; cars and motorbikes really can be build with a lot more of the durability factor in them though you are making things bigger than they really are. 10 years is not the average lifetime of a car. Cars last about 20-25 years in Holland and that's with a really salty and wet climate, and your average owner here just doesn't really take care of his or her car after it's something like 15 years old.

    My cars and motorbikes will last a long time.

    A modern sensible car will have much lower running costs compared to your 40 year old decent quality american cars. Cars actually last a lot of miles nowadays, are a lot more fuel efficient (Which is the biggest expense when looking at 2nd hand cars, 2nd biggest expense when looking at new cars due to depreciation) and a lot cheaper on maintenance (longer service intervals and less repairs).

    There are a few manufactures I wouldn't buy a car or a motorbike from. I'd stay away from the so called premium cars loaded with electronic bull crap but even they are pretty relieable.

    And at the end of the day; running costs are what's important when looking at a vehicle to transport you and your stuff.

    British cars and motorbikes good? Please enlighten me. I love the oldskool bikes but they've been for a lot famous; except reliability and durability.

    Your typical airlines and ship also does not last 50 years. They can last that long if you want but at some point maintenance costs will be higher than the depreciation of a new car ship or airplane. That's when you should replace nem (I agree that a lot of people do not do this. I'm riding on my 1st motorbike but I don't think I will only ride on this one for 30 years).
    #41
  2. sniper1rfa

    sniper1rfa Adventurer

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    :huh



    :rofl


    You've got to be joking.


    I don't even know how to respond, other than to say you're so far off base it's ridiculous. Get a job as a manufacturing engineer, then we'll talk about your absurd rant. Sure, some stuff is stupid, and there are incompetents, but on the whole I think you'll find the automotive sector to be full of the best and brightest and you'll realize that modern cars are some of the highest-quality products you can currently purchase for any price, let alone a measly $14k like a Fit, or $4k for a CBR or ninja 250 or whatever.

    If you want to see hugely inflated costs and unnecessary technology try the consumables section of the medical isle. Especially surgical consumables, simple implantables, and other "high-tech" but simple products. I used to make those, and the current healthcare climate in the US drives costs through the f'ing roof.
    #42
  3. scooterspirit

    scooterspirit Ilovekitty

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    That's a good looking bike, more interesting than the 700x, looks somehow so well proportioned for a solo rider. I bet there are going to be people turning in 80mpg US, saying you must not be riding it right if you only get 48. I would like to see screw type valve adjusters if it only turns 8.5K rpm.

    The ninja 300 looks more fun to me for around town and in the mountains. I like making the little motor scream for all it's worth, rowing the gears, just something about being right on the edge. The cbr250 is an amazing commuter which you can't really beat for the price. Kind of doubt the 500 will cruise happily at 85, but it probably feels pretty good at 75mph which is about the top for the 250. Then again the 300 sounds like it will cruise at 75 just fine.
    #43
  4. RaY YreKa

    RaY YreKa Palanquins RTW

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    Honda are claiming 76mpg, imperial.
    #44
  5. Grainbelt

    Grainbelt marginal adventurer Super Moderator

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    divide by 4.55, multiply by 3.8... 63.5 miles per 'merican gallon
    #45
  6. RaY YreKa

    RaY YreKa Palanquins RTW

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    It won't get that, obviously.

    Still, it should be almost as frugal as a G650GS, but with a tad more road presence and top-end.

    By which I mean, 47bhp will reach 100mph, but it will take a long time to get there.
    #46
  7. Grainbelt

    Grainbelt marginal adventurer Super Moderator

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    I'd probably gear it down for harder acceleration and less top end. I need that 60-80mph 4th gear burst more than I need the last ten mph of top speed.

    Wonder how wide the ratios are... :scratch
    #47
  8. RaY YreKa

    RaY YreKa Palanquins RTW

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    No idea. I had an old battered CB500 (57bhp) that could do the ton, and liked it, but I felt like a jockey whipping a horse.

    That's why I hope the torque curve is decent for these bikes.
    #48
  9. Dankarnov

    Dankarnov Adventurer

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    If you're throwing the KTM 390 into the mix I'd also note the Suzuki DR-Z400S & SM are back this year. If you want street excitement and are willing to put up with a dirtbike seat and a little higher cost the SM might be the way to go, it's got significantly higher spec suspension / brakes stock than the little CBR and Ninja.
    #49
  10. Cortez

    Cortez BAZINGA!

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    Not a chance.

    Only if they make the bike more powerful then they say it is to
    conform to EU licencing regulations etc.

    I'm gonna guess 40hp at the wheel tops.
    How much does NC700X have? Anyone?
    #50
  11. scooterspirit

    scooterspirit Ilovekitty

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    I say your right about the 500, that would put it right in the middle of the line up.
    The 500 would have almost twice the torque @30ftlb vs 17 on the ninja. I do like the clip on arrangement better than sport bars on the ninja side. Someone mentioned Honda is a classic looker.

    >>Honda claims a peak of 51 hp at a modest 6250 rpm rated at the crankshaft, which will likely translate into about 45 horses at its 160/60-17 rear tire. The Versys cranks out a relatively whopping 60 fillies. The NC’s torque rating of 45.7 ft-lb. at a low 4750 rpm is more impressive, promising a broad and linear powerband. Honda claims the NC700X gets a remarkable 63.5 mpg, which may translate into a range of up to 235 miles from its 3.7-gallon fuel cell.
    http://www.motorcycle.com/manufacturer/honda/2012-honda-nc700x-preview-91209.html
    #51
  12. dman

    dman Been here awhile

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    Just a comment on power-to-weight calculations. ABSOLUTE light weight is good for handling, but when you add the weight of a rider and gear to the bike, the RELATIVE percentage difference in power-to-weight ratio is reduced significantly, since the rider weighs the same whether they're riding a 350 lb or 400 lb bike. 50 lbs difference in a 550 lb total weight is less than 10%; and Honda's HP advantage is more than that.

    FWIW I looked at and sat on both these bikes a few days ago at the bike show, and I think the Honda is probably a better deal for the US market. But the Ninja is still very appealing.

    -dman
    #52
  13. Navin

    Navin Long timer

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    There is more than power to weight to consider, and 50 lbs means alot on a tight road or while braking. The bikes will appeal to different tastes in a similar range. Personally, I'd want the Ninja another 50 lbs lighter! :deal

    The 300 pulls 2 up just fine too. There is no danger of lofting the front wheel corner to corner but you can zip right up to almost 90 MPH in fourth and pulling away from traffic is easy shifting at 8k RPMs.

    I'd recommend the Honda to friends but I'm expecting it to be more tame than the already kinda tame 300. The fact that I'm riding mine at under 7k RPMs 99% of the time tells me they went easy on the cams on the 300. I'd like to try it with a top end biased curve but then again, it does really well in the mid and will still pull all the way to over 12k so hard to really complain.
    #53
  14. Davidc83

    Davidc83 Been here awhile

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    #54
  15. Navin

    Navin Long timer

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    In all fairness, those issues were probably not related to who assembled them but production parts that were faulty and upgraded to corrected tolerances. That engine is in what, its 75th year of production now? :lol3

    Chain life can't be attributed to where it was installed either.
    #55
  16. kojack

    kojack My Hardley is a POS

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    Exactly. Look at chev for example, built in America, but a garbage product. Crap is crap no matter where its built. Same goes for good products.

    Sent from my ARCHOS 80G9 using Tapatalk 2
    #56
  17. Zammy

    Zammy Been here awhile

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    [​IMG]

    If your gonna compare apples to oranges.....:wink:
    #57
  18. Navin

    Navin Long timer

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    Not fair, decent brakes!!! Great power!!! Foul!!! :lol3

    I don't see these Hondas lighting the market on fire in the USA. the ER6-n was a better bike in most ways from where I sit, it was a sales flop.
    #58
  19. opmike

    opmike Choosing to be here.

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    The ER6-n was every bit as visually appealing as a Gladius, and I never actually saw one on the sales floor. I don't have a hard time believing the CBR500R will outsell the ER6.

    Also, with regard to brakes, have the NC700 owners made any complaints about the brakes? The race version of the CBR500 (as did the 690 Duke its replacing) also retains the single front disc. I understand regulations limit what you can and can't do to the bikes, but there's a helluva more that goes into a braking system than number of discs.
    #59
  20. danketchpel

    danketchpel Long timer

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    Boy, did this thread turn into a whole lotta something about where the bike is made rather than what it's about.

    I am happy to see manufacturers offering more cost conscious bikes. I can understand they have to cut some corners on quality and apparently where it's built, but that does give the consumer some options. You DON'T HAVE TO BUY IT if you don't like it, but maybe it will allow some bloke to get into motorcycling where maybe he/she might not be able to afford to before. Of course there's always used, but maybe some want to buy a new bike. Triumph has been doing this with their twin cylinder bikes and I've ridden the Thruxton, it's a nice bike, I'd love to have one in my garage. I think it's a bargain.

    In comparison to the Ninja 300, it seems apples to oranges to me. I'd compare the CB500X to the Versys 650 and the CB500R to the Ninja 650, that appears closer to me. The Honda is cheaper and less displacement and power than the Kawi. I don't see too many bikes in the 500 class right now. Once upon a time we had nice even class breakes, 250, 500, 750, 1000. Now you've got a jumble of sizes and have to compare those apples and oranges.

    I'd have to ride the new CB500 to know how it stacks up. I've ridden the Versys 650 (not the Ninja) and I've ridden the Ninja 300, plus the old Ninja 500. Also bunch of older parallel twins from Honda, CB 360s, Hawk 400, etc. Honestly I'm not a fan of 180 deg parallel twins. I wish Honda had chosen to put a 270 crank in the new CB500 engine.

    I think this bike is right in line with those older Honda "budget" twins, people have just forgotten that Honda once offered such bikes. To me there's a huge jump from the 250/300 class to a 500 class bike in terms of torque. You don't have to rev the piss out of a 500 class bike to pass a car, the 300 needs to be above 10k rpm to make a pass, that's the difference and what that means to you is important. The 300 is a sweet bike for it's size, no complaints, it's just what's important for your riding style and budget.
    #60