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Discussion in 'Ridiculous streetbikes with 6 CPUs and too much ho' started by goodcat8, Apr 23, 2012.
I really don't get it, the 1190R has 21/18 set-up and has a switch-able off-road mode that drops bike to 100 BHP, disables the ABS and alters the traction control - how can this be less capable than the 990Adv now?
Given the sales figures for motorcycles around Europe right now, KTM would be criminally negligent if they didn't go after the GS/ST/Explorer market share and the standard 1190 does that - but surely the R carries KTMs off-road legacy?
I get that a percentage of the users here want a lightweight 690 Adventure, you all certainly bang on about it enough so this bike (in either format) probably just isn't for you, get over it.
You think it is sad for KTM to build bikes in market segments where they can profitably grow their business? I think this is a good move by KTM. KTM is a business not a charilty and i think you should look at it from the perspective that if KTM doesnt build bikes for a larger audience they never will be able to sustan building the bikes you want. The good news is I believe KTM will not dilute from it's core capabilities as a 'ready to race' company. IMO they have a corporate mission and culture that will continue to focus on hard core dirt and performance products like the xbow for example. but the realities of the motorcycle business dictate they need 'mainstream' products to fund the wild side otherwise there will be no more KTM. For what it is worth i am a loyal KTM customer and i know who john penton is and the 1190 is on the top of my list!
This does not appear to be an imitation of a GS, Multistrada, or Explorer... Rather KTM's entry to a segment THE MARKET defined. And it is distinctly KTM. More power than competition, less weight by far save MTS which is sport touring bike reall anyway, option for 21"/18" wheels, and on and on.
The funniest part is how many people are lamenting the production end of a bike that is now more than 10 years old, besides there are plenty of 12's, and 11's languishing on dealership floors... Go buy one.
Everyone that is commenting on the bikes (lack of)abilities is comical, having nothing more than vague details that spec sheet wise, only place this bike a few lbs heavier, and some pictures. To not like how the book looks is fine, but it is pretty damn hard to judge what it's contents are that way, my god no one has even reviewed it yet. I have tasted the engine in this bike and it is leagues better than its competition. Unless something is fundamentally flawed with the design of the chassis, other than looks, this bike is destined for greatness.
Based on what I see and read, I agree.
I can't help but think that most of the weeping and gnashing of teeth and rending of garments is just the normal Adv dick waving about how KTM should build a bike that them and Meoni would be able to exploit :
I'd guess if you can't do it on an 1190, you wouldn't be able to do it on a 950.
We heard the same thing about what a turd the 990 was when it replaced the 950, and that didn't work out all that bad. I owned a 2004 950S and now own a 990, and think in every respect the 990 is better (and I thought the 950S was GREAT) with one odd exception-- the 950S suspension gave a better, real magic carpet, street ride-- and one normal carb/FI characteristic that it dropped to low revs smoother.
Say no more!
btw the MTS is NO less than 230kg fully fueled....
Everytime I see the 1190 photos and hearing more about the specifications, it becomes better.
I am not an offroader, but besides heating my legs and it's short range, I have always enjoyed riding my 990. I believe KTM will add enough off roading capabilities on this bike; this is something expected from them, unlike most of the other brands.
On the other hand, this is true that, not all of us, the large cc bike riders are more offroaders than occasionally riding on loose tracks. It doesn't matter, even if you don't ride hard offroad, you like riding something, which is well known of being capable doing this.
I will be in Cologne and I am waiting forward to see the new Adventure. However, still need to see personally that, it won't boil me in warm Turkish summers and it is riding at least 300 km before the light. (am I dreaming?)
Sorry to offend... I don't think our opinions are far off from each other. My word choice is not the best. I know it is a business and I know it will grow their market segment. It is also a good business for them to be in. I am making assumptions about the bike and KTM's marketing plans by looking at pictures. It is probably a bad idea to post opinions based on pictures. When I look at those spy photos I see vstrom-esque or tenere-esque and not advenutre-esque. That doesn't fit with my "race" view of KTM. That is all I was trying to say.
When the 950 adv was released there was nothing like it. It was a market maker. Today, there are lots of 1200 cc adventure touring bikes on the market. My assumption is that this is the market they are trying to compete in. No? I could be completely wrong, that is what it looks like to me.
I am sure if KTM builds it, it will be great bike, they all are. Also this does not dissuade me from buying any KTM or even an 1190. I don't think they "sold out" or anything; I am also a loyal KTM owner. If the 1190 leans more to the touring market then I hope they leave some room in their lineup for the off road adventure crowd. Maybe a 690 adventure would fit the bill. Otherwise I will be sad.
Way better looking than Mutli IMO.
My biggest problem, based on photos alone, is the central fuel cap. Not having to remove the tankbag to fill up is one of the aspects of the 990 I really liked beyond its competitors.
Seems petty, but if you're doing a long trip with lots of fill ups it makes a big difference.
My tank bag unzips from the base to allow for easy fueling, so I don't have to remove to fuel my SM. I think you might be worrying about a problem that doesn't really exist.
I think this bike looks AWESOME and if I were not still in love my SM I would seriously be considering it. I think KTM will show why they remain the best maker in this segment. Don't be afraid of progress.
They mention low fuel consumption on KTM site. If this is for real and the tank is 23 liters, than we may be refuelling in longer periods than the 990.
I like the 990's and liked my old 950 too. I think they are iconic designs, much the way many of the Ducati's have been over recent decades. I just hate to see the KTM twins end up so boring to look at.
They should have retained that beautiful trellis chassis and kept the styling minimalist. The new bike has no character.
Oh well. I love my 690R and it may be the last new bike I buy anyways. It has more character than anything I've owned. The chassis is the prettiest part of the motorcycle and they hung a lot of really nice parts on it.
Also, their dirt bike line has become remarkably high fit and finish and many of them are street legal too. Still plenty fast, as an example my son topped out at 96mph in the Mexican 1000 last spring. Not bad for a 350 dual sport. :eek1
KTM is finally having great success in USA motocross, not to mention their hot new Moto3 GP bikes.
As long as they keep producing beautiful performance machines like my 690 and son's 350 and 200, I guess I can accept them going after the BMW market with the 1190. Some of us wouldn't be caught dead on a BMW so maybe they actually pick up some market share. I'd never want one, nor any of the other bike bikes trying to steal GS 1200 sales, though.
While I respect many of yalls opinions and know that most of you have more experience than my mere 9k miles on a 9x0 adventure, what I'm getting here is 42 pages of,
"The Adventure 9x0 is soo good, we don't think KTM can ever build anything better, or even as good, so they shouldnt try, ever, and if they do, we won't buy one just on principle."
Yeah its got more power, but it doesn't weigh any more.
Yeah it looks like a vstrom, but just looking at the 9x0 doesnt reveal its offroad prowess either.
I agree the 9x0 is that good. I agree it will be hard to beat or even match. But I'm glad KTM is trying, rather than keeping the 9x0 around for 25 years till its so obsolete KTM isnt even competitive anymore. And from what Ive seen, they haven't missed the mark by too much. But rather than base my opinion on how ugly it is, I'll reserve judgement till i ride one.
No hate here
I thought a dual-tanked bike which can be filled with the tankbag in place was progress!
KTM has a pretty good track record of building progressively better bikes I would say. When you are building race bikes you have to put a competitive product on the market, with road bikes it's rider desires.
It looks like oil changes and other maintenance should be easier which is one gripe the public had about our 9x0s. The weight staying down is cool, but does the new style have the same sweet off road feel is something I'm wondering about.
Most guys here chose the 950/990 OVER the BMWs and Ducatis. They had more dirt in their blood. If you bought a 950-990 thinking it was a better BMW or Ducati or V-Strom I guess this bike should thrill you? I know what I would want in a new gen Adv, lighter, thinner ergos and better sump protection. This fails on all counts. The last thing I'd have asked for is more power. I'm sure this will fit more riders needs, or their perceived needs I guess, but for the riders who chose the 950-990s over this style bike it holds little to be desired IMO.
Then again, mine had knobbies on it most of the time and my SE does today. It looks like a mongo SMT to me, not interested. The last black & white Adv R 990 tempted me but my SE is a better choice. If they built a Adv version of the SE they'd have impressed me!
Walt, I don't know how you plan to use another 50+ HP, you barely have either tire on the ground now!
Sorry.. couldn't resist
(I'm kind of worried a big orange truck full of Austrians will show up at my house and take all of my KTMs away )
I just hope there will be 690 adventure in the near future, and that's what most people here would love.
On the other hand I don't 'think the new 1190 will not do gravel well, let's wait for the first ride reports.
Some say that in US it will be model 2014, I guess EU will do the beta run of this product.