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Discussion in 'Trials' started by X5-, Nov 19, 2016.
Thanks for the additional info Motobene!
The first time I recall seeing a plastic silencer was the 1992 BETA ZERO, so this is not something that came about recently.
but the seat of the problem was STUPID plastic parts, sorry. I mean my older bikes were not the 1st bikes to melt the plastic "guards" off the seat area, so what STUPID engineering student, says "eh, we can save $2 on each muffler if we make the last 4 inches out of plastic?" I mean equals 'give me your lighter, I cannot see if I have gas in here' stupid to me. Just sayin.
To be fair, they do this in a lot products/brands to sell more? I used to work on power hand tools for a living, how many times they replaced metal brush holders with plastics that fail outside warranty, because the plastic cooks itself to melting, or shatters, but they usually sold another because it "mysteriously" died on the user.
Being on the 'stupid' engineering side for a long time, 'just saying' stupid engineering and cheaper comments are very easy to make. All design is a compromise of competing requirements, like low weight and space efficiency and cost. Those compromises can of course become whipping boys.
One previous muffler design of Sherco was all aluminum, and unrebuildable. The new Sherco uses? Polymer end caps. GasGas? Polymer end caps. The new TRS? Polymer end caps. Beta? Polymer end caps. Vertigo? No polymer end caps, but their unusual muffler has no cost or functional advantage with one (and may be unrebuildable). Polymer end caps aren't such a good idea on 4Ts because exhaust temperatures are much higher.
Going back further we had straight aluminum extrusions with steel end caps. Very simple and cheap, but they stuck out and could damage the center muffler when pushed in during a crash. No melting potential, but they were a pain in the as for other reasons.
The glass-filled polymer muffler end caps allowed design to progress and at a reasonable cost. The polymer ends could be molded, allowing for more sophisticated complex contour shapes at a cost you an I can afford. They tuck in nicely and work quite well. With a modicum of muffler fire awareness and no huge direct impacts, they work very well. Hand that swoopy Sherco end cap to a manufacturing engineer and tell him you want one in the same shape in aluminum and just as easy to fit and reliable too... and make it cheap. You will get a chuckle and a shake of the head.
Gas Gas has announced for 2018 the Contact gets E-Start. Could be the ultimate trail bike for gals or guys who don't like kick starting.
Seems like a good move for that bike. I believe the Vertigo Vandal will have it as well (or so I seem to recall).
That could make it a great wife-bike in my house.
Well, I find myself over here on the "darkside" of ADV, thanks to GG and their "free demo's" this week at MMM. Being a long time closet trials lurker, all it took was 20 min with Charlie to get me hooked.
Now the question is, which bike? 250 Contact or 280 Racing
At first I thought the seat of the contact would be great for trail riding... But how far can you really go on .8 gallon of gas?! Maybe I should just go full competition bike and actually give this thing a full effort?! I am sure that I am going to suck at it but, with only few instructions I was able to ride the VERY basic demo course with no dabs (twice). Maybe I can do this?
Seems to be a lot of knowledge here.
You don't want a 280 racing if you're a trials beginner. The 280 is the quickest hitting motor there is, you'd be better off on a 300 in my opinion (if the only options were a 280 or a 300).
If you want to get started riding and competing in trials, get a 250. If you want a trials bike for trail riding, I'll bite my tongue, but in short, I think there are better options.
I rode the 250 Contact. I really liked it... I just figured for competition the TXT 280 would be better?
I may have mislead about trail riding... We have the GS and a TT for that. I want to give trials a go. My "trail riding" comment was directed at the small tank nature of a trials bike.
I live fairly close to an area that has trials events often and would like to get involved. I was just thinking the txt280 was set up for competition more so than the contact but, I wanted to ask you guys who know more than I about this...
250 txt would be better for starting competing but the 250 contact would be a second choice followed by 300 then 280... but that is just me. I started on a 200txt and would suggest that if they still made them (I'm 6'1" 200 lbs) the 200 was plenty bike for most people starting out.
I just threw out the 250 contact and the 280 because they were in stock and available. For about a weeks worth of patience, I believe a 250 txt could be had. While available, I'm not certain I want to drop to a 125.
What I'm trying to avoid is buying something and later finding out that for only a few dollars more (or a weeks worth of patience more), I could have bought exactly what I needed...
Thanks for the inputs, as I read through the threads here, I see I'm NOT the first person to ask this. My apologies.
If you do plan to compete a bit I would wait on a txt250... will most likely keep you will entertained until you reach the expert line and even then may be more than adequate. Here is another thread on the subject... http://advrider.com/index.php?threads/the-rediscovery-of-the-250s.1215501/
I think the contact is a great starter and super fun trail machine but am guessing you might be looking for a txt in a few years (depending how fast a learner you are). Being able to adjust forks and having a little lighter bike are reasons I could see wanting to move to the txt... as far as I can see the motor is the same (not sure about the carb)
I think the contact would work you will have to change tires btw I would estimate a 39 mile range on fuel riding trails. But if you got the bucks to spend get a txt250 if they can be had I didnt want to wait so I bought gp250 extra money mostly for bling and looks.
As stated above anything more than a 250 and you might find it more difficult to learn trials at the early stage and a 250 will go well into advanced/expert level without any issues. A TXT250 over a contact would be a great call for what it sounds like your interested in doing.
For reference, I am 5' 10" 190lbs ride intermediate to advanced and after just over 4 years am skill wise still not able to get my 250 to do anything I can't make my wife's TXT125 do. I admit it needs more throttle and clutch work for some of the bigger stuff but I can still do it. Heck I can do almost everything on my daughters Beta 80 I can do on my 250, except maybe the big hill climbs...
Hope that helps give you some perspective on motor size to what they can do.
Thanks a lot! This is why I posted here. I would have simply bought the 280 without knowing the difference. I'm going to get in touch with them today if I have time and get a 250 on order.
You trials guys aren't as bad as everyone says, after all.
Get the dealer to show you the proper starting technique... easier on a 250 than a 280 but still important to give it a proper kick and easier to have somebody show you than try to explain in writing.
You know, they are a bit different to kick over. They showed me on the 250 Contact but, excellent advice. Thanks!
Just my $0.02.......I currently ride a '14 Sherco 3.0 ST (~300cc) in Intermediate. My next bike will be a 250. I've ridden a '15 Sherco 250 and the two are very, very similar. You're going to want to "slow down" the bike anyways and a 250 will do you just fine for several years. Look into a flywheel weight, slow throttle tube and perhaps a c/s sprocket with one less tooth.
jonny mentioned his daughter's Beta 80. I know someone, in my club, that won the Advanced class on one of those bikes. It's currently ridden, well, by someone in Novice/Intermediate. The 250 will be perfect.
The Race (they dont make std TXT's anymore) is a great bike, but you pay for it. I would get the contact, learn the fundamentals and sell it when im ready to move out of the novice class. Will cost you less in depreciation and you can crash the cheap bike just as well as any.
The Contact is a very capable bike for starting out.