270-280-290-300 Gasgas questions???

Discussion in 'Trials' started by LSMick, Feb 11, 2015.

  1. LSMick

    LSMick Adventurer

    Joined:
    May 15, 2012
    Oddometer:
    58
    Location:
    Flatlander from the midwest
    I have been looking at used bikes. The most popular search has given me the mid-2000's for my humble budget. Gasgas is the number one for sale bike and I found one that looks well loved.

    BUT and that's a big BUT, the engine sizes are all different. I'm too big( just under 250 and dropping) for a 125 and very green for a ton of power.

    How much different is a 270 from a 300TXT ? As a bigger rider and looking at novices riding at the most, will a 300 be better, worst or just right?

    One more question..
    Are Gasgas dealers in peoples houses? I looked up on the web site for nearest dealer and it looks like peoples houses. What's the deal with that??

    I'm ready to go riding:clap:clap

    p.s. sorry if all of this has been asked before, I'm just an old bike rider, give me a break......
    #1
  2. jonnyc21

    jonnyc21 Trials Ninja

    Joined:
    Feb 8, 2011
    Oddometer:
    2,890
    Location:
    Boise aria
    There is lots of great threads on first trials bike size here if you run a search or two. (sorry didn't do this for the bike size threads, however...)

    My 2 cents based on what you listed here... I am a small bike for a first trials bike fan, however at 250 lbs I would suggest starting with a 250, however if all you can find is a 280 or 300 there are some great threads on mellowing them out to help make them smother and if your mechanically inclined well worth the change from what many have experienced.

    Best of luck, and here are a few options on taming the beasts. :freaky

    Quite the fain of motobene's work so here is some great info...

    Flywheel Weights:
    http://advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=984093

    Timing Retardation:
    http://advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=967983

    Changing Ignition Modules:
    http://advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=955152
    #2
  3. lineaway

    lineaway Long timer

    Joined:
    Oct 1, 2011
    Oddometer:
    7,902
    Location:
    nm
    A 250 is fine, or the 300. The 280`s not the thing to ride. I`m not so sure I would be looking at Gassers. The factory has been closed now for 3 weeks. Trials is a very small sport, very few real shops ever bother with trials. The dealers are just like everything else. Some are quite knowledgeable, some just want a deal on their own bike. Ask around at a trials. The riders will fill in the blanks.
    #3
  4. Sting32

    Sting32 Trials Evangelist

    Joined:
    Oct 27, 2009
    Oddometer:
    1,825
    Location:
    Minneapolis, Ks
    for the other lurkers, Mick lives near GG's importer, there are lots of gassers around here of course. I say he'll have to come to an event and ride a few. Hell, he might like beta, who knows. Mick I swear, on 99 people, over 220 lbs, you will want the 300, probably NOT a raga, yet even a raga can be tamed a bit. UNTIL the "peg time" increases as your skills develop, any bike will seem 'weird' you know, compared to the dirtbikes, but the 125 for you, is out of bounds... a 250 is fine, more or less good enough power, around here that is the perfect for women, who are more than a few months into trials. (see the low displacement thread)...

    keep in touch, the last I knew mick, they're going to be at a farm west of Leavenworth this weekend... not sure if I will be there as weather isn't looking to be super nice?
    #4
  5. laser17

    laser17 Long timer

    Joined:
    Mar 6, 2008
    Oddometer:
    1,360
    Location:
    Boston,Massachusetts
    The new 250's have PLENTY of power for anyone upto the expert level. A 250 with a black throttle tube and a 10T CS is a terrific setup for the Novice to intermediate rider. As mentioned, The 300 can be smoothed out to be an easy ride as well, but the 250 has a lighter feel and easier to start for most new riders just starting out- unless you are the type who loves a super powerful bike. The 300 has the advantage when riding the loop in terms of smiles per mile. 4th gear roll on wheelies are a snap. However, the extra power can be a real liability in a tight trials section unless tamed down alot. If you ride in GG country - grab a ride or two on a few different bikes. Its common in trials for people to go out of their way to pull new riders into the sport and a test ride usually isn't a problem. Ask the local dealer for help. Bring beer.
    #5
  6. LSMick

    LSMick Adventurer

    Joined:
    May 15, 2012
    Oddometer:
    58
    Location:
    Flatlander from the midwest
    Thanks guys. The last trials bike I rode was a Yamaha TY250 and that was in the 90's. I have been watching the want adds for trials bikes and there are a lot of Gasgas'. What I, as an outsider have noticed is they go from 250-260-270-280-290 and 300 but all weigh the same. I wanted to know, is there a lot of difference between them? None of the bike dealers around have trials bikes for sale for me to just look. I'll have to travel to see any.

    I'll try and be patient and go to an event. Leavenworth isn't that far from me but I'll be out of town this weekend. Is there a calendar online of trials in the midwest?

    Thanks all, now back to lurking
    #6
  7. laser17

    laser17 Long timer

    Joined:
    Mar 6, 2008
    Oddometer:
    1,360
    Location:
    Boston,Massachusetts
    The GG lineup since 2003 has been three sizes. These are TXT "PRO" models.

    a 250 = actual 249cc
    280 = actual 272cc
    300 = actual 294cc

    Yes- they all feel different. More so than you would think for a simple 20cc difference

    Heres how they feel. (IMO)

    250 - has a nice light weight feel with a snappy motor. Will rev freely and has a very linear power curve vs rpm.

    280 - feels like the 250 on steroids. Most noticeable is a midrange hit that can catch folks off guard if not used to it.

    300 - very linear power, like the 250 - just more of it - everywhere. add a fly wheel weight and its a torque monster. The 300 can be difficult for lighter newbies to start compared to the 250.


    The old 270 was a different engine as was the 321. They never made a 260 or 290.

    You can look up the diffent bikes on the GG website and the old ones have info here - http://www.gasgasmuseum.com/
    #7
  8. 2whlrcr

    2whlrcr gooligan

    Joined:
    Jan 30, 2005
    Oddometer:
    11,627
    Location:
    Dubuque, Iowa
    And for quite a few years GG 280, Beta 270 and Sherco 290's were all 272cc.

    Where in the midwest do you live? I have a GG 250 that I might sell, but it's probably over your budget at being a 2012.
    #8
  9. 1fxstbi

    1fxstbi Been here awhile

    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2014
    Oddometer:
    407
    Location:
    Texas, hell ya!
    I started in trials last year and got a 280 that the first owner had put a 10 tooth sprocket and 12 ounce flywheel weight in it and it is very mellow with great torque. I haven't ridden a stock 280 to feel what hit it might have but I can recommend the set up I have. My 2 cents.......
    #9
  10. DerViking

    DerViking Shred

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2006
    Oddometer:
    1,013
    Location:
    Black Bill Park
    The 300's are very linear. I find the 250 kinda gutless, and the 280 a little too hot. The mid range hit is a great description, they feel like they want to loop out on you.

    My 300 currently has a thick base gasket due to some mechanical errors, and it definitely mellowed the bike. I will probably go back to stock when I have time.

    The 300s can be ridden on the throttle more than the others. You can get more power while on an obstacle without having to clutch and Rev the shit out of it. The beta 250 I spent time on was madening for how inclined to stall it was.
    #10
  11. Sting32

    Sting32 Trials Evangelist

    Joined:
    Oct 27, 2009
    Oddometer:
    1,825
    Location:
    Minneapolis, Ks

    I like everything you have said above, exactly how I feel, except I hate reading (every time) that the 300 seems so scary for newbies...

    TO be blunt and honest, IMHO there are 2 types of riders we call newbies, and I actually think it is harder to quantify for "conversation" as a written guide.

    I have a former woods racer newbie, he gave up the MX type riding due to injury, it still affects his leg. He is all of probably 145 lbs, 5'7", but in great shape... You know what his first ever trials bike was? used 2009 Raga 300.

    I have a neighbor, he's an avid rider, I don't know if I could say he's gifted or just average, I dont think he's raced or anything. He's probably 180 lbs or less, I think he could POSSIBLY be spooked with my 225 kitted 125. But only for about the first couple hours under his belt. But he would have (just sayin) some expert tutoring.

    What I don't know or get is, how the rest of the world does it I guess? Do ya'll buy the first trials bike, then go attempt that 6ft ledges and shit? or do you do like I have my newbies do, practice on flat ground (my yard) doing turns, learning to control the clutch and throttle, all while standing up, which is the KEY difference of trials bikes, that and speed, and lack of centrifugal forces you use at speeds above 5mph...

    I guess in the same manner, most would recommend that EVERYONE should own for the first "any motorcycle" a freaking trail 90, or some shit? :eek1:eek1

    Hell I recall I had ridden cycles for 14 of my 19 years the first time I saddled my ass on a yz465... DId that sob need a warning sticker, and probably a form you sign each time you start the SOB, that this SOB could hurt you, and you have read the stickers... That lasted about 30 minutes though. I mean I learned QUICKLY to respect the throttle, wiskey throttle kills you on that machine, I argue it will HURT anyone, even those who get on my ty80... So what is the point.

    after reading all my thoughts, and the OP's thoughts, by all means make your choice, I am not going to snicker out loud or poke fun, I personally am going to welcome you to the dark side if I ever meet you, and smile as you get better every time you ride.

    the point I mean is there is nothing in a trials bike, as we have been describing that is the "your lunch eating, big bore man killer" but there is the "froze, at the worst possible moment" or "didn't know what to do or react" moments in everyone, we bury them with experience, least that is the PLAN.
    #11
  12. motobene

    motobene Motoing for 46 years

    Joined:
    Mar 9, 2013
    Oddometer:
    4,874
    Location:
    Wichita Mountains SW Oklahoma
    Sting makes a good point.

    We all like to discuss the nuances between displacement, but of all types of motorcycles, the trials bikes have by far the least difference in parts between 125 and 300. A 125 is a 300 is a 125 except for the crank stroke, ignition, flywheel, top end, and sprockets. That's about it. They even share the same carburetors and exhaust systems.

    There are differences in feel, especially between 125s and 250s plus, but often people buy whatever nice used bike comes available, 250, 280, or 300, then they get to know and appreciate what they bought.

    No one wants to make a buying mistake, but if there are mistakes made I think it's going too cheap/old/beat up.

    And let's say a fellow buys a 125 because it's so easy to learn on, or one floats by that jiggles the nards enough to say yes. Then later, more umph for less clutch and throttle work is desired. Not to worry! A 225 kit and a flywheel weight and bigger countershaft sprocket - all for reasonable money, and the 125 becomes transformed into a very respectable 250.

    Or maybe a 280 is bought and it seems a little to quick when the mind gets lazy. This forum is chock full of info on how to mellow these bikes.

    So... if a cherry used bike floats by the awareness, or a new bike is chosen, don't worry much. Ride and enjoy!:clap
    #12
  13. GapRunr

    GapRunr Been here awhile

    Joined:
    Oct 22, 2005
    Oddometer:
    577
    Location:
    East TN / Smokies
    We certainly live in a world of "bigger is better".

    I haven't seen anyone mention it yet but in the early 2000's there were two different model lines if GasGas. There was the Pro which was newer, lighter, faster, and then there was the TXT Edition which was the outgoing model.

    The TXT Edition's were the last versions of Gas Gas to have a heavy flywheel. With the quest to make bikes lighter, manufacturers started going to lighter flywheels and other components, then consumers would buy the flywheel weights as an aftermarket accessory. The Pro models were lighter than the TXT Edition and they had more power and better suspension, but the TXT had plenty of power and suspension for anyone riding up to at least the Sportsman class. In 2000 those bikes were adequate for world champions.

    I was riding in an event a few months ago and was stopped next to a Gas Gas dealer while we were waiting for a guy on a GG300 riding the expert class to finish a section, and I commented on how nice the 300 looked and that I had been tempted to upgrade. His response was "Yeah, they are nice, but don't get anything bigger than a 250. You don't need that power until you get to the expert level. You could get a new 250, drop the front sprocket one tooth, put on the slower throttle tube and then add a really big flywheel weight and you would have a bike *almost* as good as your TXT Edition" . For what its worth, he is on the high side of 230 pounds and competes in a GG125. I've never been able to beet him.

    Since then I have ridden several newer bikes. A Gas Gas 250, Beta 300, Sherco 290, and while they are all very nice, none of them made me want to sell mine and upgrade.

    I'm a little over 6' and with gear on I'm pushing 245 or 250. I've never had a situation where I didn't have enough power. And while having more power could be nice, all it does is let me use power to overcome my lack of skill in a situation. In my opinion a smaller bike will help you learn better technique.

    I've got a friend who has a Beta 300 with a few trick bits added to it. A really sweet bike. It's being serviced now and waiting for parts so he borrowed our Beta 125. He's loving it and he rides the Advanced line. He's actually looking for a used 125 now to use as a practice bike. He feels that it helps him better develop his technique.

    So what am I trying to say? This is America, where bigger is better. It's why people commute to work alone in Suburbans and F350 Quad Cab duallies instead of car pooling in a Civic. Don't let that type of thinking prevent you from at least looking at a smaller trials bike. Go to a local club event, bring boots and a helmet, and try different bikes. A newer 125 has almost the same power as a 15 year old 250 or 300. The difference in weight on the scales between a 125 and a 300 is less than a few pounds, but when you are riding it the 125 "feels" significantly lighter. No matter what you end up with, getting it set up and dialed in for you will have a much greater positive effect than simply buying the biggest one you can afford.
    #13
  14. motobene

    motobene Motoing for 46 years

    Joined:
    Mar 9, 2013
    Oddometer:
    4,874
    Location:
    Wichita Mountains SW Oklahoma
    Gaprunr, I see you have a KLR 250. What a great bike! I have two of them.

    The modern crank and flywheel mass isn't that low, compared to, say, a Fantic. I think with the added flywheel weight they are close to spot on, as in not too heavy.

    The joy of the 125s is the short crank stroke and super low final drive gearing. So easy to creep about and turn. But I find them a bit more work to ride because you have to work clutch and throttle more. That can be fun, but it does require more % CPU, which is where the good-for-practice comes in.

    I agree with your dealer friend about the 250s, but things balance out with the 300's dripping torque. When mentally lazy you can do just about everything with throttle modulation, or hold throttle more steady and feather the clutch. Then again, you can do that with any size, so we're back where we started!
    #14
  15. LSMick

    LSMick Adventurer

    Joined:
    May 15, 2012
    Oddometer:
    58
    Location:
    Flatlander from the midwest
    OP here. I'm not a very serious person and don't ever intend to be, so don't take me wrong. I research everything, sometimes way too much. SOoooo.

    The reason I asked was there is a very nice 300 for sale I'm looking at. Some of the bikes I have checked out are beat up for the money I have available at this time. Two others are a 270 and a 280 AND another bike brand had a 290.

    As far as the engine size goes, I understand a 250 will work with no problems BUT the 250 to 300 range is filled with just 10 cc different. So , I thought there had to be more. I like the idea of being able to calm the beast. I've heard a story of a friend who launched one out from under him and he's a seasoned racer. At 150 pounds a weak 250 would be a handful on any other bike.

    I live in western Misery, I mean Missouri but am from back east. I have been on and even competed in the wonderful world of trials. (30 to 40) years ago. I saw Mick Andrews back in the 70's do things that I thought was impossible at the time.

    I'm finally going to get the time to do what I want and I want to get a trials bike. Knowing me, I will someday show up at a club event but until then, just play in the yard. A coupe of friends said if I get one they will too.

    Thanks for the great info, I'm so ready
    #15
  16. motobene

    motobene Motoing for 46 years

    Joined:
    Mar 9, 2013
    Oddometer:
    4,874
    Location:
    Wichita Mountains SW Oklahoma
    Go for it! There are by far more 300s that any other size in the market, so there are more choices. What year and model?
    #16
  17. Sting32

    Sting32 Trials Evangelist

    Joined:
    Oct 27, 2009
    Oddometer:
    1,825
    Location:
    Minneapolis, Ks
    LSMick,

    Do NOT hide out at home with the trials bike, for best results... Just sayin. I have watched and seen too many NEwbs, practice what they "think" is, but is far from the "Accepted" method. I would say "right" method, but seems to mean about the same. what happens is, you develop "bad" habbits, that then hold you back.

    The thing about trials is, unlike any other sport, IMHO, it is a "CLUB" 99% of the time, of people of like minded, good additude people... I mean this so honestly, everyone that rides trials will back me up on this point. You cannot allow yourself to be modest or ashamed (cant think of the word here, fell out of my brain) of your abilities. We have ALL been where you are, 99% of us that are involved, had any success at all with it, are (at least that I know) are wishing and looking at ways to help you and any new riders... Or streamline the hardships out, will encourage, and give productive help and information, so a new riders get better/comfortable faster. All of that is out the window later, like I might try to get Motobene to try a line saying "thats the one" if I am not sure, or I need a point or 2 back...

    Anyhow, I have posts all over this forum describing my history, from 5 years old, to now nearly 50. if I was selfish type, id sit back and just read all the "dribble" some would classify my posts as... Instead, my dad and I think about all the struggles we've gone through, and think "man, if we weren't of the attitude that we are, committed to getting on this sport called trials, all else other fun or pastimes, gone by the wayside, we surely got frustrated and quit many years ago.

    Trust me, the KC fellas will be mostly the same, be friendly to them, I know they will be friends you will be glad you met. waste everyone's time, though, and stuff, well the outcome changes fast, ask me how I know...

    Plan on being at Brown's farm in March... keep an eye out on the MATT website, and sign up for the email list for the MATT trials, (that is really old school type of messaging system, that uses emails). Id encourage you to plan to goto MWTA (Nebraska south of omaha is club grounds) as well as AVTA and NEOTT's website, and hell, plan a few trips to come ride with any of the clubs... I love traveling to NMTA's trials, and meeting more good fellas like are on here.
    #17
  18. LSMick

    LSMick Adventurer

    Joined:
    May 15, 2012
    Oddometer:
    58
    Location:
    Flatlander from the midwest
    Just bought a new Cota RT4 Race as my first trials bike..... only 10 grand :rofl





    not.................



    04 TXT 300 super clean very well loved is more like it.. Now I need a helmet, my $600 Arai dual sport won't work and my Gaerne Adventure boots won't work. So I have been cruising the WWW for trials stuff. This is what I have found $80 to 600 helmets and $125 Wulf sports to 400 boots. What to do ,what to do....:hmmmmm

    I do have nice gloves and pants and a few light weight jerseys I hope will work.
    I am going to try and make a few of the local events in my area.

    Also , I looked for GG parts and stuff and wondered about the slow turn throttle. Where and who sells this stuff?

    I'm so ready, right now it's around 7 degree and ice, snow and cold is on the way. I won't be able to do anything until the 3rd week in March.
    Until then , I've been reading everything on here.
    Thanks all...:freaky
    #18
  19. 2whlrcr

    2whlrcr gooligan

    Joined:
    Jan 30, 2005
    Oddometer:
    11,627
    Location:
    Dubuque, Iowa
    Jeans and a t shirt. Should cost you about 0 dollars out of your closet. Your adventure boots may work fine, or any old pair of worn out leather MX boots will work too. $10 light work gloves from farm and fleet and maybe a set of $40 coveralls, if it's muddy out or you need a little extra warmth. The cheapest open face helmet at Walmart or that farm store will do too. $100 tops and you have all the riding gear you need. If it's rocky get a pair of the cheapest knee pads you can find, maybe another $20.
    #19
  20. lineaway

    lineaway Long timer

    Joined:
    Oct 1, 2011
    Oddometer:
    7,902
    Location:
    nm
    #20