3rd Gear Problems 1996 R1100GS

Discussion in 'GS Boxers' started by Ridin'nFishin, Jul 16, 2010.

  1. Kawidad

    Kawidad Long timer

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    No, it's still together. I'm still kinda researching. (and watching you):D

    My third gear issue is sorta hit and miss. it's not consistent. I know I need to tackle it, but I'm trying to con my local indy, and buddy who is a beemer rider, into helping me. He doesn't want to do it, but I'm trying to work on him so he can lend a hand. I have a fair amount of experience with motorcycles, but have never dove into any beemers. My expertise is with American and Japanese products. He's done his own tranny and said it was worse than he thought it would be and doesn't want to do it again.:muutt
    #41
  2. Ridin'nFishin

    Ridin'nFishin Been here awhile

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    What oil are you using?
    Have you tried different ways of shifting?


    #42
  3. Kawidad

    Kawidad Long timer

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    I'm using Amsoil synthetic and have varied/adjusted my shifting styles. It seems to help/make a difference when upshifting, but I've found no difference during downshifts. But, even in that it is inconsistent. I'm willing to bet that I have a scored shifter fork at the very least.
    #43
  4. switch

    switch Romanian Trailbiker

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    If a bike 'skips' while in gear, you likely have a damaged shift fork. Constant skipping leads to rounded dogs (i.e. bad gears) and if left unchecked you WILL damage your selector map.

    Someone suggested replacing the shifter fork springs to help fix the issue. Determined shifting is also a solution. Even when I had serious 2nd gear issues, I could sometimes get the gear to properly engage when not using motocross boots and carefully shifting with preload and holding the gear lever up/down a little after the shift.

    EDIT: Also, proper shimming gets the gearbox in tip-top shape.
    #44
  5. Beemer Bob

    Beemer Bob Long timer

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    My '96 1100 RT does the skip in 3rd but I found if I shift without the clutch it almost never happens.......I did purchase a used M97 transmission for $500 but don't know the condition. May send it off for overhaul before installing.
    #45
  6. Ridin'nFishin

    Ridin'nFishin Been here awhile

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    Interesting, I am thinking of putting mine back together and trying different shifting methods and thicker oil. Moto Hank looked at it and could find anything but a little drag on the intermediate shaft, told me to put it back together and try it with Redline 90-140 oil, all I will lose by doing this is my time.

    Where did you get the tranny, does this person have another? I would look in it myself. Want you money back?


    #46
  7. def

    def Ginger th wonder dog

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    Many shifting issues can be resolved by the addition of moly to the transmission oil.

    I use 75w-140 GL-5 with about 5% moly additive (in the FD as well).I have no shifting problems and the transmission runs cooler. Moly is a EP friction modifier....try it.
    #47
  8. Ridin'nFishin

    Ridin'nFishin Been here awhile

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    This is along the lines of what I have been told and read.
    Thanks for your input, what brand of oil do you use?
    #48
  9. slartidbartfast

    slartidbartfast Love those blue pipes

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    Moly may help the trans run cooler if it significantly reduces friction but a more viscous oil will always run hotter - I don't know how you'd measure the difference anyway (I mean I know how it could be done but not how someone would find the motivation to do it properly, under somewhat controlled conditions)
    #49
  10. Poway

    Poway SHED (Shit Head)

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    My new to me, 99 GS1100R has 8000 miles on a rebuilt tranny (total 66,000 miles, by the best BMW Mechanic in San Dog) still shifts like crap compared to a Jap bike.
    Excellent job, on the ballsy move on digging in to the tranny! You've inspired us.
    I don'y understand the tech article's referenceing preloading the clutch after the shift. Does this mean to hold in the clutch for .4 to .8 seconds after the shift?
    #50
  11. switch

    switch Romanian Trailbiker

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    Quoted for truth. The gearbox is nowhere near as smooth or robust as the ones on jap bikes.

    It means preloading the SHIFTER or GEAR LEVER prior to de-clutching. I.e. You put your foot on the shift lever, pull/push without de-clutching up to the point where you feel resistance (do NOT force it) and THEN pull the clutch lever and continue the shift. After you get to the end of the shift gear's travel, keep your foot there and engage the clutch. Release the gear lever only after the gear is fully engaged (i.e. some half a second after the clutch is released).
    #51
  12. Beemer Bob

    Beemer Bob Long timer

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    Got it from eBay....I think I'll keep it. Try this link for eBay transmissions, several for sale.

    http://motors.shop.ebay.com/i.html?_nkw=bmw+r1100+transmission&_sacat=10063&_dmpt=Motorcycles_Parts_Accessories&_odkw=&_osacat=10063&bkBtn=&_trksid=p4506.m270.l1313
    #52
  13. papanovember

    papanovember Been here awhile

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    I am in the process of rebuilding a used M94 Clean Bearing Transmission with M97 intermediate and output shafts(with factory backcut gears). I bought a used transmission to rebuild to swap into my 1996 R1100GS that has a 2nd gear skip...to reduce amount of time my bike is torn apart. Does anyone know how to measure the shimming distance, on the end of input/intermediate/output shafts, without buying the BMW part no. 23 4 600 gearbox measuring plate? It cost like $330.00, I think. Does anyone have one I can borrow? Thanks, Paul.
    #53
  14. Ridin'nFishin

    Ridin'nFishin Been here awhile

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    You need to get the CD or a book. I now have a book and it is much better than CD. Have not put it back together this time. I put it back together the way it came apart the first time.

    I just found out today that if you have backcut gears it will not skip, I might just bite the bullet and go for the full rebuild.



    #54
  15. papanovember

    papanovember Been here awhile

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    I have the BMW factory manual, too many manuals, actually. The only way to shim the shafts as described in the manual is to have the shim plate. I also have the Clymer and Haynes manuals that say take it to your dealer to shim(Haynes doesn't go into detail, just about reusing old shims)...Also, because I am replacing two shafts, I must re-shim. Can't put it back together with the shims from the old shafts. Also, they could have improperly shimmed your transmission from the factory...Oh well, I never regret buying more tools:D...Still cheaper than having someone else do it:clap.
    #55
  16. UncleMark

    UncleMark Been here awhile

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    I got a 95 1100GS at the beginning of October, and it has been my daily driver since. In second, it will do the skip sometimes, usually when accellerating hard. It does it occasionally with less load. I picked up an M97 trans, but haven't swapped it yet.

    So the M97 gears are supposed to be undercut? I knew they had sealed bearings.

    When my truck is back in service, I will swap the transmissions and look into the M94.
    #56
  17. papanovember

    papanovember Been here awhile

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    Some of the later M94 transmissions went to sealed bearings. I have a sealed/clean bearing M94 that I am putting the M97 shafts into. And yes, the M97 gears were undercut from the factory. The M94 gears are straight cut. If you put the m94 intermediate shaft next to the M97 intermediate shaft, the difference is clear...I have the same problem in second with my 96 R1100GS.
    #57
  18. Ridin'nFishin

    Ridin'nFishin Been here awhile

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    You should be able to tell by looking at the ingagement dogs on the M97 shafts, weither they have a machined undercut or come out of the mold undercut? Can you tell us what you see?

    Maybe if I can get some M97 shafts, I will go that way.

    Thanks
    #58
  19. farrell caesar

    farrell caesar Seezer

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    This happened to my 01 gs. I was ready to change it. Took it to Mottorrad in St.louis and George found that the linkage to the splined shaft coming out of tranny was loose or impropely connected. I wonder how many people have changed a tranny for such a simple fix.
    #59
  20. Ridin'nFishin

    Ridin'nFishin Been here awhile

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    With all the work I have put into this bike, I finally get the answers I am wanting to hear about these R1100's tranny problems, expensive but a bullet proof fix.

    If I new at the beginning of this tread what I know now, I would have gotten a new rebuilt transmission before I even turned a wrench to take out the tranny.

    Question: What does it take to keep these bikes in gear?

    Answer:
    These transmissions need all the dog gears to be undercut, period. This will not let it slip out of gear when under pressure. The M97 transmissions have this done from the factory, but have a input shaft problem. So a solution could be to install M97 intermediate shaft and output shaft into my M94 transmission, get a new rebuilt transmission, or send mine of to be rebuilt. Wait, I could find a used M97 and slap it in there and ride.


    Three places to get this work done that I know of:

    1. Anton http://www.largiader.com/index.html

    2. Bruno Sax http://www.brunos.us/

    3. Rubber Chicken http://rubberchickenracinggarage.com/index.html
    #60