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Discussion in 'Old's Cool' started by edfetz, Oct 13, 2011.
Owned and rode many miles on a G5 & SP1000.
Helped my Cousin with a super major service on his loop-frame 15 years ago.
The wheel seals were blue rubber and reused, as were the Timkin wheel bearings.
For its build date, it just ozzes quality. imo
Some guys would use special 3/8" thick valve cover gaskets to gain clearance inorder to line the inside of the cover with 3/8" cork sheet... to quiet the valve gear.
If Guzzi valves are set too tight, the engine will not idle down when hot. I know.
The Tonti framed engines have a 14# flywheel w/o the twin disc Sachs clutch installed. The loop-frame flywheel is 36#. Much heavier than the old VW flywheel.
Super fun ride. N-Joy.
Please feel free to share your wisdom here, anytime!
...and your good to go!
I gotta dig into the books i have in storage.
I'm sure that there is a 25yo copy Guzziology. A must have book. Google it.
If it's there, it is yours. Expect a PM in three days. (like the old tractor link)
The big issue with the generator engines is guys run'em with the mount loose and it beats the hell out of the gen's saddle mount.
Some of the early ones had no oil filter inside the sump. The crank pin has a large hole drilled in it and it's capped off with a plug.
The hollow crank pin acts to centerfuge the oil going to the rod bearing. With the sump off, the plug can be removed and the trapped stuff removed.
A lotta gray stuff... ash in the oil, it is an additive.
All Guzzis have a hollow crank pin AFAIK.
Up until mid-2002 all Guzzi crank pins/rod journals were carbon nitrited. Expensive process but made them harder than the hubs of hell.
Guzzis can loose rod bearing and the crank pin is none the worse for it. It can be cleaned off with wet or dry emery paper and not even touch the journal face.
From late 2002 the rod journals are induction hardened. OK but cheaper.
Guzzi main bearings last forever.
Check the rear wheel's cush drive... if it has one. Some of the earlies did not.
They can rust up solid to the rear hub and it causes the clutch splines grief.
A propane torch to the outside will do'er. Clean & Never Seize.
Red & Green.. "We'er in this together."
The first edition of Guzziology was published in 1993, not quite 25 years.
The usual reason the generator bracket gets loose in the first place is the belt is run too tight, the stress causes the bolts to fracture and/or the bracket itself to break and then the generator flops around. A new beefier bracket with an extra "leg" welded on extending back to the distributor mounting bolt and studs with hardened washers and nylock nuts does wonders to cure this issue.
The first Guzzi "big twin" with a disposable spin-on type filter inside the sump was the late 850T. V700s, Ambos and Eldos did not.
The sludge trap plug can not be removed with the crank in the engine - it has to be removed before the plug is accessible.
Guzzi main bearings "last forever" unless the owner uses automotive oil change intervals or allows the chrome cylinder bores to flake and embed into the bearings.
Eldos such as danedg's don't have a cush drive, the 850T was the first there also. My '69 Ambo has 100k miles on the original clutch, u-joint, driveshaft, coupler and rear drive (splines are worn very little). Riding like you have some brains and keeping the splines lubed helps...
Getting a new bike or working on a bike you're unfamiliar with always serves to remind you that you're not the rocket surgeon you think you are...
Todays question is:
What's that big 20sumthin' mm hex head thingamabob located on the head just to the left of "A"?
TY for the corrections. Really.
I only did serious work on one loop-frame as noted.
I know because of poor venting or seal issues, gear oil can get transferred from trans to rear end.
John Swartz THE Guzzi guy here is SoCal years ago recommended that i add a couple of ozs. of gear oil into the swingarm at the rubber boot.
The heating & cooling cycle draws oil into the u-joint plus the splines like it.
Crankpin trap? Yeah, i cleaned two cranks out but they were out of the case. Thought one could get to it in case but i'm wrong. Its been a long time ago.
Lack of cushdrive? I guess the 36# flywheel really saves everything down stream from hard engine pulses.
dan, i'll be digging that book out today. It is an early edition. At one time Richardson would give a refund on a newer edition if the old copy was returned.
I have no idea if he really did any serious up-dates for the early bikes.
PM me your mailing address. Even though they are heavy, books mail cheap.
Access plug to a head bolt.
Later Tontis have an allen plug there, sealed with an o-ring. It's a little lighter, but they seem to get stuck a lot and the allen hole strips out. I have chiseled a few loose. I usually replace them with the old heavy loop item.
Thanx All for your patience and understandings...
What appears obvious to you guys isn't always to the new guy...
With our fantastic weather I'm gearing up to dive face first into this puppy...
My next step is to pull the cylinders/pistons and replace with them shiny new Gilardonis that are eating a hole in that big box...BUT!
A little birdie (my machinist) , told me a little story of a bike that sat around for years and was rescued. The punch line being... the tranny below the oil line was great. Condensation above the oil level had played hell with bearings,bushings and whatnot. Fresh motor and a lot of other things and Off We Go! for about 30 miles until the tranny locked solid... no one was injured.
This bike looks like a daily runner that got barnparked for 11 New York years before my greasy mitts got ahold of it.
Condensation destroyed the gas tank.
Should I have concerns about the interior rust factor in the tranny and motor? And where do I find a RustOMeter to check levels???
Open the big fill hole in the trans and take a peek. The stuff you can see is above the lube level. Pull the sump off the motor and clean the screen while you're doing the cyls. You'll be able to see everything from the top and bottom.
Good answer. Thanks!
I was loathe to open a trans that didn't need it. But I'd prefer to not destroy the thing but not making sure beforehand...
Having been a diesel mech for 35 years and diddeled with many old bikes i have yet to see a trans rusted up.
Granted it could happen if it had been submerged... seen that happen to truck rear ends & transmission from submersion when hot and then it draws the water in.
Gear oil is formulated to prevent corrosion because quite often the oil just gets warm, never hot enough to drive out/off condensation.
The Tonti (later bikes) trans take some special tools for disassembly.
The rear end is easy to open up. Just be sure to count & "mike" the shim gaskets.
Do drop the sump as noted earlyer.
You're close enough that I would pull it if it'll give you that piece of mind.
If that rubber boot covering your u-joint is shit,
and you plan on replacing that,
then you're literally a handful of bolts away from pulling the trans.
My old ambo's trans was the first one I ever looked at.
Was apprehensive, but there is not a thing to it.
Just got to get a little creative to keep it in (2nd?) gear when installing it.
New bearings all around cost me $60-80 I think.
However, I'm a let sleeping-dogs-lie guy, except for those chrome cylinders.
If your boot and u-joint are fine,
I probably wouldn't bother except to shine a little light on through the filler whole
and see what's up.
I'm close enough on the mechanicals, to wanna pull the junk just to clean the frame...while it's out I could pop this and check that...and clean.
This bike is a totally unknown quantity. I think I'm the second owner, and the first is morte.... so what I've got is only what I see...no history.
With the slash2, I had access to the PO, riding and usage history, and assurance that it was a totally unmolested bike with great patina... all a giant crock of hooey! Valuable lessons were learned.
I'm now looking at a neat Eldo with great patina. I have to assume that it's been badly serviced, generally mistreated and is ready to explode upon ignition after an 11 year hibernation.
I think I just answered the very question I never asked
Don't sweat it. On my 750S, which had been sitting for 25 years, I checked the cylinders, pulled the sump and cleaned everything, then changed all the fluids and started riding. 8000kms later, its still running sweetly. Same thing with my 74 California which had been in the hands of an unsympathetic ape. I need to change the clutch, but other than that, its ready for cross-continent.
The Eldo is likely to be the same. I'll bet there's nothing much that some fresh oil, the new Gilardonis, and a few thousand miles won't cure. Have faith - they're very nearly indestructible.
If you have the transmission out, then I'd definitely recommend opening it up to replace the shift return spring if nothing else. Got an email from a fellow down in TN the other day wondering how much work it was to replace the return spring - he had the clutch replaced just a week earlier...
When I built "Barney" http://thisoldtractor.com/gtbender/projects_barney_blog.htm I used a presumed good transmission. Upon inspection, it was found that the input shaft would only turn so far then "crunch", same with the output shaft. Opened it up and found rusted bearings and 2-3 "sliding muff".
I don't have the time (or money) to do things over, so I try my best to do everything right the first time.