A much lighter 950 adventure...

Discussion in 'Crazy-Awesome almost Dakar racers (950/990cc)' started by Dr LC8, Sep 26, 2012.

  1. Dr LC8

    Dr LC8 ...soon or later

    Joined:
    Jul 4, 2005
    Oddometer:
    970
    Location:
    Manchester...but from Rome!
    ...how to make one??:evil

    I guess a two in one akra, single front disk, rims?, CPR air box, smaller tail...

    Please tell me more, give me number, loads of speculations and plenty of pictures:lol3:lol3:lol3

    Ciao

    Nic
    #1
  2. Navin

    Navin Long timer

    Joined:
    Sep 22, 2009
    Oddometer:
    8,481
    Start with a SE for one.

    Then just resign yourself to the fact that they can't get much lighter without Powercell efforts and that KTM gave up and built a luxo-barge to replace it.
    #2
  3. Navin

    Navin Long timer

    Joined:
    Sep 22, 2009
    Oddometer:
    8,481
    It cab get lighter but it will never be light.

    [​IMG]
    #3
  4. wpbarlow

    wpbarlow Long timer

    Joined:
    Jun 9, 2003
    Oddometer:
    11,611
    Location:
    Central NJ
    But to be fair-- a luxo-barge that similarly equipped (crashbars and skidplate) looks like it weighs less than the 9x0.

    Sorry to confuse the issue with some apparent facts :lol3 We're all just speculating on the same published information.
    #4
  5. Dr LC8

    Dr LC8 ...soon or later

    Joined:
    Jul 4, 2005
    Oddometer:
    970
    Location:
    Manchester...but from Rome!
    There is no isses here. I like the 950/990 and I had three over 7 and odd years. I don't like the se even if I am sure is good.
    The question is just: how I can get a lighter 950 that will help me riding better off road...or at leat easier for an avarage rider as I am????


    Ciao

    Nic
    #5
  6. Navin

    Navin Long timer

    Joined:
    Sep 22, 2009
    Oddometer:
    8,481
    Better to improve suspension if you have stock than to chase a unicorn IMO. I have a 2-1 Q4 on the SE, honestly it feels the same as the previous stock can on a 2-1, which didn't translate to a lighter feel from the 2-2 stock cans. I deleted a bunch of wiring. Same. Used a ultra lite headlight and enduro taillight, same. I chopped out my subframe undertray, same. Sure, it all adds up but tires and suspension made the real differences I could feel.


    Back on my Adv I deleted a front brake, felt nothing. Cans, nothing.


    Going from the Adv to the SE, yeah, that I could feel too! Felt 100 lbs lighter. :evil
    #6
  7. Dr LC8

    Dr LC8 ...soon or later

    Joined:
    Jul 4, 2005
    Oddometer:
    970
    Location:
    Manchester...but from Rome!

    So what you are saying is that taking some 10kg off from cans and brakes won't make any difference?
    In all honestey when I fitted akras on my 950 and on the 990 after I couldn't feel handeling difference. However I guess I din't try to put all the saving together and then ride off!:huh

    Nic
    #7
  8. wpbarlow

    wpbarlow Long timer

    Joined:
    Jun 9, 2003
    Oddometer:
    11,611
    Location:
    Central NJ
    Well, it's 10kg easier to pick up :lol3 At my age, that's a benefit.
    #8
  9. Navin

    Navin Long timer

    Joined:
    Sep 22, 2009
    Oddometer:
    8,481
    I've dropped about 25-30 lbs just by glancing and no, it didn't/doesn't feel any lighter and when it falls in mud or sand it sure isn't feeling any lighter, and if it tips over in the garage it sure doesn't feel lighter. I think once the bike crosses about 360 lbs they are just a friggin anchor. It could weight 50 lbs more or less at least I wouldn't feel it and I ride mine 90% off road in deep sand whoops at high speeds. It is a barge.

    However, the suspension made a huge difference and tires, well, real dirt tires are the cats pajamas. The right tires are the biggest difference of all.

    I can barely feel when my 7.9g safari if full or empty while riding. I feel it when moving it by pushing as it is more top heavy but in motion under power no.
    #9
  10. MotoTex

    MotoTex Miles of Smiles

    Joined:
    Jul 6, 2009
    Oddometer:
    1,931
    Location:
    Tool Shed
    You have to think about what it is you like about the Adventure. Those things that make it different from the SE that are not negotiable. Fairing? Storage? Fuel capacity?

    Everything else is fair game.

    Titanium frame?

    Carbon fiber wheel set?

    Flux Capacitor?

    Considered putting Helium in the tires? :D

    I've seen bicyclists chase the ever elusive "lighter bike" and spend tens of thousands of dollars in the process, and ended up with a very light bike that they didn't really enjoy riding. They had a sub-twenty pound mountain bike with no suspension, small tires, and a very stiff frame.

    I'd agree about putting money in suspension and tires before you put the bike on a diet. What you may really be after is ride-ability, not necessarily lower weight.
    #10
  11. TheMuffinMan

    TheMuffinMan Forest Ranger Magnet

    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2010
    Oddometer:
    6,444
    Location:
    Denver, USA
    +1

    There isn't one bike that does everything I want it. Though a 690 + RR fairing kit is looking mighty tempting, just not on the wallet! :lol3
    #11
  12. HellsAlien

    HellsAlien a has-been that never-was

    Joined:
    Nov 16, 2004
    Oddometer:
    2,447
    Location:
    Baja Sur winter. PDX summer (that's like 6 wks!)
    The suspension and consequent ridability is what sold me on this bike years ago, that's still its strong play, that and mondo usable power. Do the cans, that's the biggest weight drop; I did it 'cause it saves the weight of the Gobis.

    I passed a whole bunch of bikes on a go-kart track last weekend with my 950A on used Skorps; lowest bike lap time, literally lapped the whole gang once/twice in a 20 min session, including so-called supermotos. I couldn't do that if the suspension/tires/motor didn't work.

    But it ain't ever gonna be an SE with tank and farkles. May not be your cup of tea, but in baja they rock!
    #12
  13. Off Road Ryder

    Off Road Ryder Long timer

    Joined:
    Mar 29, 2010
    Oddometer:
    2,836
    Location:
    Kent Wa
    Put the motor in a cr 500 frame..:rofl
    I love my 950 adv. after the suspension work I FEEL I can ride it much like my 525. not really, but close:lol3
    Loosing the stock cans is a good thing. Other than that I think spending efforts on weight loss is relatively fruitless.
    #13
  14. slackmeyer

    slackmeyer Don't mean sheeit. .

    Joined:
    Jul 23, 2007
    Oddometer:
    3,180
    Location:
    Berzerkeley, CA
    I was going to suggest swapping for a 690 frame.



    Then a 690 motor, subframe, swingarm, etc. You'll be down to 325 lbs before you know it.
    #14
  15. RoundOz

    RoundOz Plenty of seasoning

    Joined:
    Jun 10, 2009
    Oddometer:
    1,019
    Location:
    West Nebraska
    Ideally you are removing weight that is the furthest from the ground as this has the most benefit handling-wise. This is tougher to do on a 9x0 as the factory has done such a good job in the first place at keeping weight down low. However, unless you are already anorexic, it is easier to drop poundage off yourself than off the bike. (That being said, I obviously find burgers and bacon way more attractive than improving the handling of a bike that is ten times better at offroading and onroading than I will ever be)
    Some would say that if you are lighter you will have a harder time throwing the bike from side to side (after all, you have to push against something) but if you replace the lard with muscle I would guess the effect is a wash.

    Back to the bike, I think the two biggest changes you can make are the battery and the cans. Lots of guys run without crashbars. A composite skidplate might save you a pound. I would guess that all carbon fiber bodywork and titanium fasteners will shave more ounces off your wallet than off the bike. If you carry tools on a regular basis, aim for multitasking and consider parting with big bucks for titanium or alloy wrenches. Removing unsprung weight is generally better for handling (it gives your suspension an easier time, especially rebound). Removing a disk will make the single biggest change. I'm not sure how much weight heavy duty tubes add, but most people who swear by them (and heavier duty aftermarket rims) are not going to trade them for weight savings.

    Its all a compromise. I love lightweight bikes, but I am not about to remove my crashbars or aux lights or leave my 15-20 pounds of tools and spares at home, unless I am just going across town.
    #15
  16. brents347

    brents347 Trusting my Cape...

    Joined:
    Mar 5, 2006
    Oddometer:
    3,936
    Location:
    Where the hell is Truckee, CA?
    Here's a couple of things I did that are not on your list.

    1. Single disc 1.6" front wheel with Talon hub and Tubliss system (no front tube). This combo saved about 5lbs. (Yeah, I don't know kg conversions).

    2. Lighter battery. Switching to a LiPo battery saved about 5 lbs. as well.

    Combine this with the other simple things you mentioned, and run no crash bars, panniers, etc. and the savings is significant. Is the bike now a 450? No. Is it better than a stock 950? Absolutely.

    Take Navins opinions with a grain of salt. He makes solid points, but the dude is negative as hell. Come up with a great new idea for the 950 and he'll find a way to piss on it.
    #16
  17. Xtremjeepn

    Xtremjeepn Motorhead!

    Joined:
    May 31, 2008
    Oddometer:
    2,098
    Location:
    SaddleRock, Colorado
    Interesting. Are you guys using the 950A as a trail bike?


    I only ask because the majority of the time mine is in the dirt is when I'm traveling with a fully loaded up bike. Exploring trails and roads to new locations far away from home. This seems to be where the 950/990 adventure makes sense. Do hundreds of miles of blacktop at speed and still be able to haul all your camping gear over the dirt passes and desert trails.


    It seems if the intent is to only ride the local trails then the solution is a much smaller bike!
    #17
  18. zooomgovroom

    zooomgovroom hooligan-esque

    Joined:
    Feb 12, 2008
    Oddometer:
    68
    Location:
    Gaithersburg, MD
    maybe find a fabricator who works with Ti that can fabricate a complete frame for you which might save a few extra pounds/kilo's...it seems a bit extreme, but perhaps you can lead the way in terms of being the guinea pig and other perhaps would follow for "race" bikes...I have heard of this done in Ducati circles, so it isn't that weird, but it ain't cheap either.
    #18
  19. Navin

    Navin Long timer

    Joined:
    Sep 22, 2009
    Oddometer:
    8,481
    Here is more negativity for Brent, I bought a li-po battery. If it gets colder than 40 degrees they are useless. I've had them from TurnTech, Ballistic, Shorai and another company who's name escapes me at the moment. For 4 different bikes I've bought them for and all 4 bikes went back to regular batts after they failed to start at races and events I drove 2-3 hours to attend. Great fun and exercise in faith jump starting a 450 lbs. bike to go to the beginning of a 90 mile enduro. :lol3

    My SE has a 7 series Yuasa in it, it is far lighter than a 14 but I couldn't tell which was under the seat unless I looked!

    My experience with weight was what I stated, I couldn't feel any differences. Theoretically it was better. Seat of the pants I got nothing. Others do? Great. :freaky


    When KTM builds a better "FOR ME" 950 I'll ring the bell and run the flag down the street and be the first at my dealer with a deposit. Lower and more power isn't my preference. I don't ride shareholder reports or their stock values, I ride the bikes. If I wanted an Adv right now I'd search out a first run "S". What was that? 2004? Not progress from my viewpoint and i guess that offends some here?
    #19
  20. mousitsas

    mousitsas Long timer

    Joined:
    Oct 10, 2008
    Oddometer:
    3,006
    Location:
    Athens, Greece
    One more comment on weight saving exercises, my SE seems like it looses 20kg when I put the 19/17 wheels on, just because the CG moves 1 inch down. So, lowering the suspension (if you're happy with your ground clearance) will do wonders to effective weight. On the expense of stability of course.
    #20