Ask your WELDING questions here.

Discussion in 'The Garage' started by KTM640Dakar, Mar 5, 2007.

  1. KTM640Dakar

    KTM640Dakar Motorsick

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    You almost have it right Jim. Helium increases the ionization rate of the shielding gas and increases penetration. Usually you get a deeper penetration profile that is more narrow. Have you seen helium prices lately? It is in shortage.

    And yes I am less interested in selling a machine verses helping people with welding. :evil
  2. Poolside

    Poolside Syndicated

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    Sales engineers, gotta love 'em.

    Excerpt below is from your boys. Maybe you were out that day.

    SUPERGLAZE™ ALUMINUM MIG WELDING GUIDE
    Lincoln Electric Publication C8.100<BR><BR>
  3. swjohnsey

    swjohnsey Banned

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    Thanks for the advice on welding machines. I am recovering from sticker shock. Are there any pitfalls to watch for buying used equipment?
  4. KTM640Dakar

    KTM640Dakar Motorsick

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    Well Poolside, you answer the questions.

    I'll just sit back and critic you.
  5. KTM640Dakar

    KTM640Dakar Motorsick

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    Make sure that it is single phase, not three phase industrial voltage that won't work on your home/shop power.

    Make sure it is good quality, because you get what you pay for with welding machines. And you want to be sure you can always get parts for the wire feeder, gun, etc.

    Make sure it works. And make sure it will weld with low settings since most MIG/TIG welders will weld in the high range but not all have a good low end.
  6. swjohnsey

    swjohnsey Banned

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    Probably the only way I can afford one of the Miller or Lincoln machines recommended is to find one used.
  7. KTM640Dakar

    KTM640Dakar Motorsick

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    So poolside if a MIG welder is a constant voltage machine how does the voltage increase?

    Does the helium turn the voltage knob up higher with it's lighter than air invisible hand?

    I would like to know.

    Maybe you should read that whole book first then answer.
  8. KTM640Dakar

    KTM640Dakar Motorsick

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    If you can find a Lincoln SP125T or SP135T those two machines are both very inexpensive used and are nearly the same machine even though they have different number names. The T stands for "tapped" which means that the voltage adjustment is set with a tapped switch. It is less expensive to build a tapped voltage switch then one that is infinitely adjustable that also requires an PC board to work. The SP125Plus and SP 135plus machines use PC boards and potted switches so they are more expensive to find used.

    These are all 110 Volt machines.
  9. ehatcher

    ehatcher Hello? Is this thing on?

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    I have a Pro-core 100 that I bought for the occasional welding that I do (anything serious I just tack and take to a freinds shop). Two questions: is it worth upgrading this machine to use argon (as opposed to the flux wire)? Secondly, I don't weld much, and sometimes I make a sloppy weld, whats the best (fastest) way to dress an ugly weld?

    Thanks
    Eric
  10. Poolside

    Poolside Syndicated

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    <BR>
    I didn't get my comments from that publication, the near quote was coincidental.

    The image excerpt is what your factory's literature says about how helium affects the weld in aluminum. And it was different from what you mentioned. Maybe take the discrepancy up with the editor?

    User guides are use-ful, but aren't where I turn for technical data on arc physics.

    You're kidding with the questions right?

    - Jim<BR><BR>
  11. KLboxeR

    KLboxeR Back in the game again

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    With regards to a CV welder, doesn't stickout or arc length determine voltage to the degree it will vary at a given setting?
  12. woody's wheel works

    woody's wheel works Built to Last

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    Todd,,,,came across your thread and just finished reading it start to finish,,,
    just want to give you :super,,,,and:thumb,,,for sharing your wisdoms,,,

    keep your cool,,,,especially with the devil's advocates,,,i love 'em,,they keep me on my toes and often provide another point of view:wink:

    thanks,,,woody
  13. Poolside

    Poolside Syndicated

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    Indirectly.

    The elements of the shield gas determine the arc voltage of any particular length of plasma.

    The Constant Voltage, or CV, moniker given to MIG supplies is at best, misleading.

    The wirefeed motor in the power supply directly controls the arc length. NOT the arc voltage.

    The arc voltage, and the power supply voltage, are directly controlled by the physics of the plasma.

    It is the arc that controls the MIG power supply, not the other way around.

    The arc voltage is determined by the elements in the plasma, and the length of the plasma. And no power supply, even the ConEd power station with a few gigawatts, can overrule an element's physical and electrical properties.

    The term Constant Voltage is misleading. No power supply is capable of creating an arc voltage different than what the shield gas elemental properties dictate.

    And for a given arc length, the physical properties of helium produces a higher arc voltage than argon.

    - Jim<BR><BR>
  14. KTM640Dakar

    KTM640Dakar Motorsick

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    The voltage will remain the same if the electrical stickout is close or far. But..

    The "arc length" will increase if your stickout is closer. And your arc length will decrease if you pull a longer stickout. All the while your constant voltage MIG welder will always try to maintain the voltage that is set on the machines controls.

    The reason that the arc length changes is because there is a longer amount of welding wire that is sticking out of the contact tip that makes extra resistance. Since resistance increases the welder has to adjust too and this causes the arc length of plasma to shorten.

    So usually you want to maintain a 5/8 inch stickout. If you get farther away from the weld puddle (1 inch or more stickout) the arc will lose arc length and spudder and pop.
  15. Poolside

    Poolside Syndicated

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    +1 as well Todd. I don't envy you your stage, but I admire you taking it.

    I think that arc length is, in some ways, more relevant than arc voltage.

    Since arc length determines the method of metal filler transfer, you know, short circuit or spray, etc., then that particular arc length must be maintained to ensure a desired method of filler metal transfer.

    And for a particular arc length, a length necessary to maintain the method of filler transfer, the shield gas remains as the direct and sole 'selector' of arc voltage.

    - Jim<BR><BR>
  16. KTM640Dakar

    KTM640Dakar Motorsick

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    Thanks for your words of encouragement Woody.:D

    I would rather help my fellow Advriders then have a pissing contest. I hope I can keep my cool. As long as I am having fun and I can help someone out with welding I will keep it up.:nod
  17. KLboxeR

    KLboxeR Back in the game again

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    Poolside and 640,

    Thanks for the great insight.

    Chris
  18. Beemer Pat

    Beemer Pat ...

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    When I hear that popping sound I always ask if they want some butter to go with the popcorn. :lol3 Sorry about that….. I’m a certified welder of 27 years and love all the info here. I think this could be my new place to come and read and learn. I work in a fab shop and love to fix things folks say can’t be fixed, most of the time. I’m sure I will have some questions for the group from time to time. I have a mig and a tig welder at home so I tinker when I can.
  19. vibro

    vibro Adventurer

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    Thanks for the great thread. Even though I don't have a welder it's a good read.
    Here's a question.
    I was told by some welding supply shops not to buy a rig from the big box stores (home depot, etc.) because they are not the same quality as the rigs they sell and they can't (won't) service them because parts are not available. That's why you pay less. Is this true or just a bunch of hooey to get me to buy at their shop?
    At this point I probably would buy at a welding supply shop just for the advice and service.
    Just wondering.
  20. KLboxeR

    KLboxeR Back in the game again

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    Service and advise is worth the couple of extra bucks you'd pay, by far. My local guy is great, he's saved me far more $$ by giving good advise than I'd have ever saved at the box stores or on the net. If there's any question he can't answer, he gets on the phone to his parent company's experts, their shop techs, other local weders that deal with him, or Miller's tech experts. The guy is like a pitbull when presented with a problem...he never lets go. It doesn't matter whether the question is about a $2k machine or getting a pound of the correct filler metal. He just wants to help his customers produce the best welds possbile. That's money in the bank IMHO.

    Shop around for the best dealer as well as the best machine. Somebody who's knowlegable and willing to spend the time with you will make life alot easier,

    Chris