Back Ordered Stator - Advice or Spare?

Discussion in 'Crazy-Awesome almost Dakar racers (950/990cc)' started by sakurama, Jul 13, 2008.

  1. sakurama

    sakurama on an endless build

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    So my bike quit charging and the shop diagnosed it as a bad stator. The really bad part is that the stator is backordered until the end of August and I've been planning on leaving for a cross country trip with my girl friend in less than two weeks. I've just ordered panniers and new tires and now it all seems up in the air.

    Munn is looking for a stator for me but isn't hopeful. If anyone has a spare they can spare or knows of a place that has rewound a 950 stator please share some knowledge.

    Many thanks in advance.

    Gregor
    #1
  2. thetoecutter

    thetoecutter Cutter of Toes

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    Baja Designs or Trail Tech maybe?

    * neither of their sites list anything but I'd still give them a call if you haven't.
    #2
  3. woodchuckexc

    woodchuckexc Been here awhile

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    Check with KTMtwins or their sister shop Scuderia west in S.F. Ca.
    They sell more KTM twins than anyone else in the US. Scuderia West's phone # is(415) 621-7223. Good Luck brother!
    #3
  4. lc8john

    lc8john Been here awhile

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    If its really urgent, give this guys a call: http://ktm-sommer.de/
    Ask them to "ups" it to you, it could be a bit expensive but, as i said if it is urgent....
    #4
  5. sakurama

    sakurama on an endless build

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    Thanks, I'll check these options out tomorrow.

    Gregor
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  6. LKN4DRT

    LKN4DRT Mended

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    Could you pull it out and inspect it? It could just be a broken/shorted wire that's easy to repair?
    #6
  7. Monty_Burns

    Monty_Burns Excellent.

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    There is nothing magic about the 950's stator. If it is something as simple as a short on one of the phases, a good motor shop should be able to rewind it.

    You could even do it yourself if you have some time to learn how and are moderately confident with mechanical stuff. The F650GS forum (not ADVRIDER) has the best write-up I've found on the subject.

    If there is physical damage, then you are probably screwed unless you can find a stator somewhere at a KTM dealer.
    #7
  8. sakurama

    sakurama on an endless build

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    I was sorta thinking that myself but searching the subject here I found that no one has successfully had one rewound. I guess because it's in an oil bath? I don't know why that would make a difference and I'm with you: it should be a simple affair to have it rewound since it's just a matter of the correct wire and the right number of turns. Still I haven't done one yet and don't want to start now so I was hoping that someone knew a person who had done one since that would make it easier.

    Tomorrow I'm taking the bike to a track day and I'll just keep it on a charger between sessions but that won't work on the way to Portland.
    #8
  9. sakurama

    sakurama on an endless build

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    So Baja and Trail Tech can't rewind the stator - they do it on a machine that is specialized to the bikes they build them for. I asked if it could be done by hand and they said no because you couldn't get it tight enough. Hmm. I might look around some more but it seems no one has ever had one rewound so maybe there's a reason. Munn can't find one after looking for two days and I'll try the CA shops once they wake up.

    Any other suggestions? I've emailed Sommer but haven't heard from them yet.
    #9
  10. thetoecutter

    thetoecutter Cutter of Toes

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    Matto Cycles maybe.
    #10
  11. sakurama

    sakurama on an endless build

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    Sommer had one - well, they said it was in stock in the EU and they'd have it in two days and could ship to me. Expensive but then it's a matter of having a bike to ride or not. I guess I'll take ride. Now I hope the oil pressure switch is in stock as that seems to be failing...

    Gregor
    #11
  12. PowerCell

    PowerCell Manufacture

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  13. PowerCell

    PowerCell Manufacture

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    And Baja Designs...


    Please call our tech support department at 760.560.2252 to discuss the rewind specifics/options for your bike before sending in your stator.
    #13
  14. sakurama

    sakurama on an endless build

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    Baja can't and Ricky's asked for a photo of the stator and will get back to me. They might be able to so I might take one for the team and get a rewind to see.
    #14
  15. Head2Wind

    Head2Wind MotorcycleMayhem

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    does it have the white or brown connector? Idea of which phase is damaged (there are three)? Easy to check with a meter, either Digital or Analog. the reason I ask is that it might not need to be rewound, it might be a poor connection/solder joint or a bad wire in the loom coming from the stator itself.
    #15
  16. GoNOW

    GoNOW Long timer

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    Had them do work for me before. Good shop. Also a good chance it does not need to be rewound, just a short fixed.
    #16
  17. sakurama

    sakurama on an endless build

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    No I didn't check it myself. I made the mistake of trusting a shop. God help me I know I should never do that - clowns and charlatans for the most part - they only had to undo 4 bolts to replace the battery and the bike came back missing one bolt and cross threaded on another... I digress.

    I will certainly pull it myself and check it. I'm guessing that their diagnosis was correct since the system is putting out 11.5-12 volts according to my GPS. They said they checked the wires but considering their lack of thoroughness I'll do that as soon as I can. I'm okay with mechanical but electrical isn't my forte so if you can offer any advice as to how to check the stator (ohms? resistance? continuity?) that would be huge.

    Thanks,

    Gregor
    #17
  18. Head2Wind

    Head2Wind MotorcycleMayhem

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    well lets see..... the KTM 950 alternator is a 3 phase perm magnet generator, non active regulation. each of these three phases consist of varnish covered copper wires that get wrapped around ferrite (iron) cores/posts. stator is fixed, mag rotor is rotational/mounted to crankshaft

    The way to check it with the engine running, hold engine at about ~2.5k-3.5k RPM to get it "working":
    • Get a Digital Volt Meter from Radio Shack or other store
    • set it on AC voltage, range something that will show about 30 volts
    • probe into the back of each of the wires while the connector is together
      • each phase should be about 18-30VAC
      • if much less than that, say 5-10VAC or so then the phase has a internal short/melt or has a bad connection somewhere PRIOR to the connector
    The additional quick way to check it without engine running:
    • Get a Digital Volt Meter from Radio Shack, or the new one from previous :)
    • Set it on Ohms (resistance)--Range 0-20 ohms if not auto
    • Disconnect the large brown connector located at/near the lower left motor mount
      • Its the one with three yellow wires going into it
    • Probe between each one of the three wires, ENGINE SIDE, NOT REGULATOR SIDE
      • resistance readings should be 3-5 ohms, may be as high as 8-10
      • if 0 then there is a open/break on that phase
      • if much greater than 10-15 ohms then there might be a bad solder joint or the winding has gotten messed up in some way
    • Probe between each wire and the engine/ground
      • it should be INFINITE (OPEN) ohms (as in a BUNCH, equivelant to open air)
      • if anything other than INFINITE ohms then the winding is shorted to ground and will not function
    If all of the above tests good then the rectifier/regulator is crapped out, NOT the stator
    #18
  19. CodyY

    CodyY ADVenture Capitalist

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    FWIW: Oil bath shouldn't be an issue, all the RFS bikes are oil-bath stators.
    #19
  20. sakurama

    sakurama on an endless build

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    First, thanks to Head2Wind for the detailed description. Sadly it was completely unneeded as this is what I found when I pulled off the cover:

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    The bolts on the rotor backed off as I've seen in a few threads. The one that backed out the most is a bit bent but didn't ruin the threads so cleaning and red locktighting them back should solve this problem. I'd recommend that everyone pull your stator cover and check this since it's a catastrophic failure. I caught it in time to not ruin the rotor or damage the core of the stator but had I checked I wouldn't be having to rebuild my stator - a stator that is backordered almost two months.

    Now for the good news. Ricky's Stators said they couldn't rewind it as they weren't set up for an 18-pole stator but turned me onto Custom Rewind where I spoke to Gary. Gary speaks with the thickest and slowest southern drawl I've ever heard. I asked him if he could rewind it and he thought it seemed like a pretty straightforward job, "sounds like a normal stator rewind to me..." . I asked how long it would take and he said normal turnaround was about three days. I told him I was leaving on a big trip next Friday and if I were to get it to him by Monday could he get it back to me by Thursday? He said, "Well, taking a trip is big deal and that's a lot more important than these guys that just ride their bikes every so often. If you get it to me by Monday we can get it back to you by Tuesday I reckon - you'll have to pay for the overnight shipping of course. Does that work for you?"

    I'll get the stator to him overnight for Monday AM delivery and he charges $95 to rewind the stator. If this works out it will be a huge benefit to anyone who's waiting on a backordered stator.

    When I get the rewound stator I'll post photos of the work and I'll happily test it on a cross country trip.

    Gregor
    #20