Bad gasket Replacement = Wont Start

Discussion in 'The Garage' started by tyreybel, Feb 2, 2014.

  1. Cogswell

    Cogswell Spudly Adventurer

    Joined:
    Jan 3, 2005
    Oddometer:
    4,757
    Location:
    Riding with my pal Richard Cranium
    Sounds like you may have some exhaust leaks at the head or pipe junctions.

    Did you get the slack in the cam chain to the rear of the intake cam so it can be controlled properly ? Have you adjusted the cam chain slack ?

    Mike
    #41
  2. AustinJake

    AustinJake TE450-KLE-FXDWG

    Joined:
    Aug 20, 2010
    Oddometer:
    3,901
    Location:
    Austin, TX
    Well, I have to bring it up, could be that some valve stem got bent, letting oil into the combustion chamber down thru the bent valve stem, and the clicking and poor running could be from poor combustion chamber sealing.
    #42
  3. sieg

    sieg Long timer

    Joined:
    Jul 9, 2008
    Oddometer:
    2,960
    Location:
    Southern Illinois USA
    very possible
    #43
  4. tyreybel

    tyreybel Adventurer

    Joined:
    Jun 10, 2013
    Oddometer:
    21
    Location:
    St. Louis, MO
    Is that something I would be able to diagnose with a compression test? As in = lower compression in one cylinder indicated a bent valve?
    #44
  5. anotherguy

    anotherguy Long timer

    Joined:
    Jun 18, 2009
    Oddometer:
    6,630
    Location:
    the hills
    Yes that will answer it.
    #45
  6. effensteve

    effensteve Enjoying the ride

    Joined:
    Feb 10, 2010
    Oddometer:
    756
    Location:
    The far east (of Oregon)
    Was that the initial start-up after the rebuild, or does it have a little time on it? Rebuild + low weight break in oil will smoke and knock/ ping a little.
    #46
  7. H96669

    H96669 A proud pragmatist.

    Joined:
    Nov 20, 2009
    Oddometer:
    4,748
    Location:
    Hiding off Hwy 6, B.C.
    First run??? That little (or lots) of oil from the wet tests can smoke for quite a long time.Sniff test??? Smells like oil or gasoline????

    Another compression check for sure but the vacuum carb synchronizer can also tell if there are leaky valves. That's in how you interpret the movements of the needles. I have that on paper I think, came with my single gauge but will also apply to most "synchronizers" even my old mercury columns one.
    #47
  8. tyreybel

    tyreybel Adventurer

    Joined:
    Jun 10, 2013
    Oddometer:
    21
    Location:
    St. Louis, MO
    Yea that was the first warm up. I did a wet compression test only in cyl #4 though so I'm worried about it smoking so much.
    What would you all recommend? I am going to work on adjusting the carbs tomorrow, but is it OK to run up to warm with it sounding so bad?
    #48
  9. Cogswell

    Cogswell Spudly Adventurer

    Joined:
    Jan 3, 2005
    Oddometer:
    4,757
    Location:
    Riding with my pal Richard Cranium
    No, you need to find the source of the noise and correct it before moving on.
    Depending on what the source of the noise is it could affect the running of the engine.
    Can you do another video with sound, moving the mic around to try and pin point the source ?

    Mike
    #49
  10. Mrmerlin

    Mrmerlin K1300S fast as shi..

    Joined:
    Oct 16, 2009
    Oddometer:
    341
    Location:
    Philly PA
    Sounds like your getting close...

    However, before you run the engine again,
    check the valve clearances,
    if they are off from where you set them,
    IE some of the gaps are wider than where you set them
    then you most likely have bent bent valves,

    if the clearances are good, then do a compression check,

    NOTE make sure the cam chain is at the proper tension,
    it can rattle on the engine case,
    and recheck the timing
    #50
  11. tyreybel

    tyreybel Adventurer

    Joined:
    Jun 10, 2013
    Oddometer:
    21
    Location:
    St. Louis, MO
    Ran it again to adjust the carbs. The smoke stopped and the engine is running much better now.
    I adjusted the points a little too, so I think that has helped.

    That's all for now! Thanks for all the help everyone. Maybe I'll do some more maintenance this summer...
    #51
  12. AustinJake

    AustinJake TE450-KLE-FXDWG

    Joined:
    Aug 20, 2010
    Oddometer:
    3,901
    Location:
    Austin, TX
    Did the clicking sound go away?
    #52
  13. tyreybel

    tyreybel Adventurer

    Joined:
    Jun 10, 2013
    Oddometer:
    21
    Location:
    St. Louis, MO
    It is still there at very low RPMs when the engine hasn't yet warmed up.
    The sound was present before I began working on the bike and is now present after I sent the head off to a local shop for them to inspect valves and evenness. I honestly can't think of what it is.
    #53
  14. H96669

    H96669 A proud pragmatist.

    Joined:
    Nov 20, 2009
    Oddometer:
    4,748
    Location:
    Hiding off Hwy 6, B.C.
    Clickety click....you don't want to listen to my bike at idle if just for the clicks & rocks. But normal for them....:wink:

    Yours??? Worn cam chain? That would do that. Did you arc it sideways when you could see it? New ones can't be arced much if at all. As the pins wear they sure arc. Worse case scenario you'll see the side plates get closer or farther apart. AND click as they climb the gears.

    Depending on the wear, they can click for a very long time before things get worse but then again depending on wear you may never get a smooth engine.

    You can maybe get an idea of the chain wear moving the crank back & forth at the alternator and see if there is any play there before you encounter the resistance from the valve train/camshafts.Too late for pics, the old Honda XL500 is apart but holy crap....I think we could get 60-70 degrees rotation at the alternator before the cam even moved.:eek1
    #54
  15. fast4d

    fast4d Long timer

    Joined:
    Jul 27, 2007
    Oddometer:
    2,506
    Location:
    Los Angeles, CA
    I think a quick way for you to find the actual problem and to get your bearings.... a leak down test should be done with each cylinder at TDC.

    check valve clearance while you're at TDC.

    if those check out then know you have sound mechanicals and you can look at fuel or spark.
    #55
  16. itsatdm

    itsatdm Long timer

    Joined:
    Jun 19, 2004
    Oddometer:
    5,032
    Location:
    Nor Ca.
    It still doesn't sound like the timing is correct. Any chance you switched cams? Intake for exhaust and visa versa. Sounds like a bent valve also. If it is, it won't close all the way and you will excessive valve clearance on the bent valve. Probably in the range of 1/4"
    #56