Bad TPS sensor 2007 990ADV?

Discussion in 'Crazy-Awesome almost Dakar racers (950/990cc)' started by boat.man, Jun 27, 2011.

  1. Defaultgateway

    Defaultgateway Adventurer

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    Gefr,
    Here is a measurement of a new 990 ADV LC8 (ktm p/n 61041077000), there are two but they are electrically the same.
    blu wire +4.984 from supply
    blk wire is ground ref.
    Yellow is signal out (wiper of pot)
    nominal sensor is 0 to 5,000. ohms
    Note, the main point is not the slope or if it is a straight line, but that the voltage out signal goes from 0 to the supply rail without any dropouts or spikes, and moves from 0 to rail voltage (your supply voltage) with full range and repeatable.
    Cheers... defaultgateway

    [​IMG][/URL][/IMG]
    #21
  2. rider911

    rider911 Shortcut Navigator

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    Well heres my update.

    I took Gustos advice and purchased a s/h throttle body assembly off ebay, but I had already narrowed my problem down to the TB wiring harness. So I really bought the TBs to get the wiring harness and have a back up.
    I used the original TBs including all the ancillaries except for the wiring, I really wanted to prove to myself that the problem was in the harness.
    I have just done two rides totaling 2600km and the bike ran perfectly. I havent stripped the old harness yet but I could tell with a multimeter that there was a potential fault in there.

    http://advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=378672&page=7

    My 4000 rpm idle is gone :clap :clap
    #22
  3. gefr

    gefr Life is a trip

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    So you conclude it was harness problem?

    Can we say the erratic idle and all EFI gremlins are problems caused from bad TPS?
    Seems the error code does not show up always.
    #23
  4. rider911

    rider911 Shortcut Navigator

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    Absolutely NOT

    As I said I am using all my original old parts including TPS and my problems have been fixed. The only part that fixed the eractic idle was the wiring loom.


    I would love to say that I found the problem in the loom but I cant, I stripped it back to the join that combines the common injector wires which gave a bad resistance reading but it doesnt look bad and although I can fiddle with the wires and change the reading it is not conclusive.
    #24
  5. gefr

    gefr Life is a trip

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    At TPS voltage 0.72V idle was diving to a stall while at 0.61V idle is sticking at 2000rpm and finally resting at 1500rpm after a while. At the adjusting bolt, moving the sensor upwards (turning the sensor anticlockwise) increases TPS voltage and lowers idle rpm, moving the sensor downwards (clockwise) TPS voltage gets lower and idle settles higher.
    When TPS is damaged, the sweet spot is damaged so it cannot settle to the correct idle.
    #25
  6. rider911

    rider911 Shortcut Navigator

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    have you put a new one on yet?
    #26
  7. gefr

    gefr Life is a trip

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    I managed to have it adjusted so I do not get sudden engine death or idle hanging at 4000rpm. My idle often stays at 2000rpm and then settles to the normal 1450rpm. I will replace ASAP with a used one in good condition.
    Cheers.
    #27
  8. johnyred

    johnyred Johnyred

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    I had similar symptoms and tried TPS settings with no luck. Finally changed the idle motor and bike works normal.
    #28
  9. gefr

    gefr Life is a trip

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    :huh
    #29
  10. dgjackson40

    dgjackson40 Been here awhile

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    Gefr, did you ever sort this out?
    #30
  11. gefr

    gefr Life is a trip

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    The bike is definitely rideable, but there is a snatch at openings from idle, that was not there, at the last days of the older, now faulty TPS sensor. There is also an occasional drop of idle at 1100rpm for a short time. I never have the motor stall.
    I want to emphasize the voltage is adjusted at 0.67Volts at idle, to get it running properly. I have installed ITG foam filter and the bike is 2006 European. Another friend that also installed CPR foam filter has TPS adjusted to 0.72Volts on a 2009 - 115hp Adv bike.
    I believe foam filters need higher voltage at TPS.
    I also believe TPS should be adjusted accordingly on each motorbike, starting with the recommended settings, but not sticking to them too meticulously.
    Cheers.
    #31
  12. dgjackson40

    dgjackson40 Been here awhile

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    Thanks Gefr. I have sent you a PM.
    #32
  13. TEZZA

    TEZZA ADV B4 DEM/TED

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    I have had some problems with the bike rev's up to 3000rpm and 4000rpm .

    The 990 is a 2007 black ABs model @ 55,000kms , the problem started about 12 months ago with the bike not wanting to run smoothly .

    Then about 5 months ago the bikes rev's went up to 3000 rpm to 4000 rpm while riding along and I had No control of this .

    Last week we set of for a 9 day ride and had just had some cutting out of the engine without any reason .

    I replaced the fuel pump that I got from Gefr and had no problems from then .

    We started the ride and then the rev's started going up to 4000 rpm and staying there , I contacted a friend about the F1 light that was sensing the 6 flashes that is the TPS problem .

    I got the bike to the KTM dealer to change the TPS over .

    When they received the TPS it was worked out that it was the other TPS that they rarely have any problems with , and it is not the Main TPS .

    KTM and the dealer are trying to get some information from the Throttle body suppliers so that they can reset the values on the TPS .

    There is also the other possible of the clutch switch or the main TPS giving a fault in the feed back to the other TPS that is causing the high rev fault .

    The only other way to repair this problem is to replace the Throttle body as they don't sell the other TPS as a separate item .

    Any one got any help for me , or has any one fitted the 2011 TPS on to the 2007 model as they have different ECU.

    Thanks Tezza:ear
    #33
  14. Gustavo.Ramos

    Gustavo.Ramos Long timer

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    Don't go with too many variables, you'll end up replacing unnecessary parts. check the TB's wiring connections. take these off and put them back on with electric contact cleaner.
    #34
  15. rider911

    rider911 Shortcut Navigator

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    If you buy a complete S/H throttle body assembly off ebay like myself and Gusto did, I will guarantee that it will be cheaper than trying to find the real cause especially if you are paying a mechanic to do the work. And you will be riding your bike instead of tearing your hair out.

    The 2011s sort of have a different ECU but they are really the same. They use an immobiliser but if you order a new ECU for your 07 you will get the latest ECU part no. The difference is only software.
    I am surprised to hear that the two TPSs are different, I thought plenty of people have purchased this part off the later bikes.

    A faulty TPS should be easily identified with an oscilloscope using the info supplied by Defaultgateway.

    Gefr is convinced that every problem like this is the TPS but I am not of the same opinion.
    You need to understand that the TPS idle reading is not only controlled by the setting which you adjust the TPS in relation to the throttle body. The position of the throttle shaft does not rest on a stopper, it is held in position by the idle control motor which theoretically can move infinitely and thus change the reading of the TPS. So if the idle stepper motor malfunctions or is given a bad signal from the ECU then the TPS reading will also change.

    If Ive lost you this is the senario: you set the TPS voltage at .6V, you start the bike and it idles good, BUT somewhere in the wiring harness there is a plug connection that is bad and due to vibration the circuit to the idle stepper motor inherits a slight resistance and causes the voltage to the stepper motor to change. The stepper motor is directly connected to the throttle shaft which is directly connected to the TPS, so now you've got a different TPS reading and the idle revs go up or down. Did the TPS have any bearing on this??? I think not.

    This is why these problems are so hard to diagnose, did the chicken come before the egg or was it the other way around?

    Buy a second hand complete unit and go riding I say :evil
    #35
  16. Gustavo.Ramos

    Gustavo.Ramos Long timer

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    This goes against all in my non officialy recognized engineer mind... however, like said, i've been down this road before and spent way too much time, few hair strings since i'm close to baldness, and got a set of ised tb's. Ever since the bike has gone over 20k kms w/o issues or complaints from current owner.

    Nevertheless this was the easy way... bike is just too damn fun to waste time fidling with electronics...
    #36
  17. dgjackson40

    dgjackson40 Been here awhile

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    TEZZA, see my thread concerning basically the same issue and what seems to have hopefully got me going again. I have TuneECU so was able to use it to help out tremendously.

    http://advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=964869
    #37