Bicycles on the road

Discussion in 'The Perfect Line and Other Riding Myths' started by ThatOtherGuy, Oct 12, 2011.

  1. Offcamber

    Offcamber Long timer

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    I was waiting for the lame pedestrian argument....as not consider vehicles, and not subject to the rules of the road as it pertains to traffic, pedestrians are irrelevant to this discussion. But since you predictably brought it up , they have side walks, paid for by tax dollars, bikes can't use the side walks....but yet the bike owner paid taxes.... pedestrians can't walk in the middle of the road....or hold up traffic either....

    Bicycles should pay a reg fee to use the roads, they are subject to all other traffic laws. The mode of power is irrelevant. I pay a registration fee for every vehicle I own...just because I pay for one doesn't mean that all the others are exempt. If mode of power is the issue what about propane and natural gas powered vehicles....hmm no revenue from fuel taxes there....oh wait they paid registration fees....
    I'm not suggestion a bike should pay the same as a car or even motorcycle I realize they impact roads less and should pay accordingly but if your giving a group the same rights as another they should have the same burdens as well.
    #81
  2. bumblebee1

    bumblebee1 All bikes are dirt bikes

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    I object to people crossing the road without looking and cutting in front of a car.
    I object to groups of people walking in the middle of the road trying to assert their manhood.
    I object to pedestrians crossing an intersection against a red light.
    I object to those that walk on the side of the road in the same direction as trafic.
    And those are just the ones that come to mind.
    I'm sure there are many other examples to be mentionned.

    There is no cure for stupid.

    When I see a man riding a bicycle, I assume he lost his license for drunk driving.
    There, I said it! :lol3
    #82
  3. Offblnz

    Offblnz Long timer

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    I won't fuck-off! You have learn to SHARE, cause sharing is caring and I do know that you deep down care for my Danish spandex clad, soccer mom attracting bunz!:freaky:kumbaya

    So, go suck a goat!:ksteve:lol3
    #83
  4. gmiguy

    gmiguy You rode a what to where?

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    There are large portions of the country where sidewalks do not exist, so people walk along the road shoulder same as bicyclists do.

    Pedestrians are relevant inasmuch as they share the following characteristics with bicycles:
    -Slower and more vulnerable to collision injuries than motorized vehicles
    -Exempt from registration and licensing
    -De facto exempt from fuel taxes
    -Cause little to no damage/wear to the road surface

    In fact, I'd submit that a bicycle has more in common with a pedestrian than it does with a car; especially in areas where side walks are limited or nonexistent.

    Despite that, I'm sure that if bikes could be successfully taxed they would be. I think practical issues are the primary reason that no widespread registration/plating process exists for bicycles. There's no VIN, no title, and no odometer on a bike, and they're generally low-value compared to motorized vehicles. I don't see any logical reason not to plate/tax bicycles, but I also don't see a practical way to implement it.

    I'm sure if you could buy a new car for $300 at a department store with no paperwork whatsoever they would be much harder to tax, too.
    #84
  5. Offcamber

    Offcamber Long timer

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    It doesn't matter that you think they have more in common with pedestrians than motor vehicles..they are subject to the same rules....there for they should follow all the rules and have the same responsibilities. You don't have to tax the bike per say...permit the rider. Think of it as a riders license.....
    #85
  6. GP640

    GP640 Long timer

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    :becca

    All this crap.

    In this country, bicycles are vehicles in the eyes of the law and subject to the same traffic laws as motorized vehicles.

    I am required, by law, to ride as far to the right side of the road as safely possible.
    I am also required to obey all traffic signals.

    If I am using a path system that intersects a road, I am required to dismount and walk through the cross walk.

    Share the road? You bet. I have ridden in many cities in Canada and I've experienced morons in cars and on motorcycles
    in every one of them.
    My wife and I did a 75km road ride in Haliburton Ontario this past summer and we were amazed at the civility
    of drivers. Maybe it had something to do with the large O.P.P. logo on our jerseys or maybe it was the fact that
    people were just more aware of cyclists. I can only hope that all the bicycle haters are internet blow hards.
    #86
  7. Offblnz

    Offblnz Long timer

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    I never saw friendlier people towards motorcyclist as I did in Ontario and Quebec. Makes you almost go "What are these people up to?":lol3
    Quite a revelation to come back to the US and be tailgated 2 miles from the border....aah, normal again:becca:lol3
    #87
  8. filmfan

    filmfan Long timer

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    Cyclists wear what they wear for the same reasons people wear whatever gear they use on a moto.
    It's more comfortable and more functional than the alternatives.

    It really isn't to piss people on motos and cars off.

    There are plenty of jerks riding bicycles, but if you did an objective survey, there are probably more piloting motos, cars and trucks. After all, there are lots more of those on the road than bicycles. I know I see them every day.

    As for the tax thing, I pay with my car taxes, the moto taxes and the taxes on the fuel they burn, and when I ride my bike I'm not putting anywhere close to the damage on the road that the car does. And whether I use my car or not, the tax is paid.
    If it would end the lame argument about paying for the use of the road, I'd gladly pay a registration fee for my bicycle. But no one has made the decision to require that. If you want that, tell your gov. officials.
    Let's put registration stickers on every pedestrian's butt too while we're at it. There are no sidewalks within 5 miles of my house, so all the people walking are using the road for free too. So is my neighbor's horse, leaving crap all along the road to boot.

    Get real.
    #88
  9. La Machine

    La Machine 2>4

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    Fellows, please stop focusing on the spandex. I mean, we all know that motorcycles are great way for fat guys to pretend they're getting exercise, but do we really have to compound things by adding a homoerotic angle too? What would our wives think?

    BTW, totally tax bicycles. My damned kid has been freeloading for WAY too long.
    #89
  10. Nightfall

    Nightfall Disco-Trash

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    If there is no oncoming traffic I go into the other lane, in more crowded urban environments I slow down and wait until there is no car beside me and give them as much room as safely possible. I myself am a cyclist and we greatly appreciate the space, please don't buzz us.
    #90
  11. PT Rider

    PT Rider Been here awhile

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    So why do the bike riders who are outside the bike lane get so irate when I pull up alongside them and drift over and force them into the bike lane that my gasoline tax money paid for???

    Actually most of the mountain road bike riders are good--I give them a couple of toots on the horn, they pull way right, and I pass way left.

    In town we have painted bike lanes. One is on a downhill road with a right tee intersection. When the bike rider (a) passes on the right (b) over the speed limit (c) through the intersection, will he be surprised when I turn right in front of him?

    When the bike rider is riding with his wheels on the left bike lane line, and the left half of his bike outside the bike lane, is it OK for me to ride or drive with my tires on the same bike lane line with part of my vehicle inside the bike lane?
    #91
  12. dolomoto

    dolomoto Destroyer of Motorcycles

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    To what end?

    Cyclist can be ticketed now without any more laws.

    Are you a fan of more laws?

    I'll go along with bicycle registration as long as the laws are rewritten so that the tax is based on weight.

    I'll gladly pay a tax for my total weight of 200lbs (my fat behind plus Ti bicycle) as long as the folks in the 6000lb SUV's pay a proportionate amount. I mean, we should be fair about this, right?
    #92
  13. filmfan

    filmfan Long timer

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    About bike lanes and paths:
    They are nice, every once in a while they are actually functional.

    A town about 15 miles from me has a bike path that's about 2 miles long. It starts nowhere and it ends nowhere. So it's fine if that's what you want to do, but if you actally want to go somewhere you need to use the road.

    Many bike paths or lanes in cities are the same way, the problem is that they get often get put in haphazardly with no thought of how functional they actually are, either for recreation or transportation.

    As for lanes in cities, they collect the same crap that the road shoulders do, plus parked cars. Usually the clearest path is nearest the line marking the motor traffic lane.
    If you want the rider to stay totally within the bike lane, fine, but what are you going to think when you see him weaving back and forth dodging glass, cracks and potholes, car doors, muffler heat shields and all the rest of it? Its far less confusing for drivers to ride a straight path, whereever it is.

    As for being on the line, so what? If you happen to be riding in the right tire track, and there's a hole you need to dodge, and the best path is to the right, are you going to hesitate doing it because the line is there, and you're saddlebag will be over it? What if the next three miles of road is covered with holes, cracks and metal, and the safest path for you is next to the line are you going to be bothered by riding there?

    For getting around a cyclist, all that's needed is the 3 feet that some states are requiring. Not even that really, but we like to talk about laws in this thread. I prefer not to get buzzed, but if you get off on that, so be it, I'll take getting buzzed by a moto over a car any day.

    3 feet is easy if you're on a moto, and you don't need to be anywhere near the center line to do it even when there are multiple bikes side by side. If there are multiples, and they aren't moving over when you've made sure they know you're there, buzz them, be my guest, teach them a lesson, but consider what lessons some cage might be wanting to teach you sometime.

    Who knows? It might be driven by some bicyclist who was using your road for free when you gave him/her a lesson.

    Everyone can stand a learning opportunity once in a while, right?
    #93
  14. nytrashman

    nytrashman old and in the way

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    i ride some well traveled local bike routes and i can honestly say i hate the way bicyclists ride. 2 and 3 abreast deliberately blocking traffic and forcing cars into the on coming lane in order to pass. they do not stop at red lights and think they do not have to obey any traffic laws.

    i once asked a local cop if he would give me a ticket if the speed limit was 45mph and i was driving along at 15mph and he said he would ticket me for impeding the flow of traffic. when i asked if he would give bicyclists a ticket when they ride 3 abreast at 15mph in a 45mph zone he said no. WTF, why are they allowed to impede the flow of traffic without being given a ticket?

    if bicyclists want to gain my respect as a legitimate form of transportation on public roads then they need to show some common curtsies, as well as obey the traffic laws.

    right, wrong or indifferent, that cute little spandex suit and your funny little helmet is not going to do you any good when you or one of your buddies who are riding 3 abreast get clipped by a car or truck. i learned a long time ago when i was a kid that if you ride your bike in traffic and get hit by a car your gonna come out on the losing end. by the way some of these bicyclists ride it is apparent they never learned that lesson as a child.

    again, if you want my respect as a legitimate form of transportation on public roads then start obeying the traffic laws. until that happens you bicyclists are just another group of people who think there entitled to use the road however they see fit, yet you pay no road use tax, no registrations fees and no licensing fees.

    just like loud pipes on motorcycles piss people off, the way you ride your bikes in traffic does nothing but give the general public a bad opinion of all bicyclists.
    #94
  15. La Machine

    La Machine 2>4

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    Problem is that I'm pretty sure the bicyclists aren't really interested in earning your (or anybody here's) respect. And as you pointed out, they don't actually have to, since what they're doing is legally protected.

    Soo, the problem may be in your own perception. I know, its a tough nut to swallow. But by all means, keep posting guys. It sure is fun to imagine a world where the rules were written by you, isn't it? In MY world, I have the power to blow up Mercedes Benz's with my mind.
    #95
  16. t6pilot

    t6pilot Been here awhile

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    Problem with many bicyclists they want their "rights" but totally fail their responsbility part of riding. Start with obeying traffic laws. Stoplights, stop signs wrong side of road no lights at night etc. Every time a bicyclist gets hit it assumed to be cars fault according to cycle Nazis. not so where I live. In fact if you cause a accident because of your improper riding you can be cited and sued for damages
    #96
  17. bumblebee1

    bumblebee1 All bikes are dirt bikes

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    A long time ago, all bicycles had license plates.
    I had a bike with a license plate on it, so it was imposed on kids too.
    If I remember right, it was about $3.00 in 1970's dollars.
    I don't know what that comes too in todays money.
    It was a form of tax I guess.
    That has since been removed.
    I think a mandatory license plate would help identify those that constantly dis-obey the law.
    A quick picture or film would do it (photoshop would really help in this. hehehe).
    If well managed, it would also curve the theft of bikes.
    You wouldn't be able to register a stolen bike and plate it.
    #97
  18. bumblebee1

    bumblebee1 All bikes are dirt bikes

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    I'm not sure how it works here.
    It seems like the one with the insurrance gets nailed, no matter who's at fault.
    Land owners get the same treatment.
    Jump the fense, make a mess, trip and break a leg, go after the land owner's insurrance.
    A woman was running on the sidewalk and ran into the side door of a pickup that was turning right on a green.
    She had the right of way and they went after the truck owner.
    The truck was almost at a stop when she hit. She wasn't paying attention and wanted to make the light no matter what.
    That's how screwed up things are now a days.
    #98
  19. rivercreep

    rivercreep Banned

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    The Road-Bike cyclists in my area who are courteous enough to follow the traffic laws and stay to the far right of the road as safely possible (as per vehicle code) are far and few enough between that I've verbally thanked the ones who don't act like selfish road hogging pricks.
    The MTN. Bikers who I sometimes see on the street, are also much more courteous than their road-bike cousins.

    F.W.I.W. I know lots of it has to do with the design of the bikes and those damn 700C 130psi tires (I'm restoring my old 1992 Bianchi Virata Rd. Bike, B.T.W.) but as a fellow cyclist, I'm also aware of those limitations so you elitist assholes aren't fooling me at all when you hog the middle of the road.(I.M.H.O. you're the H.D. Pirates of the Bicycle world)

    I'll safely pass any Bicyclist that shows me some courtesy by following the road laws here in Pa. but, you packs of assholes that want to hog the whole damn road; don't be surprised when I ride into the middle of your "gangs" when I'm on my M.C. and tailgate the shit out of you when I'm driving the cage.

    You want respect = you show respect. It's that fucking simple.:ear

    Ps. if the laws in your State say you can legally ride 2-3 abreast in your State and not yield to motor vehicles, please cite that laws section here on ADV rider. (in Pa. it's illegal!)
    #99
  20. Schnickelfritz

    Schnickelfritz pick, grin, repeat

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    Let this fucking thread die. Preferably a quick death over in HE.

    There are selfish disrespectful cyclists all over. News flash. You don't like the way someone is riding? Call the cops.

    And there are stupid, selfish, cowardly, fake tough guys in cars and on motos who feign outrage over being delayed (and who usually carefully frame their poster-child moment in such a way to leave no doubt that the mean old cyclists were maliciously and deliberately targeting said poor fake tough guy in order to cause an assault-worthy provocation:rolleyes) but only ever take it out on cyclists. And then they invariably run away. That's what makes them cowards. Alas, cowardice isn't a crime.

    These stupid motherfuckers deserve each other. Too bad we can't put them on a circular test track somewhere where the rest of us won't have to deal with them. As a moto rider, a car driver, and a cyclist, I'm fucking sick of listening to them and watching them, and I'm embarrassed by so many of my fellow members of each class.

    So why don't we give it a rest? We can come back when cyclists start actually doing something dangerous that is more than a blip on the radar among motorists who do 1000x the shit cyclists do, including deliberately slowing down traffic (you think deciding to drive, alone, in a car with 4-8 empty seats, past co-workers' homes and past neighbors' workplaces, isn't deliberately creating congestion?), running stop signs and lights, assaulting more vulnerable road users, and taking up more than the rightmost 3 feet of the lane with their mostly-empty cars.

    Shitty cyclists don't change this fact: anyone who wants to physically threaten, harass, or graze cyclists with a car or moto is a fucking coward.

    To the cyclists in here, I say: don't feed the trolls. You say you've tried reason? Pfff. Most of them aren't smart enough to realize they and their fellow motorists are 99.99% the problem, not cyclists. Let these yellowbellied, lycra-obsessed bottomfeeders have this fapfest. Go ride. And ride right.