Broke my R100 GS subframe. Again.

Discussion in 'Old's Cool' started by scottw, Jun 21, 2005.

  1. scottw

    scottw Steppe Rider

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    Ok, second time in two years for my R100 GS ('89). This happened last year and I had it welded back together. Anyone know of any sources for a reinforced subframe? I'll have this one welded again here, hopefully with some bracing, but I'd like to just get one made by someone who knows what they're doing.

    And don't point me to HPN, I don't have that kind of $$. :eek1

    All other ideas appreciated. :ear :ear

    Here's the left side:
    [​IMG]

    And here's the right:
    [​IMG]
    #1
  2. Gusgus

    Gusgus Banned

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    Well I can see one trouble with your repair.
    I am an aircraft mechanic and have been welding frames for aircraft (supercubs) for years.
    The weld or repair actually caused it to break.
    Here is why.

    In a crack across the tube (like your tube) the repair isn't going to be as strong as the old tube without additional metal added and in a far different place than the crack. In other words there should have been triangle plates added after the tube was welded. Added over the weld. Then made sure they fit well and welded also.


    If done as shown here .....

    <?xml:namespace prefix = v ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" /><v:shapetype id=_x0000_t75 stroked="f" filled="f" path="m@4@5l@4@11@9@11@9@5xe" o:preferrelative="t" o:spt="75" coordsize="21600,21600">http://www.airweb.faa.gov/Regulatory_and_Guidance_Library/rgAdvisoryCircular.nsf/0/99c827db9baac81b86256b4500596c4e/$FILE/Chapter%2004.pdf</v:shapetype>
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    <v:shapetype stroked="f" filled="f" path="m@4@5l@4@11@9@11@9@5xe" o:preferrelative="t" o:spt="75" coordsize="21600,21600">Page 4-67</v:shapetype>
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    <v:shapetype stroked="f" filled="f" path="m@4@5l@4@11@9@11@9@5xe" o:preferrelative="t" o:spt="75" coordsize="21600,21600"></v:shapetype>
    <v:shapetype stroked="f" filled="f" path="m@4@5l@4@11@9@11@9@5xe" o:preferrelative="t" o:spt="75" coordsize="21600,21600">It will not crack ever,,,, again.</v:shapetype>
    <v:shapetype stroked="f" filled="f" path="m@4@5l@4@11@9@11@9@5xe" o:preferrelative="t" o:spt="75" coordsize="21600,21600"></v:shapetype>
    <v:shapetype stroked="f" filled="f" path="m@4@5l@4@11@9@11@9@5xe" o:preferrelative="t" o:spt="75" coordsize="21600,21600">The trick is a great fit prior to welding. Then a great weld is also essential.</v:shapetype>
    <v:shapetype stroked="f" filled="f" path="m@4@5l@4@11@9@11@9@5xe" o:preferrelative="t" o:spt="75" coordsize="21600,21600"></v:shapetype>
    <v:shapetype stroked="f" filled="f" path="m@4@5l@4@11@9@11@9@5xe" o:preferrelative="t" o:spt="75" coordsize="21600,21600">The weld done on the first break could never have lasted. It actually creates another break just from the stresses at the repair.</v:shapetype>
    <v:shapetype stroked="f" filled="f" path="m@4@5l@4@11@9@11@9@5xe" o:preferrelative="t" o:spt="75" coordsize="21600,21600"></v:shapetype>
    <v:shapetype stroked="f" filled="f" path="m@4@5l@4@11@9@11@9@5xe" o:preferrelative="t" o:spt="75" coordsize="21600,21600">Good luck.</v:shapetype>
    <v:shapetype stroked="f" filled="f" path="m@4@5l@4@11@9@11@9@5xe" o:preferrelative="t" o:spt="75" coordsize="21600,21600"></v:shapetype>
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    #2
  3. BWalker

    BWalker Been here awhile

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    In a crack across the tube (like your tube) the repair isn't going to be as strong as the old tube without additional metal added and in a far different place than the crack. In other words there should have been triangle plates added after the tube was welded. Added over the weld. Then made sure they fit well and welded also.



    Would it also work if you put a solid steel rod inside the frame before welding?
    #3
  4. moosehead

    moosehead Been here awhile

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    These guys make some heavy duty subframes for the R100GS.
    www.overland-solutions.com

    From the UK but from the pix you get an idea of what they're doing.
    #4
  5. Gusgus

    Gusgus Banned

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    Yes it would work if a solid rod was inserted. But first a few holes would need to be drilled in the existing tubes for an external attachment of the internal rod to the exterior tube.
    The welds then are called "rosette" welds The holes are filled with welding material.
    This method is good if a rod can pass through enough of the existing tube. It is strongest if it can travel a minimum of 3 times the tube diameter into each end for strength.
    #5
  6. Stagehand

    Stagehand Imperfectionist

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    extra big girlfriend on the back or something? [​IMG]
    #6
  7. Brick

    Brick Been here awhile

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    Scott,

    I purchased a whole subframe assembly from Ernie at Overland Solutions. It is a work of art. The fit and finish is incredible and it is fitted out with my choice of TT panniers, but they will fit out just about any brand of pannier available.

    The down side is of course, is cost.

    I refit my R100GS for an africa trip to avoid exactly the problem you have experienced. There are also a number of people that have done basic re-inforcemnt jobs onn the stock subframes and have been very successful. Look for articles by Dr. Greg Fraizer (sp). He has done modifications for very little $$ and they are with in the technical ability of just about anyone.

    Good Luck
    Brick
    #7
  8. scottw

    scottw Steppe Rider

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    Thanks for the advice guys. For repairs it sounds like I need a much better welder than the Mongolian guy down the street, but unfortunately he's all I have for the moment.

    I will check out the overland solutions people and see if they can set me up with one of theirs.

    -Scott
    #8
  9. Malindi

    Malindi Zen Adventurer

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    I had Ernie (Overland Solutions) build me a custom rear frame, racks with fitted TT bags. I love it. It'll be the last thing on the bike to break. Here are some pics. This was about 3 years ago. I think I was his first customer. We had two identical sets made for a world tour.http://tinyurl.com/6gymm
    #9
  10. bcostell

    bcostell Been here awhile

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  11. Solo Lobo

    Solo Lobo airhead or nothing

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    Any chance you retained the pattern to reproduce the reinforcement pieces you made? I'd love to make sume myself!
    #11
  12. ChuckTaylor

    ChuckTaylor I digress

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    I have a "spare" R100GS subframe for sale if anyone is looking...
    #12
  13. bcostell

    bcostell Been here awhile

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    Sorry, didn't make a pattern, didn't think of that (duh). The material I used was 1/8"Thk x 1.5" Wide. I think the stock side frame a bit more than half that thickness.
    #13
  14. Solo Lobo

    Solo Lobo airhead or nothing

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    Thanks for the thought, I'll use your photos and wing it from there!



    #14