CCM 450 Adventure

Discussion in 'Thumpers' started by ktmmitch, Jan 21, 2013.

  1. eakins

    eakins Butler Maps

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    you're stretching it a bit. having lived in Mexico for a year and traveled extensively through much of Central America you have to really check your speed for all the things in the road and coming at you. sure you may get over 50 and cruise at 70 at times but much of the travel is lower than the US. a broad power 5 spd would be ideal.
    #81
  2. a1fa

    a1fa Throttle Jockey™

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    The KTM trolls are out of the wood work.. bashing a motor they have zero miles on; a motor they have only read about in the KTM sponsored motorcycle magazine.. Typical -- if it ain't orange, than it ain't right! :eek1
    #82
  3. Crazy Canadian

    Crazy Canadian All who wander r not lost

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    You read my mind...
    #83
  4. Motorfiets

    Motorfiets Long timer

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    hey Vlad... keep the 450 and come race baja 500 with me this summer!! :deal
    #84
  5. Foot dragger

    Foot dragger singletracker

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    I wasnt thinking about ease of CS sprocket changing,more about testers who seemed to think it made for wonky rear suspension action. And some how no matter what bike this engine goes in,excess weight seems to play into the picture. CCM has built a neat bike though,wonder if they'll ship any over here?

    Signed,KTM Troll.
    #85
  6. a1fa

    a1fa Throttle Jockey™

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    The reason why CCM choose the G450X motor is probably due to the fact they got a good deal on the old-new-stock that can pass emissions, hence why the bike is retailing at ~7000 GBP. Simple economics. They did not choose it because it was the best motor, most fuel efficient, and etc. They are getting a lot of performance for very little buy in.

    How good, or how you perceive how good the motor is, is up to you and your experience. If you want to compare power performance in numbers and fuel injection and throttle response, you may want to turn around, and turn your monitor off.. They squeezed a lot of juice out of the G450X. Compare the power on 09 vintage motors, and the BMW wins hands down..

    The G450X is not the most fuel efficient motor, and the tranny configuration is not best suited for extended trips (in the G450X configuration and chassis). The oil capacity is also not very well suited for extended trips.

    The G450X was intended to be raced, trashed, and ridden hard, with occasional enduro here and there. The entire bike was built around this engine for this specific purpose. The bike is an overkill for your typical gravel runner adventurer.

    Back onto the subject, I wonder what is the sprocket configuration they selected, and if they made internal changes to the transmission. With such major change to the chassis, it will be a shame to not address the motor to match the chassis and characteristics and the purpose it was built for.
    #86
  7. a1fa

    a1fa Throttle Jockey™

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    When? That actually sounds like a bad ass idea?
    #87
  8. Motorfiets

    Motorfiets Long timer

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    #88
  9. minkyhead

    minkyhead Been here awhile

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    its a new bike with a high strung motor
    but im feeling that i have a use for it on the weeekend aways with some decent trail riding thrown in
    i can pack me stuff ride there dump it trail ride and then ride back over three days
    #
    ill be clear im not a great off road rider far from it ..... i just love trail riding ...but i hate trailers and vans and all that crap
    ive done it and cant be bothered ..i get a lot of pleasure riding the back roads and dont worry too much about how long it takes ...i get a nose bleed if the front wheel goes more than six inches in the air :huh

    my feeling at the moment is to use the ccm for that sort of two night weekend

    ill probably stick with the tenere for moroco as its tough and well suited to the rocky tracks and very capable until it gets really pretty rough or soft i dont think the ccm would be required for 90 percent of the trip

    my only trail trail bikes have been xl125 dr350 a xr250 xr400 and drz 400 i get a nose bleed if i go over 40 on a firetrack ...ive used beta 450s and a ktm 525 off road which was too much for me
    tired me out ..probably as i couldnt ride them fast enough for them to make sense
    so im thinking this could be the ultimate weekend warrior for a fat old man :clap

    then again it would be a ready to race rally bike for a expert too ...with a a lower gearing or whatever ??

    i could of course sell me tenere 28000 mile up for peanuts and order a new gs for 15 grand
    or keep the tenere which is a cracking bike and try out the ccm for more demading terain without racking up 1000s of miles and keep the extra 5 grand to spend on petrol and beer and torque conveter:evils


    so thats how im approaching the bike ..im hoping it may do better than some think plodding along like i do ... but lets say it could do ..10.000 miles before a major overhaul at 2000 quid thats three years meetings and trails

    if its as good as i hope it to be its not to bad ??? :eek1

    anyway im just saying what i have in mind for it
    and im hoping its going to be a real hoot to ride as for around the world bike ..its got a lot of convincing to do

    how about around north wales in a weekend with a load of trails thrown in ??? in that context its not any more fickle than a 690 ..but with all the tanks and stuff you need ..ok ok want the 690 maby looking towards 10 grand ??

    any way just a insight into my logic ..but now and again you have to buy with your heart instead of your head and a s soon as i saw it i just wanted to give it a chance :1drink

    less of this :lol3









    and more of this is the aim ........one of my biggest ever wheelies by the way :clap:lol3




    if i could have my wish my tenre at 140 kgms would be at the top of my list a grat bike but soo tall



    i wish this could be a little lower and 50 kgms less its a great bike though
    #89
  10. Cruz

    Cruz Lost but laughing.

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    It's spec looks like it would suit you down to the ground Minky.

    Have to be a lot better than picking up that tall top heavy Tenere on the trails.
    #90
  11. JMo (& piglet)

    JMo (& piglet) Gone a bit Baja

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    That engine was always, and still is, built by Kymco (partner/part financier to the current incarnation of CCM), as is the Husqavarna version...

    I imagine there will be a supply of engine parts & consumables as long as there are TE449s on the road, and similarly the G450X (BMW wont simply abandon their customers, not in the short term anyway) - and you'll be able to order parts directly from CCM/Kymco anyway?

    The Husqavarna version was certainly improved over the original G450X spec, with better oil routing etc after BMW/Speedbrain's first Dakar outing in 2010 - so eventually we may well see this CCM with the 'Husky version of the engine installed...

    On a side note. Despite BMW selling off Husqavarna, it would seem that the Speedbrain 449 Rally bikes do still have a foreseeable future (as would the TE449 enduro) as that particular engine supply is not from BMW per se.

    Jx
    #91
  12. jasonmt

    jasonmt Been here awhile

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    Going from a KTM 530 to the Husky 449 the CTS rear suspension feels and reacts differently than the PDS on the KTM but it only takes a couple of rides to figure out how to adapt your riding style to suit and the CTS bikes climb like no others, especially on washed rocks ranging from 10-30cm across.
    #92
  13. JMo (& piglet)

    JMo (& piglet) Gone a bit Baja

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    Yes that's right - BMW seemed to think it [a concentric output shaft] would stop the rear end extending and compressing under power, and therefore improve traction - but it seems it wasn't particularly successful... or if it was, it just felt weird to riders not used to it! - I'm sure using a PDS style shock/no linkage didn't help either...

    As part of the TE449 development, the Husqavarna chassis incorporated a linkage (as does the CCM chassis) which helps to make the suspension action and handling more 'traditional', so I don't imagine the CCM will suffer in the same way as the G450X did?

    Jx
    #93
  14. Wadester

    Wadester Rides a dirty bike

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    I recall reading an article about a fellow who developed a 4bar linkage mount for the rear swingarm. It gave you the equivalent of an extremely long swingarm, and almost completely eliminated engine power affecting the height of the rear suspension. Racers didn't like it because they had learned how to use that "problem" to their advantage. I bet it felt weird.

    Kind of like something I read about rally cars - experienced drivers did better with rear wheel drive (because they could use excess power to pitch the car to the correct angle), but inexperienced drives did better with front wheel drive because it was more forgiving if you gave it too much throttle. 'Course, everybody did better with 4wd.....
    #94
  15. dashmoto

    dashmoto Serial Tinkerer

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    Mert Lawwill, of "On Any Sunday" fame. IIRC he developed it for (some of the first full suspension) mountain bikes, but more recently he was building tricked up street-trackers out of XR1200s...

    [​IMG]

    Varying the geometry of something like that you can make a bike which will do all sorts of things when you open the throttle. ISTR Lawwill had the XR set up to jack the rear up on the power, counteracting the weight transfer - you couldn't wheelie it.

    My nerdy side (I'm a mechanical engineer by profession) would love to build a bike with a four-bar rear end and a Hossack front end - which is essentially the same thing.

    (Edited to add: and arguably there's also a lot in common with the failure of the Hossack front end to catch on, and the criticism of the G450 - there are benefits, but the behaviour is downright strange to someone used to 'conventional' setups.)

    I think the idea behind the BMW was the opposite - without drawing it out to check, I'm pretty sure a concentric sprocket will always compress the suspension on the power - on a dirt bike, encouraging the bike to transfer weight over the rear might help the rear tyre dig in.
    #95
  16. Ceri JC

    Ceri JC UK GSer

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    Emailed CCM to check a few things, seriously considering slapping a deposit on one of these bad boys. I know a few people who ride CCMs as trail bikes and they're nowhere near as 'cheap' looking/feeling or unreliable as you'd imagine, if you had only read about them online.
    #96
  17. minkyhead

    minkyhead Been here awhile

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    when it comes down to it and you look at the equivilent in ktm exc range ..your into 7300 new and then 1275 for a plain fairing and 700 plus pounds for a auxilery tank then some sort of luggage rack is required .. maby a headlamp upgrade to compete with the ccm spec .. so around 9500 to buy a 690 in simalar spec ...well on paper anyway

    you have of course a dealer network and a proven track history with ktm and it would be logically a safer option

    the alloy bonded frame has been used in the ccm motorcross bikes and is at least one part proven i extream conditions and it really is a special peice of work
    a few more photoes recently released underline what ive seen that the ccm is going to be a quality item out of the box

    the hard panniers dont appeal to me but its not often you see a bike kitted out with tins remaining as narrow as it does

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
    #97
  18. a1fa

    a1fa Throttle Jockey™

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    Nice! Any more updates?
    #98
  19. Fishfund

    Fishfund Been here awhile

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    Yes, please more updates. This is sounding like my dream bike. CCM, please let me buy this in America and keep me from settling for a WR250R.
    #99
  20. minkyhead

    minkyhead Been here awhile

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    all quiet at the moment
    ive spoken to mr clewes ..clewes competition motorcycles ...CCM

    im expecting a information pack by e mail very soon ...production will begin soon for delivery late july early august

    apparantly they have had huge interest in the bike and a lot of orders since i last visted the site .. over 200 customers have contacted ccm
    i take this as good news as the longer term future of the bike and back up must surly be better with more buyers ??

    when i get the info pack ill come back on
    im sure looking forward to this bike ,, it bucks the trend of huge weight and huge engines