Countersteering confusion : (

Discussion in 'The Perfect Line and Other Riding Myths' started by IrishJohn, Dec 30, 2012.

  1. HooliKen

    HooliKen Awesome is a flavor

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    Meh! This was nothing. Go ahead and post something like this down in JM and sit back and wait for the responses from the "Basement Overlords." You will learn things that you cannot unlearn as much as you might want to.
  2. IrishJohn

    IrishJohn Adventurer

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    I believe I will remain here in the Penthouse ; ):1drink
  3. bumbeen

    bumbeen Banned

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    Next time you "flick" a bike into a turn, notice that you have to back off on your countersteering input. That is what he is talking about. if you held the same inout you would end up lowsiding.The force on the front tire is indeed pushing the bike left in a left turn and right in a right turn, but that is not the case with the initial input which is countersteering. In a left turn, the front contact patch pushes the wheel right, then pushes left once you're leaned over. That's probably a better way to state it than you are actually turning the other direction.

    Note though if you countersteer at very low speeds(some call it a dip, but it is countersteering) the wheel does turn back the other way completely. It is just at high speeds camber thrust provides a lot of the turning force so you don't see the wheel turn towards the inside of the corner nearly as much when moving slower.
  4. bumbeen

    bumbeen Banned

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    Well I don't really mind it, I'm just hoping that the example will illustrate that you don't necessarily countersteer through the entire corner depending on the bike. I am definitely putting a taller rear tire on the Kawi and raising the forks in the triple clamps a bit.
  5. PhilB

    PhilB Long timer

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    Actually, Coachgeo is exactly right, and EVERY bike you have encountered requires you to turn one way to initiate the turn, then turn the other way to continue it. The "turn the other way" part is generally even less understood than the countersteering part, since it happens pretty much by itself. You countersteer to set your lean angle, then relax your grip and the front wheel naturally comes across the center and you follow around the corner. Then you countersteer again to change your lean angle (whether to tighten the turn, or to end it and become upright again), and once the desired angle is set, you allow the bike to follow its set course again.

    PhilB
  6. Valker

    Valker Been here awhile

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    :y0!:baldy:fpalm




    Argue with this guy...http://www.superbikeschool.com/machinery/no-bs-machine.php
  7. k-moe

    k-moe Long timer

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  8. PhilB

    PhilB Long timer

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    I don't need to argue with that guy; I don't disagree with him. Nothing I said contradicts anything he said, and I certainly wasn't arguing for "body steering" without using the handlebars, which is what you linked to was all about. I'm saying (like he does) that you use countersteering to set up the turn. Then you follow the turn, and then you use countersteering again to end the turn.

    Exactly! Step "e" is the one I'm talking about here.

    PhilB
  9. Andyvh1959

    Andyvh1959 Cheesehead Klompen

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    I think Einstein said it best, "if you can't explain it simply to your grandmother, you don't understand it."

    Like I said, go out, practice, do it, feel it, learn it. Then do it a LOT more.
    Then continue to do it and learn it by feeling it.

    In other words, just ride a lot more and work with it.
  10. Coachgeo

    Coachgeo Diesel Adventurer

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    :clap agree on the quote. AWESOME. Had not heard that. As to learn it by "feeling it". There are those who definitely learn that way. I. M. H. Edumacated O. there are about 7 distinct learning styles and feeling it is but one of them. Again much thanx for that quote. Love it.
  11. Al Goodwin

    Al Goodwin Long timer

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    UNBELIEVABLE....... This thread is still going on...and on.....and on some more. GEEZ LOUISE.
  12. tokyoklahoma

    tokyoklahoma 75%has been 25%wanabe

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  13. Lomax

    Lomax Nanu-Nanu Adventurer

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    I forgot, should I countersteer on my Ural ?

    How often do I have to replace the counter steering fluid ?












    :hide

    Marc
  14. k-moe

    k-moe Long timer

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    Four times as often as I have to on my Yamaha :evil
  15. rbrsddn

    rbrsddn 3banger

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    Physics always kick in just past walking speed!!!!!:deal
  16. IrishJohn

    IrishJohn Adventurer

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    Damn I'm sorry I started this!! Can I maybe end it by simplifying my question???

    IF there is some hazard in front of me - should I simply 'steer' the way I have been all along as described in my intitial post or should I make a DELIBERATE push the opposite way I need to go?

    IE - should I rely on instinct/expereince or try to deliberatly 'force' the handlebars??? :(:
  17. shaddix

    shaddix Banned

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    It will or is already ingrained into your brains. My emergency response to an obstacle that needs to be swerved around is a strong countersteer and I do not even have to think about it.

    I've even only had one hand on the bars before and pulled the right grip towards me to swerve left and it was all instantaneous with no conscious thought.
  18. Lion BR

    Lion BR I'd rather be riding

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    No need to "force" anything, only very lightly push the side of the handlebars where you want to go to (push right to go right, push left to go left). I've uploaded this video for you (below), practice it every time you go on a ride and after a few times it will become an instinctive move.

    <iframe src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/mQzhklimyFs" allowfullscreen="" frameborder="0" height="480" width="640"></iframe>
  19. DAKEZ

    DAKEZ Long timer

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    :lurk
  20. Dream Rider

    Dream Rider Servant

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    This person nailed. Push left, go left, push right, go right and look through the turn!!!!!!!! Just go to an empty parking lot ride at a fast walk and push the bars right and left and you will see what happens. simple. Really.