Dealing with dealers.....

Discussion in 'The Perfect Line and Other Riding Myths' started by outdoornate65, Nov 19, 2012.

  1. Pantah

    Pantah PJ Fan from Boston

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    The main purpose of telling them you are an immediate cash buyer is to let them know you are not tire kicking and that you are ready to close a deal immediately. Commission sales people don't really care about financing incentives or extended warranty sales. They care about closing a sale during their pay period. :deal :D

    But like I said before, I try and do business with dealers I like and just look for a fair price. I'll be back and want their support continued.
    #41
  2. markk53

    markk53 jack of all trades...

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    It all depends on what the customer wants to hear...

    Some dealers have low listed prices they jack up with various "costs". Others will give you a real number without jacking up.

    Example: When I was selling about four years back, we had a copy of a customer's sales receipt from a Michigan dealer who sold him his CBR for $8000 versus our $9200. The final difference in OTD price? $3 less than we were. Yep THREE BUCKS. He got to travel five hours around 200 miles one way then back for $3! :lol3

    Do you honestly care about anything other that what the bike will cost you out the door?

    By the way, be careful if buying out of state, you may get a lower price because they may not be charging you the sales tax and some title fees you may have to pay when transferring title in your state. I think dealers are supposed to do all the title work to get you or the bank a title in your state, but I'm not sure of that.

    Key thing to remeber -

    1. How much is the OTD figure - the price you will actually be paying including all taxes and fees, including financing costs. A buyer is a dumbass if they let any other number sway their decision. .
    2. How much is it worth to buy at the dealer of your choice should they not be the lowest priced? I know I am willing to pay a few hundred more to deal with a local dealer that I know and in which I have confidence. I make them my last stop when shopping for anything they may sell. (They now deal with guns and I got the lowest price I found on the rifle I wanted without telling them the pricing I found on line. I simply asked what they wanted for the rifle - they were $15 less than anything I found, no shipping adding only sales tax.)
    #42
  3. ragtoplvr

    ragtoplvr Long timer

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    I once had a dealer beg me to fiance a new car even though I had the cash. Promised no early payment penalty in the loan.

    So I had them draw up the papers, buy me a coke and let me sit down and read them Sure enough, while no early payment penalty, I still had to pay ALL the interest. Very careful wording to hide that, took me over 1/2 hour to find it.

    I got out my check book. wrote out a check for the amount we had agreed, said take it or leave it. I had a friend that worked there, they knew that. He said the sales manager came up to him with a check, and asked if I could do that. Mike smiled and said oh yea. The sales manager said why do we not know him. Mike said he is frugal, well he probably said tight ass but you get the picture.. He told them they were lucky I was there at all.

    They ended up taking the check. Last new car I ever bought. It was a lemon.

    Rod
    #43
  4. Pantah

    Pantah PJ Fan from Boston

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    I did that once in the 80's. I made a deal based on financing and then paid it off after the first month. It was a TransAm. No pre-pay fortunately, but I never actually looked like you did. I could have been a real dumbass. On the other hand, they have usery laws so the pre-pay couldn't be that big for 20 or 30 days of financing.
    #44
  5. Pantah

    Pantah PJ Fan from Boston

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    So Markk53 - In the states that I have lived, the tax and registration are paid to the state when you register the vehicle. If I buy out of state (which I did for one bike this year), the dealer charged me the state fees, but gave me a form for our RMV. The RMV took it as issued me a plate.

    To my way of thinking, OTD is pre-tax and registration since the state fees are the same no matter where you buy it.
    #45
  6. norcal1

    norcal1 Cameron Park, CA.

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    I agree with the dealer could care less about the cash deal. My last bike I told the dealer what I would be willing to pay out the door and I have cash. He said only way he could give it to me at that price is if I financed it. So I did and paid it off in less than 30 days. I paid 54.00 in intrest but saved over 700.00.
    #46
  7. cliffy109

    cliffy109 Long timer

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    Absolutely! Another factor for me would be how much enjoyment is there in the purchase. This isn't a car for goodness sake. It should be fun. You should be relaxed and the dealer should make you feel welcome. Finally, the dealer should be one that you can use for service if you need it later and I promise you that if you buy from the same dealer where you service it, you will gain some benefit.

    Essentially, if you like the bike, the dealer and the salesman, buy it as long as the price isn't totally crazy.
    #47
  8. cliffy109

    cliffy109 Long timer

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    Walking in to a car or bike dealership and announcing that you deserve a bigger discount because you are paying cash is exactly like saying, "I expect you to give me a big discount because you will have no chance to sell me any accessories, warranty or insurance plans." It makes no sense what so ever. I work in the car business and cash customers rarely buy anything other than the vehicle so we know our only opportunity to make any money is on the sale price. We can't make up for a short deal by making a few bucks on a warranty or anything else.
    #48
  9. RxZ

    RxZ Legal Drug Dealer

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    This brings up another point. Everything you are buying is its own purchase, even though you are only writing one check. Obviously, don't be so tight with your money that no one wants to deal with you, but treat everything as its own transaction. Trading something in? Negotiate that price. Buying a new bike? Negotiate that. Want some accessories? Negotiate those as well. Again, be fair, but you do not have to pay full MSRP either.
    #49
  10. concours

    concours WFO for 41 years

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    Selling extended waranties, upholstery protectant, etc. is the stuff you make money on. Sorry your pay structure is linked to pimping that rubbish, but you chose the vocation. Don't for a minute think it's fair exchange, it's not. It's the brainwashing that's served up at dealers. The danger always is, the salesman begins to believe his own line of shit.
    That being said, I agree that the cash buyer is at a disadvantage, the salesman and dealer all stand to make more money selling to the person who finances everything. Including the upside down note on his current beater, leftover form the last fleecing.
    #50
  11. Barry

    Barry Just Beastly

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    Relative to the purchase, buyers need only concern themselves with one number. What does the item cost me OUT THE DOOR. Everything else is noise.

    NEVER discuss trades and purchases together. Sales pukes will try to merge the two, and one has nothing to do with the other. Never has, never will.

    Carry on...

    Barry
    #51
  12. trc.rhubarb

    trc.rhubarb ZoomSplat!

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    Regarding trades... at least in CA, the value of the trade does not offset the value of the vehicle being purchased when it comes to the taxman. I'll gladly take a big loss on the trade in return for the dealer taking a loss on the new bike... package deal and all. In this case, discussing both at once saves a boatload out the door.
    #52
  13. TrashCan

    TrashCan Scary Jerry

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    Taxes are only paid on the trade difference in Tn.
    This completely changes the out the door price, but you knew that.
    :norton

    <table border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0" width="296"><tbody><tr style="height: 53.25pt; mso-height-source: userset;" height="71"><td class="xl72" style="border-bottom: windowtext 1pt solid; border-left: windowtext 1pt solid; background-color: transparent; width: 134pt; height: 53.25pt; border-top: windowtext 1pt solid; border-right: #f0f0f0;" height="71" width="179">STATE</td> <td class="xl73" style="background-color: transparent; width: 88pt; border: windowtext 1pt solid;" width="117">IS THE TRADE-IN EXEMPT FROM SALES TAX?</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl79" style="border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; border-left: windowtext 1pt solid; background-color: transparent; height: 12.75pt; border-top: windowtext; border-right: windowtext 1pt solid;" height="17">Alabama </td> <td class="xl74" style="border-right: windowtext 1pt solid; border-top: #f0f0f0; border-left: #f0f0f0; border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; background-color: transparent;">YES</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl80" style="border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; border-left: windowtext 1pt solid; background-color: transparent; height: 12.75pt; border-top: windowtext; border-right: windowtext 1pt solid;" height="17">Alaska </td> <td class="xl75" style="border-right: windowtext 1pt solid; border-top: windowtext; border-left: #f0f0f0; border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; background-color: transparent;">N/A</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl80" style="border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; border-left: windowtext 1pt solid; background-color: transparent; height: 12.75pt; border-top: windowtext; border-right: windowtext 1pt solid;" height="17">Arizona </td> <td class="xl76" style="border-right: windowtext 1pt solid; border-top: windowtext; border-left: #f0f0f0; border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; background-color: transparent;">YES</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl80" style="border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; border-left: windowtext 1pt solid; background-color: transparent; height: 12.75pt; border-top: windowtext; border-right: windowtext 1pt solid;" height="17">Arkansas </td> <td class="xl77" style="border-right: windowtext 1pt solid; border-top: windowtext; border-left: #f0f0f0; border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; background-color: transparent;">NO</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl80" style="border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; border-left: windowtext 1pt solid; background-color: transparent; height: 12.75pt; border-top: windowtext; border-right: windowtext 1pt solid;" height="17">California </td> <td class="xl77" style="border-right: windowtext 1pt solid; border-top: windowtext; border-left: #f0f0f0; border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; background-color: transparent;">NO</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl80" style="border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; border-left: windowtext 1pt solid; background-color: transparent; height: 12.75pt; border-top: windowtext; border-right: windowtext 1pt solid;" height="17">Colorado </td> <td class="xl76" style="border-right: windowtext 1pt solid; border-top: windowtext; border-left: #f0f0f0; border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; background-color: transparent;">YES</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl80" style="border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; border-left: windowtext 1pt solid; background-color: transparent; height: 12.75pt; border-top: windowtext; border-right: windowtext 1pt solid;" height="17">Connecticut </td> <td class="xl76" style="border-right: windowtext 1pt solid; border-top: windowtext; border-left: #f0f0f0; border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; background-color: transparent;">YES</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl80" style="border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; border-left: windowtext 1pt solid; background-color: transparent; height: 12.75pt; border-top: windowtext; border-right: windowtext 1pt solid;" height="17">Delaware </td> <td class="xl76" style="border-right: windowtext 1pt solid; border-top: windowtext; border-left: #f0f0f0; border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; background-color: transparent;">YES</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl80" style="border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; border-left: windowtext 1pt solid; background-color: transparent; height: 12.75pt; border-top: windowtext; border-right: windowtext 1pt solid;" height="17">District of Columbia </td> <td class="xl77" style="border-right: windowtext 1pt solid; border-top: windowtext; border-left: #f0f0f0; border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; background-color: transparent;">NO</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl80" style="border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; border-left: windowtext 1pt solid; background-color: transparent; height: 12.75pt; border-top: windowtext; border-right: windowtext 1pt solid;" height="17">Florida </td> <td class="xl76" style="border-right: windowtext 1pt solid; border-top: windowtext; border-left: #f0f0f0; border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; background-color: transparent;">YES</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl80" style="border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; border-left: windowtext 1pt solid; background-color: transparent; height: 12.75pt; border-top: windowtext; border-right: windowtext 1pt solid;" height="17">Georgia </td> <td class="xl76" style="border-right: windowtext 1pt solid; border-top: windowtext; border-left: #f0f0f0; border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; background-color: transparent;">YES</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl80" style="border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; border-left: windowtext 1pt solid; background-color: transparent; height: 12.75pt; border-top: windowtext; border-right: windowtext 1pt solid;" height="17">Hawaii </td> <td class="xl76" style="border-right: windowtext 1pt solid; border-top: windowtext; border-left: #f0f0f0; border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; background-color: transparent;">YES</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl80" style="border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; border-left: windowtext 1pt solid; background-color: transparent; height: 12.75pt; border-top: windowtext; border-right: windowtext 1pt solid;" height="17">Idaho </td> <td class="xl76" style="border-right: windowtext 1pt solid; border-top: windowtext; border-left: #f0f0f0; border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; background-color: transparent;">YES</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl80" style="border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; border-left: windowtext 1pt solid; background-color: transparent; height: 12.75pt; border-top: windowtext; border-right: windowtext 1pt solid;" height="17">Illinois </td> <td class="xl76" style="border-right: windowtext 1pt solid; border-top: windowtext; border-left: #f0f0f0; border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; background-color: transparent;">YES</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl80" style="border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; border-left: windowtext 1pt solid; background-color: transparent; height: 12.75pt; border-top: windowtext; border-right: windowtext 1pt solid;" height="17">Indiana </td> <td class="xl76" style="border-right: windowtext 1pt solid; border-top: windowtext; border-left: #f0f0f0; border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; background-color: transparent;">YES</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl80" style="border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; border-left: windowtext 1pt solid; background-color: transparent; height: 12.75pt; border-top: windowtext; border-right: windowtext 1pt solid;" height="17">Iowa </td> <td class="xl76" style="border-right: windowtext 1pt solid; border-top: windowtext; border-left: #f0f0f0; border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; background-color: transparent;">YES</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl80" style="border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; border-left: windowtext 1pt solid; background-color: transparent; height: 12.75pt; border-top: windowtext; border-right: windowtext 1pt solid;" height="17">Kansas </td> <td class="xl76" style="border-right: windowtext 1pt solid; border-top: windowtext; border-left: #f0f0f0; border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; background-color: transparent;">YES</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl80" style="border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; border-left: windowtext 1pt solid; background-color: transparent; height: 12.75pt; border-top: windowtext; border-right: windowtext 1pt solid;" height="17">Kentucky </td> <td class="xl76" style="border-right: windowtext 1pt solid; border-top: windowtext; border-left: #f0f0f0; border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; background-color: transparent;">YES</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl80" style="border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; border-left: windowtext 1pt solid; background-color: transparent; height: 12.75pt; border-top: windowtext; border-right: windowtext 1pt solid;" height="17">Louisiana </td> <td class="xl76" style="border-right: windowtext 1pt solid; border-top: windowtext; border-left: #f0f0f0; border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; background-color: transparent;">YES</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl80" style="border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; border-left: windowtext 1pt solid; background-color: transparent; height: 12.75pt; border-top: windowtext; border-right: windowtext 1pt solid;" height="17">Maine </td> <td class="xl76" style="border-right: windowtext 1pt solid; border-top: windowtext; border-left: #f0f0f0; border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; background-color: transparent;">YES</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl80" style="border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; border-left: windowtext 1pt solid; background-color: transparent; height: 12.75pt; border-top: windowtext; border-right: windowtext 1pt solid;" height="17">Maryland </td> <td class="xl77" style="border-right: windowtext 1pt solid; border-top: windowtext; border-left: #f0f0f0; border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; background-color: transparent;">NO</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl80" style="border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; border-left: windowtext 1pt solid; background-color: transparent; height: 12.75pt; border-top: windowtext; border-right: windowtext 1pt solid;" height="17">Massachusetts </td> <td class="xl77" style="border-right: windowtext 1pt solid; border-top: windowtext; border-left: #f0f0f0; border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; background-color: transparent;">NO</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl80" style="border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; border-left: windowtext 1pt solid; background-color: transparent; height: 12.75pt; border-top: windowtext; border-right: windowtext 1pt solid;" height="17">Michigan </td> <td class="xl77" style="border-right: windowtext 1pt solid; border-top: windowtext; border-left: #f0f0f0; border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; background-color: transparent;">NO</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl80" style="border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; border-left: windowtext 1pt solid; background-color: transparent; height: 12.75pt; border-top: windowtext; border-right: windowtext 1pt solid;" height="17">Minnesota </td> <td class="xl76" style="border-right: windowtext 1pt solid; border-top: windowtext; border-left: #f0f0f0; border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; background-color: transparent;">YES</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl80" style="border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; border-left: windowtext 1pt solid; background-color: transparent; height: 12.75pt; border-top: windowtext; border-right: windowtext 1pt solid;" height="17">Mississippi </td> <td class="xl76" style="border-right: windowtext 1pt solid; border-top: windowtext; border-left: #f0f0f0; border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; background-color: transparent;">YES</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl80" style="border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; border-left: windowtext 1pt solid; background-color: transparent; height: 12.75pt; border-top: windowtext; border-right: windowtext 1pt solid;" height="17">Missouri </td> <td class="xl76" style="border-right: windowtext 1pt solid; border-top: windowtext; border-left: #f0f0f0; border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; background-color: transparent;">YES</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl80" style="border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; border-left: windowtext 1pt solid; background-color: transparent; height: 12.75pt; border-top: windowtext; border-right: windowtext 1pt solid;" height="17">Montana </td> <td class="xl77" style="border-right: windowtext 1pt solid; border-top: windowtext; border-left: #f0f0f0; border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; background-color: transparent;">NO</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl80" style="border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; border-left: windowtext 1pt solid; background-color: transparent; height: 12.75pt; border-top: windowtext; border-right: windowtext 1pt solid;" height="17">Nebraska </td> <td class="xl76" style="border-right: windowtext 1pt solid; border-top: windowtext; border-left: #f0f0f0; border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; background-color: transparent;">YES</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl80" style="border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; border-left: windowtext 1pt solid; background-color: transparent; height: 12.75pt; border-top: windowtext; border-right: windowtext 1pt solid;" height="17">Nevada </td> <td class="xl76" style="border-right: windowtext 1pt solid; border-top: windowtext; border-left: #f0f0f0; border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; background-color: transparent;">YES</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl80" style="border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; border-left: windowtext 1pt solid; background-color: transparent; height: 12.75pt; border-top: windowtext; border-right: windowtext 1pt solid;" height="17">New Hampshire </td> <td class="xl75" style="border-right: windowtext 1pt solid; border-top: windowtext; border-left: #f0f0f0; border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; background-color: transparent;">N/A</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl80" style="border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; border-left: windowtext 1pt solid; background-color: transparent; height: 12.75pt; border-top: windowtext; border-right: windowtext 1pt solid;" height="17">New Jersey </td> <td class="xl77" style="border-right: windowtext 1pt solid; border-top: windowtext; border-left: #f0f0f0; border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; background-color: transparent;">NO</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl80" style="border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; border-left: windowtext 1pt solid; background-color: transparent; height: 12.75pt; border-top: windowtext; border-right: windowtext 1pt solid;" height="17">New Mexico </td> <td class="xl76" style="border-right: windowtext 1pt solid; border-top: windowtext; border-left: #f0f0f0; border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; background-color: transparent;">YES</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl80" style="border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; border-left: windowtext 1pt solid; background-color: transparent; height: 12.75pt; border-top: windowtext; border-right: windowtext 1pt solid;" height="17">New York </td> <td class="xl76" style="border-right: windowtext 1pt solid; border-top: windowtext; border-left: #f0f0f0; border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; background-color: transparent;">YES</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl80" style="border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; border-left: windowtext 1pt solid; background-color: transparent; height: 12.75pt; border-top: windowtext; border-right: windowtext 1pt solid;" height="17">North Carolina </td> <td class="xl76" style="border-right: windowtext 1pt solid; border-top: windowtext; border-left: #f0f0f0; border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; background-color: transparent;">YES</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl80" style="border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; border-left: windowtext 1pt solid; background-color: transparent; height: 12.75pt; border-top: windowtext; border-right: windowtext 1pt solid;" height="17">North Dakota </td> <td class="xl76" style="border-right: windowtext 1pt solid; border-top: windowtext; border-left: #f0f0f0; border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; background-color: transparent;">YES</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl80" style="border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; border-left: windowtext 1pt solid; background-color: transparent; height: 12.75pt; border-top: windowtext; border-right: windowtext 1pt solid;" height="17">Ohio </td> <td class="xl76" style="border-right: windowtext 1pt solid; border-top: windowtext; border-left: #f0f0f0; border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; background-color: transparent;">YES</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl80" style="border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; border-left: windowtext 1pt solid; background-color: transparent; height: 12.75pt; border-top: windowtext; border-right: windowtext 1pt solid;" height="17">Oklahoma </td> <td class="xl77" style="border-right: windowtext 1pt solid; border-top: windowtext; border-left: #f0f0f0; border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; background-color: transparent;">NO</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl80" style="border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; border-left: windowtext 1pt solid; background-color: transparent; height: 12.75pt; border-top: windowtext; border-right: windowtext 1pt solid;" height="17">Oregon </td> <td class="xl75" style="border-right: windowtext 1pt solid; border-top: windowtext; border-left: #f0f0f0; border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; background-color: transparent;">N/A</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl80" style="border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; border-left: windowtext 1pt solid; background-color: transparent; height: 12.75pt; border-top: windowtext; border-right: windowtext 1pt solid;" height="17">Pennsylvania </td> <td class="xl76" style="border-right: windowtext 1pt solid; border-top: windowtext; border-left: #f0f0f0; border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; background-color: transparent;">YES</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl80" style="border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; border-left: windowtext 1pt solid; background-color: transparent; height: 12.75pt; border-top: windowtext; border-right: windowtext 1pt solid;" height="17">Rhode Island </td> <td class="xl76" style="border-right: windowtext 1pt solid; border-top: windowtext; border-left: #f0f0f0; border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; background-color: transparent;">YES</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl80" style="border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; border-left: windowtext 1pt solid; background-color: transparent; height: 12.75pt; border-top: windowtext; border-right: windowtext 1pt solid;" height="17">South Carolina </td> <td class="xl76" style="border-right: windowtext 1pt solid; border-top: windowtext; border-left: #f0f0f0; border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; background-color: transparent;">YES</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl80" style="border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; border-left: windowtext 1pt solid; background-color: transparent; height: 12.75pt; border-top: windowtext; border-right: windowtext 1pt solid;" height="17">South Dakota </td> <td class="xl77" style="border-right: windowtext 1pt solid; border-top: windowtext; border-left: #f0f0f0; border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; background-color: transparent;">NO</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl80" style="border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; border-left: windowtext 1pt solid; background-color: transparent; height: 12.75pt; border-top: windowtext; border-right: windowtext 1pt solid;" height="17">Tennessee </td> <td class="xl76" style="border-right: windowtext 1pt solid; border-top: windowtext; border-left: #f0f0f0; border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; background-color: transparent;">YES</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl80" style="border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; border-left: windowtext 1pt solid; background-color: transparent; height: 12.75pt; border-top: windowtext; border-right: windowtext 1pt solid;" height="17">Texas </td> <td class="xl76" style="border-right: windowtext 1pt solid; border-top: windowtext; border-left: #f0f0f0; border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; background-color: transparent;">YES</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl80" style="border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; border-left: windowtext 1pt solid; background-color: transparent; height: 12.75pt; border-top: windowtext; border-right: windowtext 1pt solid;" height="17">Utah </td> <td class="xl76" style="border-right: windowtext 1pt solid; border-top: windowtext; border-left: #f0f0f0; border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; background-color: transparent;">YES</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl80" style="border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; border-left: windowtext 1pt solid; background-color: transparent; height: 12.75pt; border-top: windowtext; border-right: windowtext 1pt solid;" height="17">Vermont </td> <td class="xl76" style="border-right: windowtext 1pt solid; border-top: windowtext; border-left: #f0f0f0; border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; background-color: transparent;">YES</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl80" style="border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; border-left: windowtext 1pt solid; background-color: transparent; height: 12.75pt; border-top: windowtext; border-right: windowtext 1pt solid;" height="17">Virginia </td> <td class="xl77" style="border-right: windowtext 1pt solid; border-top: windowtext; border-left: #f0f0f0; border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; background-color: transparent;">NO</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl80" style="border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; border-left: windowtext 1pt solid; background-color: transparent; height: 12.75pt; border-top: windowtext; border-right: windowtext 1pt solid;" height="17">Washington </td> <td class="xl77" style="border-right: windowtext 1pt solid; border-top: windowtext; border-left: #f0f0f0; border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; background-color: transparent;">NO</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl80" style="border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; border-left: windowtext 1pt solid; background-color: transparent; height: 12.75pt; border-top: windowtext; border-right: windowtext 1pt solid;" height="17">West Virginia </td> <td class="xl76" style="border-right: windowtext 1pt solid; border-top: windowtext; border-left: #f0f0f0; border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; background-color: transparent;">YES</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 12.75pt;" height="17"> <td class="xl80" style="border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; border-left: windowtext 1pt solid; background-color: transparent; height: 12.75pt; border-top: windowtext; border-right: windowtext 1pt solid;" height="17">Wisconsin </td> <td class="xl76" style="border-right: windowtext 1pt solid; border-top: windowtext; border-left: #f0f0f0; border-bottom: windowtext 0.5pt solid; background-color: transparent;">YES</td> </tr> <tr style="height: 13.5pt;" height="18"> <td class="xl81" style="border-bottom: windowtext 1pt solid; border-left: windowtext 1pt solid; background-color: transparent; height: 13.5pt; border-top: windowtext; border-right: windowtext 1pt solid;" height="18">Wyoming </td> <td class="xl78" style="border-right: windowtext 1pt solid; border-top: windowtext; border-left: #f0f0f0; border-bottom: windowtext 1pt solid; background-color: transparent;">YES</td></tr></tbody></table>
    #53
  14. Martad00

    Martad00 Adventurer

    Joined:
    Nov 21, 2012
    Oddometer:
    11
    Location:
    Richmond, VA
    Could not agree more. I always try to get a FAIR price, not necessarily the absolute best price. If a dealer is fair with me early in the process, I am appreciative of their negotiating style and am happy to close the deal quickly.

    When it comes to dealer fees and costs, I don't care about that stuff at all. Just the out the door final price.
    #54
  15. TrashCan

    TrashCan Scary Jerry

    Joined:
    Oct 5, 2005
    Oddometer:
    5,157
    Location:
    Louisville, Tn


    Out of the last 4 offers I have made, I bought or traded 3 bikes.
    The one deal, we couldn't get together on price, but we are still friends.

    I make all my offers OTD.

    It is really very easy to be a happy buyer.
    #55
  16. Barry

    Barry Just Beastly

    Joined:
    Oct 4, 2002
    Oddometer:
    7,419
    Location:
    Fredericksburg, Va.
    I understand your point... My point, which I probably didn't make is you should not discuss the purchase price of the bike you want and your trade in as if one affects the other. The value of all vehicles is what it is.

    An example is if you say "how much is the blue chevy"? And the sales guys says, "that depends, you trading something in on it'? That's bullshit. One does NOT affect the other. And the OTD price is still THE figure the buyer needs to know. Example, if I want to spend $5599 on a KTM 525... I need not concern myself with fees, taxes, prep, etc. If the bike is $2 and there is $5597 in bullshit dealer fees, my OTD price has been met. That is my point. OTD is the only figure that matters for the sale, the trade, if you get a price you like, if you don't, don't trade the vehicle. But the trade does NOT affect the value of the vehicle being purchased.

    Now don't get me started on people that walk into a dealer and say I have $530 I can spend per month on a car". That
    is insanity.

    Barry
    #56
  17. TrashCan

    TrashCan Scary Jerry

    Joined:
    Oct 5, 2005
    Oddometer:
    5,157
    Location:
    Louisville, Tn


    We are on the same page. OTD is all that matters.
    How you get there is the difference in the deal and the attitude that each person brings to the deal.
    You are just trying to take dealing too personal.
    It is only money and product.
    You don't have to buy and they don't have to sell to you.
    #57
  18. Barry

    Barry Just Beastly

    Joined:
    Oct 4, 2002
    Oddometer:
    7,419
    Location:
    Fredericksburg, Va.
    Not sure what I said that implies I take buying and selling personally. I take spending my money seriously. I am not emotionally invested in the process. I buy, or not, if it makes sense and meets my criteria for doing so or not doing so.

    I do take immature, idiotic sales tactics for what they are.

    Barry
    #58
  19. Mk5mike

    Mk5mike Been here awhile

    Joined:
    Aug 31, 2012
    Oddometer:
    308
    Location:
    San Diego, CA
    Well here in central California how can I find or get them to drop the the set up and fright charges. Otd here means MSRP+set up+ freight+ sales tax+doc fee. I was looking at a crf250l and my hook up price was 5200$OTD said he took of the freight charge so non hook up fee would be 5500$. So paying 1000$ over MSRP seam on to you guys? Another dealer in Oregon. Is not charging any set up or fright and no sales tax in Oregon and has a husky tr650 terra for MSRP+ doc fees. Travel cost and sales tax I am not worried about on that deal it just sucks I have to wait tell next I go north to go home to Washington.
    #59
  20. DAKEZ

    DAKEZ Long timer

    Joined:
    Mar 18, 2007
    Oddometer:
    19,747
    Location:
    OR
    As with almost everything there are no absolutes. If my inventory is low a trade-in can and will effect pricing. If the trade-in is something I feel I can move fairly quickly and the bike it is being traded against has been around a while I take that into consideration.

    All of the adversarial and almost hostile posts in this thread are almost beyond belief. It must truly suck to not have good stores/dealerships in your area.

    We must be blessed in the Northwest with a LOT of great dealerships. I can count on one hand the bad stores in Oregon, Washington, Idaho and Montana. (There were a few more but they did not survive the slowdown)
    #60