Designated GPS unit vs. Smart Phone

Discussion in 'GPS 101 - Which GPS For Me' started by NJDirtRiders, Nov 24, 2013.

  1. Tripped1

    Tripped1 Bitch called me a feminist.

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    I am a mainframe/cluster computer guy by trade, and despite that I have been using Android for years it took me a good couple months to get "proficient" with my navigation set up. There are piles of little pitfalls and traps that you really only learn the hard way, and every user is going to have different issues depending on what they are trying to do.

    All I really wanted was the ability to follow a .GPX track
  2. JRWooden

    JRWooden Long timer

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    Thanks EmmEff!

    I just came into some unexpected money so I may pony up for a new dedicated GPS.
    I'll be doing a lot of long-distance traveling this year ...
    so Zumo 395 / Zumo 595 or / ????

    need to do a little quick research and ORDER! :drink
    EmmEff likes this.
  3. webmonstro

    webmonstro A Aventura Continua....

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    To just follow a gpx track , I use orux maps
  4. bross

    bross Where we riding to?

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    Between those 2 I'd go 595, but I didn't like either so I bought a 660 when I switched from my Nuvi, money isn't a consideration, I just wanted the best simple gps and the 660 does that.

    http://www.globeriders.com/article_pages/article02_gps/article02_gps.shtml
    http://www.globeriders.com/article_pages/article03_gps/article03_montana.shtml
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  5. JRWooden

    JRWooden Long timer

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    Thanks OhGood!

    I appreciate your sage wisdom ... there has been too much crap going on in my life for me to focus completely on the important shit like getting TAT-ready
    One of the other guys in the group has a Zumo 59x ... I will try to get something newer and "follow his lead" :drink
  6. JRWooden

    JRWooden Long timer

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    Nice articles thanks - will read them again (slowly ;-) this evening ...
    It looks like the 660 is now discontinued :-/ ...
    but still available from some sources for "roughly" the same price as the 595LM ...
  7. VStromNC

    VStromNC DNS/DNF

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    If you are talking about the Zumo 660, it was discontinued in 2013 and subsequently replaced by the Zumo 390/590 series. Higher model# does not signify anything at least for Garmin. Zumo 660 also similarly to the discontinued Zumo 550 series does not handle tracks natively meaning that like the Zumo 550, it converts tracks to routes and open to route conversions and recalcs.

    I agree that Montana series is much better for organizing tracks but both the Zumo 390/590/595 will read tracks just like the Montana. Unlike Montana, you also don't have to buy extra mapset to get guided navigation for routes. I had my old Zumo 550 for over 10 years without any problem before upgrading to my Zumo 590LM. Garmin had to replace my 590LM for the third time in two years as the audio crapped out on one and two units that froze during firmware update meaning that it was just a paper weight. May have been my old laptop but Garmin did replace it and overnighted the replacement.

    Jon
  8. chrisjk

    chrisjk Been here awhile

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    Until Garmin produces a unit that offers as much as a cheap, rugged smartphone, I cannot imagine ever buying another dedicated satnav. It would be like one of those weird people that persuade a doctor to remove a healthy limb.
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  9. BigFatAl

    BigFatAl Been here awhile

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    Until Garmin makes a unit with WIFI so I don't need a computer I will stick with a smartphone ,oh ya it would have to be sub $100 also !!.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
  10. VStromNC

    VStromNC DNS/DNF

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    I am not a Garmin sales rep. I was just telling JRWooden what our TAT group used and my personal experience. If you want to use your phone doing the TAT, go for it. If your phone does tracks, even better. I had my Samsung 7 as a backup but I always have to fiddle with the micro usb jack as it vibrates out.

    IMHO, I prefer a dedicated GPS unit that does tracks.

    Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk
  11. Dolly Sod

    Dolly Sod I want to do right, but not right now

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    They all do tracks.
  12. ohgood

    ohgood Just givver tha berries !!!

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    tracks ? yes, here is the tat, twat, Kat, lwr, and a few hundred other miles of tracks.
    Screenshot_2017-08-30-20-35-41.png

    and about 3500 waypoints for campsites/geocaches/ricer crossings/etc
    Screenshot_2017-08-30-20-36-55.png

    and a orienteering kmz map overlay
    Screenshot_2017-08-30-20-27-09.png

    with a cheater route in purple and some more geocaches
    Screenshot_2017-08-30-20-27-28.png

    but what most people can't see in the pictures is that the phone doesn't run out of room for tracks, doesn't require a computer to make kmz overlays, doesn't need a computer to plot and edit routes, doesn't need helper programs and a computer to install new maps, doesn't need a computer to share maps/tracks/waypoints.... I can go on

    :-)

    but yes it does tracks too

    :-)
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  13. BigFatAl

    BigFatAl Been here awhile

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    Free wifi at McDonald's for maps and such while on the road.
    I use a smart phone with NO service plan,waterproof,dust proof and $60 new


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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  14. Albie

    Albie Kool Aid poisoner

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    I do to, that's why I use a Samsung Galaxy S5 as a dedicated GPS.
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  15. BigFatAl

    BigFatAl Been here awhile

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    I use this one
    [​IMG]


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  16. ohgood

    ohgood Just givver tha berries !!!

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    I just tested a 60csx a week ago, but decided early on I couldn't deal with a screen that small, and those buttons were..... rolodex to me. I sold it.

    Next up, the oregon 450 vs the duraforce. I believe the oregon is about 6 years old, and the duraforce about 3 years old. The garmin really looks the part of something rugged/reliable, but how does it perform ?

    Here we go, lets find out.

    Oregon set to "hiking" profile, with "auto" for the recording point count, or whatever it's called in the settings. I turned it on at home, then drove to the park about twenty minutes away, with it on the dash. Plenty of time for even a garmin to triangulate. (my rugby took about 15 seconds yesterday, after sleeping for a month) I know someone will say I needed to enable waas, or update the hoo-haa file before getting a good read, but I just turned it on and went.

    Duraforce set to 3 meters OR 3 seconds per point. Of course I'm using locus, like always. I left it in no-cellular-service-mode during this mornings hike, so it didn't get some kind of cheating help from the a-gps stuff. it wasn't turned on until I was in the woods, just so it couldn't see the sky like the garmin could (worst case unfair advantage garmin).

    Oregon was located on a carabiner at the top outside of my pack. Dura was down in the bottom, under my lunch (wrapped in tin foil, no less) and 1 l water bladder.

    I went for a short hike up a waterfall with very steep sides, really it was just a drainage ditch, but waterfall sounds so much nicer, doesn't it ? Then down the gravel path. Then around in the creek.

    I imported the tracks from both devices and gave it a look. The RED track is duras, the GREEN track the oregons.

    I found two interesting differences. One, walking through the middle of the parking lot, turned left, then skirted the parking lot back to the creek. Notice the red followed this path, but the green is .... well, I don't know.
    Screen Shot 2017-09-04 at 1.29.01 PM.png

    Then we went down a little ways and played in the creek. At this point I looked at the backpack on the ground and wondered if both devices were still recording after being in the water for a while. Well, they were, but not the same. I think the oregon had some issues with at least one point, but other than that, not too bad. It does seem to be off by about 40 feet to the NNE, where as the dura is off to the NNW by about ten feet.

    Screen Shot 2017-09-04 at 1.29.43 PM.png


    Anyway, there's that. I'll get a couple of rides at speed, in the woods, and see if there are worse comparisons or better. I'm pretty surprised it wasn't hanging closer to my path, than it was.



    edit... more tracks

    looks like they both enjoy having a big clear sky via driving on roads. the Duraforce looks to be less accurate, until I realized I had the point recording set to 5m or 5 sec, not 3/3 so it looks about right. I guess I could increase frequency for the phone, but it's totally unneeded for street driving or woods.

    pictures
    Screenshot_2017-09-05-09-05-52.png Screenshot_2017-09-05-09-06-27.png

    I've reached the limit of pictures to upload, so I'll continue later with a new post.
  17. Tripped1

    Tripped1 Bitch called me a feminist.

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    Look ma Hardwired!

    20170814_173131.jpg

    That is a Sony Experia Z Ultra in a Pro-clip powered mount. IP67 weather proofing and no USB, good rain or shine (and that phablet has seen a TON of rain, about a solid week worth).

    For you Samsung wireless car mounts are starting to appear, from the S6 on all Galaxys natively support Qi wireless charging, I was looking into such things for my S6 on my other bike since that mount is both to big for the bars on my KTM, and I don't relish moving them back and forth in the event that my girl isn't along. That being said since I still have a pair of S5s (an Active and a Neo) that I am using on said KTM I haven't dug one up with an AMPs or RAM ball type connection.

    RAM also makes http://www.rammount.com/products/gds The USBs on the current Galaxies are sealed, unlike the S4 that I killed, if it detects water it just shuts down the USB port and carries on (this started with the S5 Neo) However, unless they introduced new flavors they don't support any of the Edge devices..which of course I have.
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  18. ohgood

    ohgood Just givver tha berries !!!

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    Oregon vs Duraforce testing continued...


    Yesterday tried waypoint averaging on both devices. First i just cleared the agps data and cold started the phone with out cellular/Wi-Fi enabled(to be more fair) A and turned on the Oregon also. Duraforce had glonass disabled (to be more fair) and the Oregon has waas enabled to my understanding it helps things.

    upon turning them on, I opened locus and waited for the tracks/waypoints to load. GPS lock was immediate once the application started. the Oregon took about ten seconds to lock.

    I compared coordinates, they were off by 00.00001 or 00.00002 , but I won't be uploading images of where I was ;-)

    I turned on waypoint averaging on the GPS and then started "GPS averaging" application on my phone. The app showed +/- 2m in about five seconds, but I let it run when I realized it was going to take the Garmin about three minutes to average a point with "100% confidence" that it displays.

    After about five minutes I stopped GPS averaging app and compared the finals from the Garmin vs the phone. same difference as before 0.00001 or 0.00002 between devices.

    This was in light tree cover (it's hot in the sun! I like shade!)

    So right now I have very similar track recording, and very similar waypoint accuracies between the Duraforce ($54 used today on amazon prime) and the Oregon ($259 used today on amazon prime) models. in sure I could find them for more, or less, workout much effort.
  19. ohgood

    ohgood Just givver tha berries !!!

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    one more for today...

    Oregon vs Duraforce testing

    usb-otg (USB on the go) is a fail. This is a real bummer. I hoped I could connect the Garmin to my phone via a USB cord to transfer stuff to the Garmin like geocaches/tracks, and hand it to a friend to follow. Since the garmins don't have Bluetooth or Wi-Fi, they can't share things wirelessly with phones, so this was my last hope of redundancy on trips, using Garmin products. Sure, I could pull the sdcard from both devices, copy the date to the Garmin card, replace both, and then be done, but who wants to break/loose a card sitting at camp while we should be grilling something to eat ?

    I'm going to keep looking for a possibility, but it looks like it's easier to just carry an extra phone and Finn mount to hand off as needed.
  20. Tripped1

    Tripped1 Bitch called me a feminist.

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    That is actually exactly what I do.

    I keep a quickie clip mount and the S5 mafia on trips just in case that Expieria dies for whatever reason.

    The other thing that you can't see is that there is a USB under that big powered mount....you can see the cable that I have tucked behind the power prongs though.
    ohgood likes this.