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Discussion in 'The Perfect Line and Other Riding Myths' started by willc86, Mar 11, 2018.
Yes, I am aware of that thread. And your point ?
California Vehicle Code 24400. DRL are Auxiliary Lights and the limitations specifically refer to 'hours of darkness". FYI, IF the law does not specifically PROHIBIT it's ok as the law remains moot, is the rule in the USA (not in most other countries). It's what makes us Citizens and others Subjects.
My wife was very relieved when I bought a high-viz air bag vest. Aside from the air bag aspect, my Triumph Tiger 800xc is black, as are my riding jacket and overpants (silver helmet). She says I’m much more visible and recently bought me some high-viz bicycle gear as well...
"Hi-Viz" might be a psychological comfort, but it's not something to rely on.
The California Motorcycle Handbook has the following paragraph:
The best way to help others see your motorcycle is to always keep the headlight on. Studies show that during the day, a motorcycle with its light on is twice as likely to be noticed. Using your high beam during the day and at night increases the chances that oncoming drivers will see you. Use your high beam it is legal and safe to do so. When it is foggy, use the low beam."
I'm not going to research every state, but the above is from California. I do have a citation detailing the legality of headlight modulators in the federal motor vehicle code. I realize we're not discussing modulators.
This Federal law supersedes all state laws and makes motorcycle headlight modulators legal in all 50 states.
FMVSS 108 (Federal Motor Vehicle Safety Standards) (49 CFR Part 571.108 S7.9.4) allows motorcycle headlight
modulation systems all 50 states provided they comply with the standards set forth in this section.
Title 49 USC 30103 (b1) (US Codes) prohibits any state from forbidding a system that conforms to FMVSS 108.
Code of Federal Regulation - Title 49, Volume 5, Parts 400 to 999 - Revised as of October 1, 2000
From the U.S. Government Printing Office via GPO Access [CITE: 49CFR571.108] [Page 236-307]
TITLE 49: TRANSPORTATION - CHAPTER V, NATIONAL HIGHWAY TRAFFIC SAFETY ADMINISTRATION,
DEPARTMENT OF TRANSPORTATION, PART 571, FEDERAL MOTOR VEHICLE SAFETY STANDARDS - Subpart B-
-Federal Motor Vehicle Safety Standards - Sec. 571.108 Standard No. 108;
The above is followed by a full page of details, suffice to say, modulators are legal in all 50 states and US territories.
I m a firm believer in HiViz. When I got my first HiViz gear I noticed that people were noticing me more and I was getting a larger buffer zone. Now, all of my gear is HiViz. Won't ride without it. I even had a trucker in North Carolina stop me at Burger King and thank me for wearing HiViz, because he could see me for a distance and appreciated my efforts to be safe. If truckers notice I would suppose that most people do.
zero point. just info. for anybody who is not aware of the thread.
When I ride or drive, I will see the m/c headlights before I see the rider. just because hi-viz works for road workers doesn't mean it works for a rider.
I have a triangle headlight pattern and three brake lights in the same pattern. some states allow yellow lenses 2nd and 3rd brake lights. yellow is much better than red lenses. I want a cager to see my motorcycle and its lights from a distance, not at a closer distance based on a hi-viz jacket and helmet. IMHO
Well here's my 2 cents-
Once upon a time I bought a '92 R100GS Bumblebee. For those who don't know what it is it's a black GS with some strategic YELLOW accents. especially when viewed from the front or side. The first ride I took on it (pre purchase test ride) I thought "Damn, I have got to do something about this hideous paint scheme!"
After I bought it I was riding it around and noticed that cages seemed to give me a wider berth and I noticed more drivers looking at (noticing) me. Hmmmm....
Later on after many miles on lots of roads I came to the conclusion that the bumblebee color scheme was the logical reason.
Think about it- black and yellow is a color scheme of danger. Yellow jackets, wasps, bees!
Some driver tooling along, not paying much attention to what's going on around them on the road and suddenly in the corner of their vision -black and yellow! - will it sting them? Awareness level goes up, they are paying attention, which is good for us riders.
I've been riding on the street since 1974 and I feel that hi viz is a great asset for any rider.
I even went out and got some black and yellow riding gear. Anything that tilts the odds in our favor is ok by me.
Safe travels all,
Agree 100% that a triangle of lights get's people's attention very well (better than a modulator, without the annoyance factor.) Do not need to be crazy right either - In fact that would probably destroy the effect. When I first got my R1100GS with Motolights down low on the forks, many people commented on it. My KTM 1290SA now also has dual running lights to make a distinctive triangle.
The other thing that made a very noticeable difference was when I put 2" wide blue reflective stripes along the fairing on my old R80RT. Most motorists seem to be keenly tuned to recognize a flash of blue. AFAIK, the blue reflective stuff is legal, unlike blue lights.
I want cars to recognize me as an approaching motorcycle as early as possible, not a totally unfamiliar ball of light they can't make head nor tail off till its much closer. I want them to see me as early as possible but ALSO (hopefully) get their brain to compute 'oh that's an approaching motorcycle' based upon seeing my complete outline. Not leave them wondering and confused regarding the strange unfamiliar light on the road, probably thinking its a low flying UFO.
A research article I found highlighted the importance for motorcycles who use high beam in the daylight to be very conscious of light conditions. Prior to reading that point I hadn't actually reflected where riders with high beams on really give me the shits. It's primarily in the local National Park which is a popular ride location. Much of the ride is covered by a tree canopy with only broken dappled light filtering through. It's on the straights through this dappled light that a bike approaching on high beam (especially cruisers with the main high-beam on, and a two spotlights mounted each side on the bars) nearly blind me.
I don't see any evidence that riders in my neck of the woods using high beam in the daytime consider the prevailing daytime light conditions. None! As riders aren't considering the prevailing daytime light conditions, I believe the current law where I live which makes the practice illegal (same as I believe is the same in most of the world) to be appropriate.
oh wow... had no clue you can use modulating headlights. its kind of true, every-time I do see one, it does catch my attention from a distance. thanks for all the replies
"just because hi-viz works for road workers doesn't mean it works for a rider."
Interesting article here with some of that science stuff in it...Looks like Hi Vis AND Lights is a good combination.
"Hi-Viz" works only for a while. Once the public no longer sees it as "unusual", then they will no longer take notice of it at the level they do when first introduced to it. They'll need some other/more stimulation to "become more aware" again.
This happened with the advent of brake lights.
This happened with the advent of brake lights that flash in a pattern.
This happened with the advent of the "3rd brake light."
Once we become "conditioned to expect certain stimulation" we no longer recognize that stimulation like when it was new to us.
Think about graphics in video animation for a moment. Yes, it is more "life-like" now than ever before.
Play a game that is new with super dooper graphics? It's easier to convince the player that he's really living in that world.
Show the same player and old game from 1980 and they'll quickly become bored because of the simplistic graphics. He's not buying the story at that time.
Sorry I got "off topic". Just trying to give an example that may apply to as many readers as possible.
This does touch on "inattentive blindness."
A white helmet works very well for visibility plus it keeps your fat head cooler in the hot sun.
Be sure to put some orange reflective tape on it like the large reflective arrowheads sold by aerostitch.
Some one i know saw me on the slab in the dark -o- night returning from an adventure and said they could see my fat head and the arrows a long ways away
Hi vis yellow is more like a panacea these days because everyone wears it.
Try using some hi vis orange instead of yellow.
Do not dress in black or wear a black helmet - black absorbs lots of infra red which makes you hot and you blend into the surroundings
Dark painted motorcycles are way harder to see. I know that from going from black rides to white rides to orange and silver now.
Moving from side to side in your lane helps cagers see you better-proven theory, not conjecture
Don't be stupid and put yourself in a bad place
noun: panacea; plural noun: panaceas
a solution or remedy for all difficulties