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Discussion in 'Thumpers' started by Lost-n-Spacey, Jan 3, 2018.
Does a 250cc - 300cc 2-stroke dual sport bike exist?
That depends on where you live. We cannot answer this question without knowing.
In 17 out of the 27 states surveyed thus far on ADVrider, the answer is yes. For the rest of the world? Probably not. Not modernized anyway.
Edit to add: This is where I'm pulling said information from. I've got 27 states input so far.
KTM, Beta, GasGas, Sherco, Husqvarna....all make a 2 stroke with lights and wide ratio transmission....guess it depends on where you live. I don't think anyone makes a completely out of the box street legal 2 stroke dual sport per se.
As I have said in other posts....I can put a plate on a Lawn Boy 2 cycle lawnmower if I wanted....just need headlight, tail/brakelight, horn and mirror. That's it.
I’ve got one of the KTM husky variety. It’s convenient for connecting trails but otherwise I’m not sure why you would want to. 4-strokes are much much better for any riding at sustained speeds. 5-10 miles at 45 mph is about the limit for me. You also attract lots of unwanted attention for LEOs, street legal or not.
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The austrian tpi models seem to work for dual sport! This is awesome, because that is exactly what longer dual sport rides have been missing. Fuel economy seems to be close enoughto big four strokes and otherwise they run just fine.
I used to ride all over SoCal desert and highways on a 2-stroke in the 70's. They were very maintenance friendly (3 moving parts and mine mixed the oil itself). They're coming back in moto, but with fuel injection. I was hoping they had expanded into dual sport. For bursts of power the 2-stroke can't be beat.
The new KTM TPI isn't just "road worthy" because it's FI... carbs work fine.
It's "road worthy" because it's counterbalanced.
Any 2 stroke that doesn't have a counterbalancer is going to make you numb from the nose down after a few miles. That's just the nature of the engines.
Ride a 2005 era KTM and GasGas on the road, and you'll find the GG is smooth as silk in comparison.
The 2-strokes disappeared from the roads, not because of the discomfort, but because of the emissions.
I put thousands of miles on my 2-stroke Suzuki TS185 on the highways/roads/deserts in California and Nevada in the 70's. Back then the 2-stroke was the established motor for street legal enduros, trail/streets, and moto bikes. The complicated 4-stroke was FORCED upon the community by the enviromentalists. Back then, there was a huge effort and monied sponsorships to equip the big names in motocross and enduro with 4-strokes to win everyone over to the 4-stroke. They stressed the smoothness and glossed over the loss of power. Back then, the 4-strokes struggled to justify their existence. The only reason the complicated 4-strokes survived was because of the huge push by the environmentalists. But that argument is gone now. 2-strokes are already coming back (with fuel injection).
The vibration was not an issue back then. It was the norm, and frankly, no one talked about it. Without the environmentalists pushing for it, the 4-stroke would be a collectable rarity now. It would never have made it on its own.
This here's just for you, OP...
With the exception of maybe the X-Trainer and Freeride trials/enduro hybrids, those old style two stroke dual sports don't exist new in any form today.
The 200-300 two stroke enduro and cross country bikes out there now have exactly zero in common with those bikes. They are all race bikes now.
They can be ridden on the street easily enough. I did it for a while. It was fun but tough. But they demand a pretty committed riding style.
DT's and KE's they ain't.
I had a 1980 ts250 and a 1992 dt200.
I loved my two-stroke dual-sports. I currently have a plated KTM 300xc-w, and it's a fantastic dirt bike. With a quick change of countershaft sprocket from 13t to 15t it's a passable dual-sport. A KTM 250/350/450/500exc four-stroke is definitely better on the road (especially the 450 & 500) but for trail biased dual-sporting there's no reason to fear the modern two-stroke. It does bring out my inner hooligan, but so did my dt200 and ts250. Outdoor stairwells call to me
It's the only riding style I've ever known (for an enduro). So if I can ever get one ... (sigh)
This is what I had: (but I removed the turn signals)
Like @Grreatdog said above, they don’t sell a 2stroke in America that is intended for the street anymore. You can use one of the dirty 2strokes as a dual-sport but they aren’t fun for very long on the road. I don’t like my XTrainer on the street but I put up with it for short jaunts because it is AWESOME in the woods.
By committed, I mean my XC200 would come on the pipe at 50 mph and want to wheelie. It also used fuel like a fighter jet on afterburner.
Like I said, they are race bikes now not dual sports. I did a million miles on KE's. My XC200 was nothing at all like that. It wanted me riding WFO out all the time.
It was stupid fun to ride across town but exhausting to ride on the highway.
GPX TSE uses a DT/WR engine...
I rode my plated 04 and 05 plated Gasser's on the road a bit simply because I could, not because they were comfortable. I did giggle a lot admittedly :-D and the front tire spent more time skimming, bouncing or outright off the pavement thanks to Mr Power Valve.
As the Bitingdog states, trail-biased dual sporting. And I think I'm going to swing back that way if I can a good bike. I'm gonna die anyways so let's have fun before that happens
I have a Beta 300RR (2017) 2-stroke that I have used for the odd overnight ride that involves a lot of trail riding. It's usually set up in full enduro-weapon mode; but for these longer rides I usually chuck on taller gearing (14-48 works pretty well, can sit at 65mph without being too uncomfortable). With light luggage options it's very doable and here in Australia my bike is fully road legal.
I still chuck it on the back of my ute though; if the trail riding areas are a LONG way away. I don't like wrecking my knobbies by chewing up highway miles. Once at the area, then the bike is ready for single track, fire trail, roads, whatever. Having oil injection is great; I can ride with a bunch of 4-strokes, goto a fuel station and fill up just like they do. It's a great trail bike, but remember it has its limitations and it won't be as comfortable as a heavier more purpose built dual-sport machine.
However, all your dual sport mates on their fatter bikes will not be able to keep up with you once the trails get rough
I have also recently set up a much more road-biased dual sport - my TE630. This is the bike I'd take for much longer journeys where I enjoy the ride there rather than trailer the bike. Of course; this thing isn't any where near as fast in the tough technical trails.
I don't believe there is one bike to do it all perfectly.
^^nice bike. I agree on the one bike impossibility thing whole heartedly.
Believe me, after several iterations of a trials/woods/dualie quiver to single dualie back to quiver and back to single dualie and accompanying light dualie, I've been trying to figure it out
Don't even get me going on bicycles...
And then I think of a buddy with the full moto, bicyle, float plane and 25 head of horses quiver. That alone helps me reach some inner peace
2-stroke twins worked well on the street and were smooth. I could see a mating of a old Yamaha 250 to 400 cc into a modern dirt bike frame and suspension. John Taylor tried with the Yankee using a 2-stroke twin but it did not sell well.
If you can use the vast resources of Navin Motors to get them platable then I'm willing to try a smoker again.