Does ATGATT have a downside?

Discussion in 'The Perfect Line and Other Riding Myths' started by moron, Sep 6, 2007.

  1. DR. Rock

    DR. Rock Part of the problem

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    I think the real potential downside is that the changes to your riding style are subtle and largely subconscious. If you don't believe me, ride around the block with no gear and see for yourself how cautiously you ride. Most people definitely ride differently with gear on, and I would venture to say that no one rides the same with gear as they would without. So the question isn't "does the gear cause you to ride in a riskier manner?", but rather "how much?". :dunno

    Again, I'm not arguing against wearing gear, just trying to point out some of the perhaps not so obvious psychology underneath.
    #61
  2. RobH

    RobH Don't tase me bro

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    I think you may be on to something but it is probably more likely that alot of these crashing folk just can't ride very well and / or are reckless. There's also a sense of inevitability that is promoted here and on other motorcycle forums: "you will crash, it is just a matter of when". People then present their own examples of multiple crashes to prove this belief. I don't know about everyone else, but the last person I want to take advice from is someone who has crashed many times. While there are accidents caused by other riders and cages that can't always be avoided, there is no inevitability that one must crash because of one's own fault or that problems caused by others can't be avoided. When I was younger and riding my dirt bikes with friends, I crashed all the time. It was almost always my fault for doing something risky and foolish. Going on asphault where the consequences are so much greater should make us all much more careful and eager to minimize risk.
    #62
  3. Strombow

    Strombow Adventurer

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    I think you are right.
    Used to race Motocross and inevitably crashed, broke my ankles and my wrist, smashed my chin on the bars and squashed my gonads. I had all the Motocross protective gear and the dirt still broke me.
    I have all the protective gear for the road but I don't race and have not crashed, the only times I have come close is when I have misread an unfamiliar road.
    Another problem can be too familiar with the road around where you live when you might have other things on your mind.

    Cheers
    Ian
    #63
  4. ThePikeman

    ThePikeman German n00b

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    That's a great thread. ATGATT... oh well sometimes convenience reigns... also called stupidy. I sometimes don't wear pants, though only when in the city where the max speed is about 43 mph (that's my limit for the city, law would be 31 mph).
    Yesterday I was running late for a nice movie, so I put the r12r on Street Fighter mode (Esa) and drove the 8 miles to the city center as hell. I also did only wear jeans (and jacket, helmet, boots, gloves). Man, I did feel unsafe.

    I like feeling safe when I do sit on a mc. This way I can concentrate more on my riding.

    If I ride more risky or faster more depends more on my mood for just cruising along having fun or doing a bit more aggressive riding than on my gear. (Full gear mostly anyways)

    I do have two suits though to cope with the weather. One BMW suit with gore tex in it to keep me warm and dry and another one (Savanna) without gore tex and more holes to open in it than a swiss cheese.
    Just washed one... the water looked quite disgusting... So I still have to admit that heat-thing.

    I have to admit, it takes more time to put on the gear than just taking a car, but that's the deal of motorcycling. A car is easy, fast and safe to use but not real fun. A bike is fun, but not as easy in use and definitely not as safe, especially without gear.
    Commuting makes getting ready to ride quite fast though. Takes about two minutes if I am in a hurry.

    just my 2 cents
    #64
  5. KaribKLR

    KaribKLR Adventurer

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    1. Too hot. Even with full mesh jacket and gloves, and vented helmet, riding with full gear here in the Caribbean takes comittment (and fear of leaving flesh on the pavement).
    2. Much too hot. When getting ready to leave a short errand stop, standing in the full tropical sun while getting all the gear on is almost unbearable. Especially when all you wanted to do was get back up to 50mph to create a cooling breeze.

    All that said, I don't ride without it, hot or not.
    #65
  6. bimmerx2

    bimmerx2 Been here awhile

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    I think you're right on in your evaluation.

    Your comment on riding around the block without gear brought up a thought that is sort of sideways to the original intent of the thread. In an earlier post I half rhetorically asked if riding more 'cautious' was always a good thing. One thing we all learn over time is that when on the bike we have to take control of the situation for maximum safety and sometimes that means getting downright agressive with the right hand. I think for the already somewhat timid rider it can make you "less safe" to ride even more cautious. I've substituted the word timid here for cautious because I think it's really hard to separate the two when you're talking about the effect of riding without gear.
    #66
  7. dgmeister

    dgmeister Been here awhile

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    its too hot to wear my gear today (sarcasm)
    #67
  8. pennswoodsed

    pennswoodsed lizards,bugs and me

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    where is this persons thoughts now ,3 years later ?
    #68
  9. GSXF

    GSXF Been here awhile

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    ATGATT is simply Sexy! Not mentioning leather are better chick magnet than T-shirt. :evil
    #69
  10. Kommando

    Kommando Long timer

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    For some, putting on gear can be a sort of reminder/psyche-up to ride aware. You're not in your safe, enclosed cage anymore.
    #70
  11. Motodisiac

    Motodisiac Moto Terrorist

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    To me, AGATT has two big downsides -

    1. When AGATT, I ride more aggressive. It gives me a feeling of invincibility
    2. When AGATT, I can't really go anywhere without looking like a dork. Even going to grocery store is a challenge if you are fashionable man. I do it anyways but do not like the attention.
    #71
  12. Drilldogger

    Drilldogger Been here awhile

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    Been riding 10 years on the road, and new to off road. I don't believe that every motorcyclist has to crash at least once (referring to road riding). There are a lot of experienced riders that haven't gone down. I believe experience, practice and riding skills are far more important than the gear. I also believe that we should ride as if every cage is out to get us. I also believe that we can't guarantee we won't go down. But how often when someone has crashed, could it have been prevented by slowing down before that blind corner, or preparing for that parked car to pull out. Maybe the rider would have seen the gravel in the corner or that the car with the broken signal was about to pull out.
    I wear a full face helmet, gloves, boots, leather jacket, as a minimum. After joining this site I purchased a pressure suit for dual sporting, and next are some riding pants and knee pads.
    I won't wear everything when going to work or to the store, only on joyrides. We need to be careful out there, but it doesn't help to live in constant fear.
    #72
  13. Wuwei

    Wuwei Long timer

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    Wasn't there just a study released indicating that in states with helmet laws there is no decrease in overall fatalities? I've read the same thing with regard to skiing helmets. Apparently, us humans ratchet up the riding or skiing when wearing helmets, so they don't really save us. When I was a kid and it was a really hot night my dad would take me out riding on his mc to cool off. We wore helmets, but only shorts and t-shirts. Never thought anything of it. When I started riding ATGATT was just hiking boots, jeans, an open-face helmet, and some old work gloves. You might have seen an occasional leather jacket, but certainly nothing with any armor. Nobody thought anything of it. Cars didn't have air bags or even seat belts. We weren't scared. Safety is 95% how you drive, and 5% luck.
    #73
  14. Bonebag

    Bonebag ADDvrider

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    I agree with the ratcheting up when we're wearing the gear..and that does lead into some sticky situations when putting the hammer down and testing the limits..but the gear is there also when the old fugger whips into you or the greasy road sends you slapping..so the gear does save us..it may also cause you to test it more :D I'm not so confident in the statistics..the news crews aren't out looking for happy stories..and some of those people who come up with the statistics are damn maniacal little demons.
    #74
  15. markk53

    markk53 jack of all trades...

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    Most studies are done within a year or so and there's no statistical relevance. There has to be long term statistical analysis to eliminate process variation. That's why there really isn't any predictability from one year to the next with any accuracy, what will happen. Maybe the helmets do make a difference, maybe they don't... but a single year used as an example is far from realistic.

    By the way, did you ever see what happened to people in crashes before seat belts and air bags? Even a minimal crash that now wouldn't be any big deal, could result in severe facial or head injuries when the driver/passenger hit the steering wheel/dash board/windshield without any restraint. I guarantee there are far less disfiguring injuries over all since the implementation of seat belt laws, among those wearing seat belts versus before them (those not wearing belts after the laws aren't applicable statistics). And it seems most fatal high speed accidents have drivers/passengers without belts on... kind of leaves the no fear thing out in the cold.
    #75
  16. treysmagna

    treysmagna Bald is beautiful

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    I wont say that there is any down side to wearing protective gear, but I can say that with a full face helmet and a jacket with shoulder armor I have a hard time turning my head to look behind me when I change lanes. The chin bar of the helmet is always hitting the shoulder pads. I still wear it and just take more time making sure I am clear.
    #76
  17. kneeslider

    kneeslider Long timer

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    only a formal affairs, board meetings, weddings & trying to jump a honey from the toxic thread. oh at a textile free resort!! :lol3
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  18. Wuwei

    Wuwei Long timer

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    I think the point is that all the safety gear in the world won't prevent accidents, and there is some evidence that wearing gear may make you more prone to getting into accidents. The gear will help you survive the accident. Ride with the attitude that your every action is important and is your main defense against an accident, but don't think your gear will save you from your mistakes.
    #78
  19. PrtclMn001

    PrtclMn001 Custom User Title

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    Yeah: non-rain ready stuff gets REALLY heavy when it's soaked.

    Just sayin'...
    #79
  20. DirtyOldMan

    DirtyOldMan Long timer

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    It's kind of a nuisance when you have to pee real bad.
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