Dynojet explanation please!

Discussion in 'The Garage' started by leakypetcock, Apr 18, 2013.

  1. leakypetcock

    leakypetcock Adventurer

    Joined:
    Feb 19, 2005
    Oddometer:
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    So I recently bought a nice 1997 Triumph Trophy 3. It runs great, looks great and rides nice. The problem? The previous owner installed a set of "Oh my god what was that?" loud D&D pipes and a corresponding Dynojet kit. I ordered a set of stock pipes from Ebay to kill the dB level and pulled the carbs to lean it out to match. The factory jets (which he gave me) are 120 on the outside carbs and 125 on the center. The Dynojet install instructions call for 124's with aftermarket exhaust, 120's for stock exhaust and it also comes with a set of 116's in the kit. I put the 120's in but can't figure out why you would replace the factory jets with the same size and even smaller in the center carb to get more performance. The pipes haven't arrived yet so I haven't ridden the bike yet so I don't know how it's going to run. Should I go with the 120's? Install the 116's?
    The kit also has needles, emulsion tubes and calls for some auxiliary slide lift holes which have all been installed.
    Please someone explain what this kit is going to do for my bike!:ear
    #1
  2. ChromeSux

    ChromeSux Plated and screwed

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    DJ jets numbers are not the same as stock numbers, for instance, a DJ 120, may be the same as a stock 125.

    If you had two same number jets, 1 DJ, 1 stock, the DJ will have a slightly larger hole.
    Somewhere i saw a chart that had the DJ to stock conversion.
    #2
  3. anotherguy

    anotherguy Long timer

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    As far as jet numbers what he said. What the jet kit will do for the bike (if tuned correctly) is smooth out the fuel curve,improve response and providing the fuel delivery was insufficient (rare) up top increase power. Take your time and tune from the bottom to the top,i.e. pilot jet to main. DynoJet kits tend to rely heavily on the needle for low-mid delivery so in rare occasions to get it clean from bottom to top you'll need to increase pilot a size and drop the needle a click.

    Have fun. :D
    #3
  4. scapegoat

    scapegoat Pushin forward back

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    Check the needles for groves for wear or stepping. DJ kits are notoriously crappy DAHIK as opposed to the coated stock quality needles. The kits typically tell installers to drill the hole in the center of the slide larger,usually 1/8 in size. I had a 97 myself and cant recall different size jets in the center carb. The bike was hugely affected by air box mods also. You'll find 2 snorkles and only one open. The one thats open I put a Uni filter sock on as a pre filter because the stocker is a PITA to get at.
    #4
  5. Bronco638

    Bronco638 Nobody Home

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    You might want to send a PM to inmate 'motolab' and point him in the direction of this thread. Derek can help you decipher the DJ jet sizes and might be able to assist in getting you back to stock (or a properly running set up).
    #5
  6. wos

    wos Long timer

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    found this on another site, cant confirm the accuracy

    Keihin* Dynojet* Mikuni
    92 92 85
    95 94 87.5
    98 96 90
    100 98 92.5
    102 100 -
    105 102 95
    108 104 97.5
    110 106 100
    112 108 -
    115 110 102.5
    118 112 105
    120 114 107.5
    122 116 -
    125 118 110
    130 122 115
    132 124 -
    135 126 117.5
    138 128 120
    140 130 122.5
    142 132 -
    145 134 125
    148 136 127.5
    150 138 130
    152 140 -
    155 142 132.5
    158 144 135
    160 146 137.5
    162 148 -
    165 150 140
    168 152 142.5
    170 154 145
    172 156 -
    175 158 147.5
    178 160 150
    180 162 152.5
    182 164 -
    185 166 155
    188 168 157.5
    190 170 160
    192 172 -
    195 174 162.5
    198 176 165
    200 178 167.5
    202 180 -
    205 182 170
    208 184 172.5
    210 186 175
    212 188 -
    215 190 177.5
    218 192 180
    220 194 182.5
    222 196 -
    225 198 185
    228 200 187.5
    #6
  7. motolab

    motolab Long timer

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    PM recieved.

    Are you sure the main jets are not 125 on the outside and 120 in the center as original? In any case the sizes sound like the carbs are Mikuni BST36 rather than the later Keihin CVK36. Can you confirm?

    Regards,

    Derek
    #7
  8. leakypetcock

    leakypetcock Adventurer

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    Oddometer:
    583
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    South of Canada
    Yes, they are Mikuni's. You are probably correct in the outside/inside sizes. One of them is scratched on the surface and I can't read what it says.
    The bike ran great with the big 124's and obnoxious pipes but I want to quiet it down to a respectable sport-tourer and make it run right with the stock pipes. I fired it up after putting the 120's in and it seemed to have a crisp throttle but I haven't ridden it yet. This bike is so loud that I can't stand to ride it and I don't want to assault my neighbors with the noise.
    Hopefully the stock mufflers will be here today. My intention is to put them on, take it for a ride and see how the butt-dyno feels. If it's good then I'll put a few miles on it, check the valve clearances and sync the carbs.
    If not, let the tuning begin.
    #8
  9. Beezer

    Beezer Long timer

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    heres a better copy of WOS's chart.... can't guarantee the accuracy but I know for sure the jets are different


    <!--[if !mso]> <style> v\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);} o\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);} w\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);} .shape {behavior:url(#default#VML);} </style> <![endif]--> [FONT=&quot]Carb Jet Size Cross Reference:Keihin/DynoJet/Mikuni[/FONT][FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
    [FONT=&quot] <hr style="color:#DDDDDD" align="center" noshade="" size="1" width="100%"> [/FONT]​
    [FONT=&quot]Width------Keihin # -- DynoJets # -- Mikuni #
    0.0350---- 92.5--------- 92-----------86.3
    0.0360---- 95----------- 94-----------88.1
    0.0370---- 97.5--------- 96-----------90.0
    0.0380---- 100---------- 98-----------91.9
    0.0390---- 102.5------- 100---------- 93.8
    0.0400---- 105--------- 102---------- 95.6
    0.0410---- 107.5------- 104---------- 97.5
    0.0420---- 110--------- 106---------- 99.4
    0.0430---- 112.5------- 108--------- 101.3
    0.0440---- 115--------- 110--------- 103.1
    0.0450---- 117.5------- 112--------- 105.0
    0.0460---- 120--------- 114--------- 106.9
    0.0470---- 122.5------- 116--------- 108.8
    0.0480---- 125--------- 118--------- 110.6
    0.0490---- 127.5------- 120--------- 112.5
    0.0500---- 130--------- 122--------- 114.4
    0.0510---- 132.5------- 124--------- 116.3
    0.0520---- 135--------- 126--------- 118.1
    0.0530---- 137.5------- 128--------- 120.0
    0.0540---- 140--------- 130--------- 121.9
    0.0550---- 142.5------- 132--------- 123.8
    0.0560---- 145--------- 134--------- 125.6
    0.0570---- 147.5------- 136--------- 127.5
    0.0580---- 150--------- 138--------- 129.4
    0.0590---- 152.5------- 140--------- 131.3
    0.0600---- 155--------- 142--------- 133.1
    0.0610---- 157.5------- 144--------- 135.0
    0.0620---- 160--------- 146--------- 136.9
    0.0630---- 162.5------- 148--------- 138.8
    0.0640---- 165--------- 150--------- 140.6
    0.0650---- 167.5------- 152--------- 142.5
    0.0660---- 170--------- 154--------- 144.4
    0.0670---- 172.5------- 156--------- 146.3
    0.0680---- 175--------- 158--------- 148.1
    0.0690---- 177.5------- 160--------- 150.0
    0.0700---- 180--------- 162--------- 151.9
    0.0710---- 182.5------- 164--------- 153.8
    0.0720---- 185--------- 166--------- 155.6
    0.0730---- 187.5------- 168--------- 157.5
    0.0740---- 190--------- 170--------- 159.4
    0.0750---- 192.5------- 172--------- 161.3
    0.0760---- 195--------- 174--------- 163.1
    0.0770---- 197.5------- 176--------- 165.0
    0.0780---- 200--------- 178--------- 166.9
    0.0790---- 202.5------- 180--------- 168.8
    0.0800---- 205--------- 182--------- 170.6
    0.0810---- 207.5------- 184--------- 172.5
    0.0820---- 210--------- 186--------- 174.4
    0.0830---- 212.5------- 188--------- 176.3
    0.0840---- 215--------- 190--------- 178.1
    0.0850---- 217.5------- 192--------- 180.0
    0.0860---- 220--------- 194--------- 181.9
    0.0870---- 222.5------- 196--------- 183.7
    0.0880---- 225--------- 198--------- 185.6
    0.0890---- 227.5------- 200--------- 187.5 [/FONT]
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    #9
  10. motolab

    motolab Long timer

    Joined:
    Feb 16, 2006
    Oddometer:
    2,868
    How many miles are there on the carburetors?

    Regards,

    Derek
    #10
  11. leakypetcock

    leakypetcock Adventurer

    Joined:
    Feb 19, 2005
    Oddometer:
    583
    Location:
    South of Canada
    46,000 on the bike. Not sure how long the Dynojet has been in there. The carbs looked great when I pulled them off. Clean and clear.
    #11
  12. motolab

    motolab Long timer

    Joined:
    Feb 16, 2006
    Oddometer:
    2,868
    The first thing I would recommend is to inspect the slide guides & slides. At 46K miles, the slide guides are likely to be completely worn out. See http://www.moto-lab.com/gallery/view?itemid=262, http://www.moto-lab.com/gallery/view?itemid=295, http://www.moto-lab.com/gallery/view?itemid=263, http://www.moto-lab.com/gallery/view?itemid=296, http://www.moto-lab.com/gallery/view?itemid=264 and http://www.moto-lab.com/gallery/view?itemid=297. I recommend replacing the slides if the slide lift hoes have been drilled, and/or if there is vertical grooving on the downstream side.

    Regards,

    Derek
    #12
  13. leakypetcock

    leakypetcock Adventurer

    Joined:
    Feb 19, 2005
    Oddometer:
    583
    Location:
    South of Canada
    Thanks, hopefully it'll just run OK and I won't have to worry too much about that. Can you share a price on the parts?
    #13
  14. Triumphrider

    Triumphrider Live to Ride

    Joined:
    Feb 10, 2007
    Oddometer:
    6
    Location:
    Virginia is for Motorcycle Lovers!
    I have a 1995 Trophy 4 1200, a 95 Daytona Super 3, 95 Speed Triple and 1998 Tiger. I have a lot of experience with carb tuning. The first thing I would do if going to stock mufflers is get rid of the Dynojet kit, emulsion tubes, jets and needles, especially if you have all the stock items and don't plan to race your bike. Don't be concerned about the enlarged vacuum hole in the slides, they will not be an issue. The stock set up is pretty good with the exception of the primary jets being a tad too small (EPA lean). I used a number drill bit one size larger than what will go through the low speed jet by hand to enlarge the low speed jets by about .001". It will be a lot less cold natured on cold starts and run much better. Also set your air bleed screws 2.5 to 3 turns out. You can look up your model stock jet specs on BikeBandit.com web site OEM parts fiche to get a starting point. By the way, you can reduce the sound level of D&D cans by about 40% by installing nozzle restrictors made by Staintune for about $25.00 each.

    Cheers, Steve
    #14
  15. joexr

    joexr Banned

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    Jan 4, 2011
    Oddometer:
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    Jets R Us will have stock specs on your bike on their website and what jets are available. Again the drilled slides will be ok.I wouldn't drill your own jets if you've never done this or you'll end up buying new jets anyway. Even with stock pipes it'll still run better than stock with the jet kit setup for stock. I'd go this route , plus you've already got the parts and info. From the factory most bikes are too lean on the bottom so they meet emissions. Your jetkit is your freind , not the devil.
    #15
  16. motolab

    motolab Long timer

    Joined:
    Feb 16, 2006
    Oddometer:
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    They will absolutely be an issue, as BST carbs have chronic slide guide and therefore emulsion tube wear problems, which in turn cause overly rich mixtures toward the lower end of the rpm range. The larger the lift hole area, the more rapid the wear.
    I don't recommend drilling jets. They are cheap, so why not just install some that are the right size? That way you can be sure what size they really are and there will be no confusion caused by stamped on sizes not being valid.
    BST36 carbs do not have air bleed screws.
    But don't buy from them, as they don't have stock (meaning long delivery time) and their prices are very high.
    That is sound advice.

    Regards,

    Derek
    #16
  17. motolab

    motolab Long timer

    Joined:
    Feb 16, 2006
    Oddometer:
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    It's been well documented by myself and many others that they won't.
    True.
    I would generally not choose a DynoJet kit if there was an option. A drawback with kit needles is that they are in most cases made out of stainless steel, which accelerates emulsion tube wear. In this case, it's not necessary as the stock needles are already adjustable and have a reasonable shape.

    Regards,

    Derek
    #17
  18. joexr

    joexr Banned

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    The size of the vacuum holes has nothing to do with slide wear. And most jetkits are relabeled Dynojet kits anyway.
    #18
  19. motolab

    motolab Long timer

    Joined:
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    Consider that the slide rises at the beginning of every intake event, and falls at the end of every intake event (i.e. once every 720<!--[if gte mso 9]><xml> <w:WordDocument> <w:View>Normal</w:View> <w:Zoom>0</w:Zoom> <w:DoNotOptimizeForBrowser/> </w:WordDocument> </xml><![endif]-->°). If the lift hole area is increased, the slide's up and down excursion at every intake event will be greater (limited by the stops of course). Unfortunately, more slide travel at every intake event equals more wear.
    Factory Pro Jet kits are most certainly not relabeled DynoJet kits.


    Regards,

    Derek
    #19
  20. joexr

    joexr Banned

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    I thought maybe we were misunderstanding each other , but now I know we are not. The slides do NOT open and close with every intake stroke. :deal Wow!
    #20