EWS Immobilizer antenna threadfest

Discussion in 'GS Boxers' started by CarbonCat, Apr 8, 2006.

  1. xlcr

    xlcr Stop being a dick, dick.

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    So go nag them about the situation and then get back to us.

    Just be sure to warn them that you'll be using their and their employer's names.
  2. JimVonBaden

    JimVonBaden "Cool" Aid!

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    :rolleyes


    Jim :brow
  3. Wallowa

    Wallowa Long timer

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    First, I know Jim can handle himself..but I am the one who asked why dealers don't ask BMW for answers to problems that arise on our bikes...Dave may contribute valuable insights but this is not one of them. Or perhaps it really is one. He delivered his message and the substance of it seems like a kiss-off of his responsibility as a BMW dealer to his customers. He is not carrying anyone elses water, it was Dave's message. Dave at best is a willing accomplice by remaining silent and not contacting BMW but BMW is the silent power behind the curtain.

    Again that no "compelling reason" to ask BMW about a defect in our bikes?

    As Dave said beyond "Besides idle curiosity, or perhaps worry about my own EWS-equipped bike,..." he had no compelling reason to call BMW or ask the questions. Does this seemingly endless thread seem like inquries that are motivated by 'idle curiosity' and are made for 'no compelling reason'?

    A bike immobilized by a faulty ignition system is a defective ignition/anti-theft system and a very compelling issue. No splitting hairs about the meaning of "is" or what constitutes a defect; this is a defective product.

    I am not asking for an answer from BMW to a "vague question"; but rather very direct and succinct questions:

    #1 What is causing the "EWS" immobilization of our bikes?

    #2 How can we owners prevent this immobilization?

    #3 Why the different iterations [different part numbers] of antenna used to replace antenna on bikes immobilized with the "EWS"?

    #4 What changes have been made in the successive stream of replacement antenna?

    Why the hell are the dealers afraid of BMW? Why not ask the questions of BMW? As a dealer I would be embarassed to say I didn't want to "bother" BMW with such mundane, trivial questions as why are my customers getting stranded and how can I prevent it.

    Lastly, being dismissive of problems arising on our bikes destroys the credibility of the dealers and BMW. Getting the stonewall or non-response silence is not the fulfilling the contract we made with BMW and the dealer when we paid for our bikes; you know the one where they pledge excellence in customer support and service. We paid for a product and product support we are not getting; simpling ordering up another antenna after we get stuck somewhere with a dead bike is damage control not correcting a defect nor acting in the best interests of your customers.
  4. Poolside

    Poolside Syndicated

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    <BR>From a 1200GS Technical Training manual.

    Immobilizer code data structure.
    The codes used during the handshake are generated from an Immobilizer Rolling Code table assigned to the VIN at the time of manufacturing. The BMS-K and corresponding ignition keys are encoded with this unique data making them an electronically mated pair for one particular motorcycle. The code table provides the codes for each key and a source for BMS-K to check the generated code for each key. Of the three [transponder] keys supplied with a new motorcycle, each one is uniquely identified (key #, ie: 1, 2, or 3). Each key additionally then has a unique immobilizer code.

    During the key on sequence, the BMS-K first identifies the key sending the code data and then confirms the transmitted immobilizer code for that key. There is the possibility of a maximum of ten keys per system possible. However they must be ordered specifically by the VIN, and activated with the GT1.


    Comes with three keys. How many people received their three keys?

    Someone posted this a while back: Honda immobilizers, and I think Harley Davidson and Ducati too, can be manually switched off with some code combination of switch presses, of the turn signals or brake lever for instance. Each bike having a different code based on the VIN.

    Switching off the immobilizer manually with a code based on the vehicle VIN also complies with the DOT immobilizer regulations of passive arming.

    The factory race bikes run the EWS antenna part for PR, and part to avoid having to take the time to perform the manual switch off when the motor stalls during a race.


    - - - - - -


    Hay BMW, you know your Siemens ECU with immobilizer can be switched off manually. There is a process to do that in the ECU software, and you are not letting owners know about it.

    You will have that process changed in a future ECU software upgrade. Then you will tell us you just added the 'new feature'.

    I see you, you ain't hiding. I've always seen you.


    <BR>
  5. jpalamar

    jpalamar Long timer

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    Stopped by the Honda dealership to pick up a can of their spray cleaner/wax on the less than 700 mile (just completed 600 mile check) 2008 R1200RT about 2 months old. Yup, got the dreaded EWS.

    But, being prepared, I took out my spare antenna ring, #10 torx driver, removed the housing and unplugged the harness, plugging it into the spare. I've got it licked, at least I can ride home. Neatly tied it off as far from the original ring to minimize interference from original.

    [[​IMG]

    And, here's the bike (jinxed by Honda?) for all to see. But, luckily, no one knew what I was doing, and could care less.

    [​IMG]

    Go to start the bike: EWS failure with the spare ring that ends in 463. Woe is me. Call up a friend, load it on the trailer, away I go! Sadly, I have a long trip planned for late May/early June...what bike to take. So far, the '07 GT has no ring failure but it also has low mileage (1800). Maybe gonna go back to the LT for LD riding! Folks, this is now serious shit!!! when the spare also fails!!!
  6. SocalRob

    SocalRob Long timer

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    I've got to suspect that the second ring did not fail, that there is another problem. Not statistically likely the second ring failed. Have you tried other options like switching keys, disconnecting the battery, anything else?
  7. NBeener

    NBeener Long timer

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    John,

    REALLY fekking sorry, Man.

    This is the (phonetically) guy I spoke to at BMWNA:

    Marik Balwas
    201-263-8233

    Feel like calling him about now??

    I agree with SoCal Rob, and this is what I've been saying all along: we don't really have any reason to be certain that this failure IS an antenna ring failure. Now we have yet another reason to think maybe it isn't.

    Sorry again. Sucks big time:becca
  8. GB

    GB . Administrator

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    John,
    go out to your GS and unplug the stock EWS and plug in the spare antenna on it and see if it works or not.. and report back.. it it doesn't work, it should be covered under the parts warranty and they should just swap it for you.

    Your problem is you have too many new bikes with low mileages!! :lol3
  9. jpalamar

    jpalamar Long timer

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    I also thought that statistically this just could not happen. I immediately put the bike on the 'Tender' to ensure battery topped off. It was. When I was broken down, did all of the change 3 keys trick. Nope that didn't do it. Since this all took over an hour, the prescribed, 'wait 1/2 hour and it will likely start.'. Nope

    And yes Rick, I just swapped out the 2nd defective ring on the ADV and it failed on the Adventure also. Remember, this is a 463 discontinued ring. There's no doubt now it is the ring.
  10. Poolside

    Poolside Syndicated

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    <BR>
    See if the bike will start without the antenna, John. It might need a termination resistor in place of the antenna circuitry, but it's worth a shot.

    <BR>
  11. jpalamar

    jpalamar Long timer

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    BMW Daytona has sent another ring, I will have it tomorrow. Of course, no charge. I've been planning a 2week go out West ride with a bud and now just don't know which bike (with low mileage Rick) to take. Maybe have to get back on the LT that I had for a few years. :evil
  12. Wallowa

    Wallowa Long timer

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    John,

    As my old memory serves me the technique that might work is to plug in the spare "new" antenna, invert it over the old antenna-key way and then put your key in and try it..

    I also understand that once you start it the antenna is NA...and can be unplugged and stowed..

    Give it a shot...good luck!
  13. GB

    GB . Administrator

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    Maybe you can let me borrow one of your bikes this summer.. I'll fly down, pick it up, ride to Wyoming for the MOA rally and ride back, after I do a tour of Colorado and Arizona... I should have slapped on another 10,000 km.. for you.. :deal

    Sheesh, I'd better test my spare ring even though my bike has close to 20K miles..:(:
  14. Poolside

    Poolside Syndicated

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    <BR>Someone send me a DOA antenna. Now please.

    <BR>
  15. jpalamar

    jpalamar Long timer

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    Jim/Poolside, will try tomorrow to start without ring connected. Phil, the dealer wanted me to try what you suggested. Bike all cinched down in a covered trailer and can't get to it and don't feel like rolling it off tonight. When I get the new ring and install it tomorrow I will try that.

    Frankly, am a bit bummed out on the whole thing. It's easy to look at the issue from 10,000 feet, but when my bubble burst hooking up the spare and no joy, well, imagine being in BFE and all of this happened? Not good! Am disappointed in BMW.
  16. jpalamar

    jpalamar Long timer

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    I'll see if the dealer will let me keep the 463 disco'd model. If so, I will. Will let you know!
  17. jpalamar

    jpalamar Long timer

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    What I'm about to say makes no logical sense, but could a 'corrupted' ring caused by something else, also corrupt the spare ring. That is, the bad ring is the sympton not the cause?
  18. Poolside

    Poolside Syndicated

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    <BR>Thank you. :fingerscrossed

    <BR>
  19. jpalamar

    jpalamar Long timer

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    The dealer also suggest getting the new ring as far away from the old ring as possible/interaction. I don't think this is a BMW workaround, but trying all of the permutations/combos that one could think of. E.g. disconnect the battery, which implies a truly 'cold boot'. But if any of them worked once, I'm not convinced it was not coincidence and not a slam-dunk cure! Sorry to bring bad news...am seriously thinking of getting another pig barge as it's the only tourer in the inventory without CAN-bus.
  20. Poolside

    Poolside Syndicated

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    <BR>
    Was the transponder key used in the ignition switch, with an adjacent EWS antenna plugged into the ECU?

    You might try using a non-transponder key in the ignition, with the transponder key placed within the adjacent EWS antenna.

    (p.s.: Which model is the pig barge?)

    <BR>