F800 GS engine problems

Discussion in 'Parallel Universe' started by spqr, Oct 14, 2009.

  1. spqr

    spqr Been here awhile

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    The first storm of the season hit here yesterday, 9 inches in about 24 hours, which for central California is almost apocalyptic. As the rain poured down, so did the occasional hill side, onto the roads. When the wind picked up it blew down trees, into the power lines. I like to say that we have 360 days of good riding weather here and 5 days of great adventure riding weather. This kind of good blow seemed like an excellent test for the new F800 GS. :ricky They say this is the bike built to ride the world, any time, any place, any terrain or weather.
    With no power, no internet and limited heat it was time to displace down out of the mountains and impose my self on my better equipped relations. Layering up, the :sweeti GF in her car, me on the beast we set out. Blocked road and detours, made it an adventure, narrow twisty mountain lanes covered in wet pine needles and mini slides put a giant grin on my face.
    Then it happened. Down in the flat land, in 3rd gear and at 40mph the bike died, just stopped firing. It seemed like water in the air box. I grabbed the clutch and stabbed the start button. The bike restarted. I down shifted and kept her at higher RPM (around 4k) and carried on. Three more times, all at low rpm and low gear the bike died.

    So the question is: Why?

    I have a few possibilities.

    1. Poor design in the air box, water is getting into the cylinders.
    2. My bike was made on a Monday after a long weekend (this would explain why the license plate light fell off after 500 miles and had to be lock nutted back on)
    3. The 8 hours in the rain prior to running, when combined with the rain I was riding in wetted down the air filter and was restricting airflow.
    4. There is some strange unknown :baldy electrical or :baldy mechanical flaw that I have not thought of.

    I did go down to the mechanics and they plugged it into a GS 911 tool. No faults on the system. Thoughts? This bike should not have an issue with rain like this.
    #1
  2. DolphinJohn

    DolphinJohn Caveman

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    #2
  3. BMWHillbilly

    BMWHillbilly Been here awhile

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    Canister vent hose. It is the long hose that is hanging down in front of the rear tire. Reroute and cut the end at an angle or add a "T" to it. In heavy rain it tends to suck up water and clog/plug the charcoal canister. Lots of threads on the subject.
    #3
  4. spqr

    spqr Been here awhile

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    Thanks, and I will advise my local BMW mechanics of the issue. I hope they fix the issue on the '11 model
    #4
  5. BMWHillbilly

    BMWHillbilly Been here awhile

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    It's real easy to do. Save the $$ and do it yourself.
    #5
  6. Y E T I

    Y E T I Unpossible

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    It should still be under warranty and thus free to have it fixed. Plus, if he has any further trouble with stalling it's on BMW's dime.

    That said, I removed my canister.
    #6
  7. ba_

    ba_ Long timer

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    It supposedly is fixed on the '10...
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  8. JRWooden

    JRWooden Long timer

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    Anybody know HOW this is supposed to be fixed it in the 2010 model?
    I'd be surprised if a BMW dealership would remove your canister (esp. in CA) since it is a emissions related system...

    If you want to do more reading here is another thread ;-)

    http://f800riders.org/forum/showthread.php?t=25304
    #8
  9. ba_

    ba_ Long timer

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    This is what I was told when I asked my local dealer:

    "You mentioned your friend had a stalling issue, I spoke to my service mgr and that problem has been identified and the fix is easy…the vent hose is changed to a Y type…which prevents the vacuum and keeps the water out."
    #9
  10. The Griz

    The Griz Long timer

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    I've never had the stalling issue myself. However, now that I fully understand the fuel delivery system on this bike I truly believe it to be the canister drain hose routing. If it's routed wrong, it has the possibility of sucking up water and logging the charcoal filter material, therfore plugging the system. Re-route the hose, or do the t-mod that the others speak of.:thumb

    Removing the canister completely is pointless. But hey, that's the American way right? To do shit just because you can? No regard for the planet we inhabit and the generations of humans that are going to live on it after us? We now know without a shadow of a doubt that this issue is not caused by the canister itself, rather the hoses surrounding it. So why not leave it on and route the hoses correctly? The canister keeps noxious fuel fumes from entering the atmosphere. That's just my opinion......
    #10
  11. DolphinJohn

    DolphinJohn Caveman

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    Mr. Griz,

    1. Which is it?

    B. I removed my canister before it was discovered that it could be re-routed.

    III. Regarding the "American way" comment, remember we Americans are the only ones that even have the canister on our bikes.

    Maybe you should just ride a bicycle.










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    #11
  12. Y E T I

    Y E T I Unpossible

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    Totally disagree with you on this one Griz. Vapor lock comes to mind as one good reason.
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  13. The Griz

    The Griz Long timer

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    Exactly, and the reason for the "vapor lock" is due to the erronious routing of the canister drain tube, and the tube itself sucking up the water. Therefore, the problem is the drain tube, not the canister itself.
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  14. The Griz

    The Griz Long timer

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    LOL!:lol3 Speaking of the American way, it's a free country. I have a right to my opinion and to state it. As I said in my previous post: "That's just my opinion......" And it wasn't directed specifically at you or anyone, DJ.

    It is the canister drain hose, not the canister itself.

    P.S. Are you trying to move this into Head Explody?
    #14
  15. The Griz

    The Griz Long timer

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    spqr, I am confident that rerouting or t-modding your charcoal canister drain tube (#6 in the diagram) will solve your stalling issue.
    [​IMG]
    #15
  16. Y E T I

    Y E T I Unpossible

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    I agree that that's what has happened here.

    But that's not what I was talking about. (And in all fairness, I think I used "vapor lock" erroneously.)

    What I was referring to was when you dump the bike and it lays on its side allowing fuel to run from the tank into the canister. When that happens, the bike is either going to run very rich and thus poorly until the gas is burned out of the canister or, worse, it can cause the engine to lock and break. I know that's not a really good description of what happens, I just don't have the smarts to describe what happens properly.
    #16
  17. Bucko

    Bucko In a parallel world

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    Has that happened to you? I dumped mine on the right (canister) side last month and it sat there for at least 10 minutes until my buds missed me and backtracked (yes, I tried to pick it up, but it was at an awkward angle and I didn't feel like wrecking my back or unpacking it when I knew help was so close). Anyway, we righted it and it started and ran fine. I haven't made any changes to the canister or hose.
    #17
  18. Y E T I

    Y E T I Unpossible

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    Not on my 800 because I removed the canister about an hour after I picked up the bike.

    On my 1200 I had the lesser problem occur, i.e. ran like shit until the fuel burned off, after which I removed the canister. When I posted something on here about what happened, I was told by a few inmates that I was lucky the engine didn't lock.

    I don't know if there's a difference between the canister in the 800 and the 1200.

    I kept my canister and all the hoses and I can re-install it in about 20 minutes if need be.
    #18
  19. DolphinJohn

    DolphinJohn Caveman

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    Sorry Griz, I was hot and grumpy :lol3

    I believe there may also be an issue with fuel expansion in to the canister if you overfill the tank in hot weather.

    I think this may have been causing my bike to run rough and stall at start-up, before I had the rain incident and subsequently removed the canister.








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