Garmin Montana

Discussion in 'Mapping & Navigation' started by AugustFalcon, May 18, 2011.

  1. snooker

    snooker AttitudeIsEverything

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    So now that I've finally started to actually RIDE with my Montana... I have some basic map questions, (not routing or tracks for once :wink:).

    1. First issue, once I zoom out above a certain point... the road disappears. Even with Detail set to Most (which helps some). Seems like maybe 0.8 miles but in any event no way I can zoom out to, say 5 miles. Of course the more "minor" the road the sooner it disappears. How do you guys deal with this? All I can think of is to just give up seeing the road and simply watch your Track... but the Track obscures the road so you can't really see the road anymore. oh well.

    2. Topo usage and seeing your trail:
    Let's say I'm in a remote place like SE Utah on an offroad 2-track dirt road (trail). The trail does not appear on CNNANT so all you see is a bunch of white. period. Ok CNNANT is pretty worthless and I turn it off since the road DOES appear on Topo24k (only when zoomed in though :lol3).

    But then the problem is that the topo lines in Topo24k are way too much clutter and you can never see the trail. Even the Track is a bit hard to see with all the topo lines and elevation numbers in canyon country (and is worse when the Detail is set to Most).

    I've also read that people hate the Shaded Relief and turn it off and I can see why for the most part however I found this:

    But here is what I found that is cool. If you turn ON the Shaded Relief and then Enable Both CNNANT and Topo24k then you get the shaded relief but none of the Topo lines. It actually looks pretty good. You can't see the road now but you can always see your Track and overall it is decent effect.

    Can somebody explain what is going on here? It has to get the DEM data for shading from Topo24k but CNNANT takes priority so it doesn't show up the Topo24k contour lines and elevation numbers?

    I'm sure this has been covered but does anybody else do this or is there a better solution? I'll try to post a pic if that helps.
  2. Rocky TFS

    Rocky TFS Been here awhile

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    A. I don't have any autorouting 24K maps.
    B. I'm not likely to buy them.
    C. I WILL NEVER TRUST AN AUTOROUTING MAP IN THE BACKCOUNTRY!!!!:eek1

    I have a 25 year love/hate relationship with GPS technology from being a pilot, and have been to a few too many funerals of younger guys who trusted their GPS just a little too much.

    I want to vet any route or track I ever use in the boonies with a paper map if possible, or at least two different electronic topo maps. My backcountry may be quite different from yours! I can get so lost out here in the West that I could actually die from exposure. I do carry a PLB for just that eventuality, but using it means a full on Search and Rescue operation and I'd rather not face a $50,000 bill because of my own stupidity.

    If your penalty clause is not as severe as mine, by all means use the 24K autorouting capability in the manner you suggested. I would do it that way any time I was not concerned with survival.:freaky
  3. Rydah

    Rydah Remember the Night Rydah!

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    Well, the reason I prefer routes is because I like to ride aggresively, and don't want to have to constantly be watching the screen to make sure I'm on track (no pun intended). Lot's of the places I ride have multiple forks in the road, so it's easy to get off track. Being able to put a via point on the correct side of the fork gives me a "heads up" so I can adjust my approach speed/angle accordingly.

    All moot right now though. Had to send my brand new, never been used Montana 650 back to Garmin for repair. Computer suddenly could not find it as a connected drive. After spending three hours on the phone with four different reps, doing all kinds of gyrations (including turing over my screen to them), they concluded I had a bad unit. Even had to pay for the return shipping myself. Nice.
  4. BergDonk

    BergDonk Old Enough to Know Better

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    FWIW, after getting something together in BC I then 'ground truth' it in Google Earth for traps.
  5. snooker

    snooker AttitudeIsEverything

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    With all due respect I think your energy is off topic as to what my question is. I was only talking about trail plotting in BaseCamp. I was not suggesting you pull up to a trailhead, put in the destination 100 miles away and then blindly follow the dirt roads and trails that it autorouted for you using the Topo24k.

    What I was talking about was how to create either a Track vs. a Route... IN BASECAMP AT HOME BEFORE A TRIP. That's what I meant by "For OFFROAD trip planning...".

    The only advantage I was suggesting was to use the Topo24k in BaseCamp as it could autoroute if the trail showed in Topo24k (but not in CNNANT), then you save it as a Track. Your alternative is to just pick up to 250 points and use it in Direct mode on the Montana so it just shows straight lines between every 2 points. How is that safer to use than trying to autoroute at home, then taking your time to modify it and verify it via other means until you think you have a solid path, at which point you SAVE IT AS A TRACK and never use autorouting on the GPSr???

    Both ways have the same issues with vetting or verifying via paper maps, Google Earth, and best of all on land itself.

    To illustrate my question, here is a short 12 mile section in SE Utah on an upcoming trip. I started with a route with 3 points in it.

    The 3 examples show: 1) Direct Route, 2) Autorouted Route or 3) saving #2 as a Track.

    In 1 click it took 3 points and made a Track with 395 points in it because it had the data in the Topo24k mapset to do so. To me this is valuable.

    For myself I would rather follow #3, the Track. I would still have to "vet it" but after I have done so I'd rather follow it than #1. Expand this concept to creating an entire 120 mile section and rather than entering a bunch of points for Direct that only shows straight lines (over 700 foot sandstone cliffs or whatever) in a couple of clicks it can create an entire detailed Track. At least that is my question, but again this is all new to me...

    1) Direct Route:

    [​IMG]

    2) Autorouted Route:

    [​IMG]

    3) Track created from Route by clicking "Create Track" in the Route properties:

    [​IMG]

    I still have maps of Utah canyon country I bought back in 1983 when any maps of 4x4 roads at all were hard to find. I am new to GPS but not maps and I don't take it lightly.
  6. snooker

    snooker AttitudeIsEverything

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    Bump from 4 months ago HERE:

    There are 2 questions here:
    1. A couple people stated their tracks would completely disappear from being visible while they were using them. Was this a known issue? If so has it been resolved?

    2. so... is there a way to calculate the distance between points on a track? Or from your current location to the end of that track? That is, not just a direct line, but one that follows that path?
  7. ducnek

    ducnek Trying not to feel it too hard

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    I have a set of routes saved to the memory card in my Montana. They are shown on the memory card in BC.

    Once I unplug my Montana, and select "where to" on the unit, how do I pull up these routes on the Montana from the memory card?
  8. Emmbeedee

    Emmbeedee Procrastinators

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    Go to "Where To\Routes" or the Route Planner and look for them there. They are listed in order of proximity from your current location so you may need to scroll to find them, but it makes no difference if they are on the card or the gps - they end up in the usual locations.
  9. mcjetter

    mcjetter Adventurer

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    How long should the montana take to load up? I got a new one in january, put the us city road maps and about half of the US 100k map on it. But it takes about 20 minutes for the gps to start up now.
  10. Yossarian™

    Yossarian™ Deputy Cultural Attaché

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    I have never timed mine, but it's always less than 30 seconds from power on to usable.
  11. Rocky TFS

    Rocky TFS Been here awhile

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    You're right, it isn't!:D The key point is to "trust but verify":lol3

    What I have taken to doing recently is just to draw a track in BC on either the 100K topo or my individual state 24K topos, both non-routable. This is essentially identical to your method but takes a little extra time, but without the frustration of having the autorouting function picking the wrong route and fussing with it until it does route the way you want. This is a real problem in a place like Moab which has innumerable crossroads and dozens of possible choices.

    Maybe someday I will end up with 24K routable maps, but it won't change my basic approach, which would be identical to yours.

    I was a little vehement in my statement because I think there are folks out there who would do exactly what you said, i.e. pull up to a trailhead and set a destination 50 miles away and let the unit autoroute to it!
    :eek1
  12. Rocky TFS

    Rocky TFS Been here awhile

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    There is, but only in BC. Open the track properties window, the distance between consecutive track points is shown as leg distance. To see the track distance from either the beginning to some intermediate point or from there to the end, use Shift+Home or Shift+End and the header will change to show that distance, not the total. Also, the track color of that segment will change to a buff color. This is a very handy way to edit a track that you may have downloaded for which you only want to use part of.
  13. DRTBYK

    DRTBYK All Things GPS

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    It seems as though nobody has used Track Navigation - only showing the Track on the Map. The benefit of navigating (View On Map -> GO) a Track is that the Distance to Destination Data Field will show your remaining distance. You can also use Distance to Next if you place Waypoints along the Track (within 50meters). The only down side of Navigating a Track is if you have DEM (elevation) data in the mapset you are using. If there is DEM data and you Navigate a Track you will get Elevation Change markers which are the same as waypoints as far as the Nav Engine is concerned.

    Side note: you cannot use the "nuvi" Dashboard when Navigating a Track. You must use Data Fields in a Dashboard or use the Trip Computer.

    [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]

    Cheers,
  14. jconly

    jconly Been here awhile

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    Thanks for this, but it's still unclear to me.. Is this calculated distance a straight line distance to the end, or is it following the track?! Same goes for a route. Are these distances if you follow that path?
  15. DRTBYK

    DRTBYK All Things GPS

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    When Navigating a Track the "Distance" data is the actual Track path distance from your current location on the path - NOT line-of-sight distance. The same holds true for Route "Distance".

    This is why I don't navigate Direct Route's on the Montana since the "Dist to Dest" would be calculated from a path made up of long straight lines. I do convert any Routes I create in BC to Direct Route's before sending them to the Montana so that I can [potentially] edit them on the Montana. I of course do convert them to Along-road Routes before Navigating them. And yes, I always have a Track as backup:deal

    Cheers,
  16. jconly

    jconly Been here awhile

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    Thanks!
    Very useful.

    So, is it possible to do a Trackbac on the Montana, select a point ON the track, and then have the Montana essentially calculate the distance to that track point?
  17. DRTBYK

    DRTBYK All Things GPS

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    You asked two questions:
    1. Yes, the Montana does support "TracBack". This function allows you to backtrack from your current location along your Current Track.
    2. No, you do not have the option to "choose" a starting point and have the Montana "calculate" a distance along your current track.

    Cheers,
  18. Rocky TFS

    Rocky TFS Been here awhile

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    Fascinating.....now why didn't I think of that? I'm going to set up a tracking profile right away!!!:clap
  19. Yossarian™

    Yossarian™ Deputy Cultural Attaché

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    Went to update my Montana to 4.80 today, but when I plugged it in and opened up the Updater app, to my surprise, version 4.90 was what was available.
  20. DRTBYK

    DRTBYK All Things GPS

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    Just saw this update myself...I don't think I've ever seen a Garmin Dev Team respond that fast.


    Changes from version 4.80 to version 4.90:
    • Fixed issue with a data field in nuvi mode while navigating with the device in landscape orientation.
    • Fixed issue with overlapping text when reviewing certain geocaches.

    Cheers,