Garmin - Route (partly) outside included roads

Discussion in 'Mapping & Navigation' started by pingvin, Dec 20, 2012.

  1. pingvin

    pingvin Been here awhile

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    Sometimes the road/track continues even though not included in Garmin map. When I try to make waypoints outside the road it accepts it...but back-track and generate route to road with the closest distance to waypoint. And from this point to the new waypoint (easy to try, start with a couple of points on the road and then click a point outside road and see what happens).

    Not what I want, I would like it to make a straight line from last point on road to new waypoint. And from this point to next to simulate approximate route.

    Any way to force what I want to happen? Guess problem is it's a satnav intended to get people as quick as possible from A to B...on roads. Got a Zumo 550.
    #1
  2. wbbnm

    wbbnm Long timer

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    I am not sure exactly what platform you are using to create the route. I didn't understand the SatNav part.

    If you are creating the route in Mapsource or Basecamp, you can achieve your goal a couple of ways. If you get off a road in City Navigator, it does undesirable things.

    When I want to do this I switch from City Navigator to Topo 100. Topo 100 is a non-routable map set. It will let you put waypoints anywhere you want and it will draw straight lines between them.

    I understand you can select Direct Routing in either Mapsource or Basecamp or both and it does the same thing, but I have never tried this.

    And of course I have no idea if there is such a thing as Topo 100k for Norway.
    #2
  3. 9Dave

    9Dave Bazinga!

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    If you had a "classic" Garmin, like the 376, you can do what you want to do - until the route recalcs. Then it will go back to road routing.

    There are threads in here that cover that.

    Don't think your Zumo will do it.

    This is why foks use tracks, but your 550 won't handle tracks easily, either. You need a 66X Zumo for that.

    Someone else may know a work aorund, but I don't know of any.
    #3
  4. pingvin

    pingvin Been here awhile

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    Mapsource
    Problem is I want to be able to make a normal route where there are roads...then when roads stops, be able to keep clicking new waypoints with straight lines between them. So only topgraphic map won't work.
    OK, will look into it.
    Actually european Alps I'm planning for :)
    Yes...doesn't help much that your routes look find on PC if GPS recalculates and mess up :(
    OK. Need new satnav anyway after crashed this summer. But want garmin as all my routes are garmin. The zūmo 350LM looks nice, will it be as good as 66x regarding this?

    Maybe biggest problem is wanting satnav to do both routes and tracks at the same time, having the straight lines as a type of route. Might have to do some field testing when snow clears.
    #4
  5. Emoto

    Emoto Sure, why not?

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    No. The Zumo 350 does not handle tracks. You cannot create a track in MapSource or BaseCamp or get a track from a friend and then make it display on your screen. The 350 will let you "track back" over ground you have just covered, and will show that track and that track only on the screen, but that is not the same. I own a Zumo 350 and have tried all of this, and have asked Garmin to consider adding this capability in an update. If more people asked for it,l that could be good (hint hint :evil).

    I believe the 660 or 665 will do the trick, as will the Montana.

    All that being said, the Zumo 350 is a great unit for the road-going rider who doesn't care about tracks.
    #5
  6. pingvin

    pingvin Been here awhile

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    OK, starting to realize I don't know what I'm talking about. I'm thinking that a track is a route just outside roads. But found this thread http://www.advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=428626 and now realize tracks and routes are just 2 different things.

    So if I want to cross a mountain, I have to make a ROUTE to where road ends on gps map, stop, switch to TRACK and continue following point to point straight lines. Or really the road (that is there but just not included by Garmin) close to that line in my case. So not possible converting track part into route if no roads on map, right?

    (For information: In Norway and many other european countries, it's not allowed going outside roads at all, not even if tracks. In Norway general rule is, if you can't drive your familiy car there, no motorized vehicles allowed. Fines here is anything from $2.000 for violating this).
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  7. bemiiten

    bemiiten League of Adventures

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    This is precisely the reason that the x76 units coupled with Mapsource are still the standard when it comes to building and navigating routes. With tracks, the GPS lays down straight lines from point to point as opposed to following the road. Also with tracks, you loose the single most important piece of information, distance to next turn. Following tracks requires far to much attention. Lots of stopping and zooming in and out to see if your on the right road. If you like guesswork and u turns, use tracks. Routes on the other hand require just a quick glance down to get all the information you need. Mapsource allows you to combine established roads and unmaped areas all into one easy to follow route.
    #7
  8. DockingPilot

    DockingPilot Hooked Up and Hard Over

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    Obviously a man who knows the difference.
    Well said Be-Mittens. Screw the convience of sharing tracks. I'd rather labor through creating a route instead and having the ability to relax while riding and take in the scenery. Let the GPS do the work for me. When I look down and see "DISTANCE TO NEXT TURN 13.6 MILES", well fock, I can settle in the saddle and enjoy the ride as the unit counts down, not constantly worry or be concentrating on when I need to turn. Screw that. Not to mention ETA and other usefull info. Makes a mega 2,500 mile offroad trip way more enjoyable.

    I'd "adventure" with you anyday Be-Gloves....ehr, I mean Be-Mittens.
    :1drink
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  9. wbbnm

    wbbnm Long timer

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    If you want to navigate in area where a routable mapset does not have roads, you pretty much have to use tracks. But a really good way to create a track is first create a route and then convert the route into a track. And as I said in the previous post there are two ways of creating mixed-mode routes. First is switching between routable and nonroutable mapsets. And second is switching between Follow Road and Direct routing.

    You can create a track directly using the track draw tool in Mapsource. It is a little tedious but I have done it lots of times.

    There is a free 3rd party software package called Wingdb3 that will do all kinds of track/route conversions. I use that now. And Basecamp will convert routes to tracks.

    It is a matter of personal preference about whether to navigate with routes or tracks. I have had so many bad experiences with routes that I only use tracks now except for ad hoc changes. I use a lot of mixed-mode routes/ tracks and the GPS unit really gets upset when you go off a known road in a routeable mapset like City Navigator when you are using routes.
    #9
  10. DockingPilot

    DockingPilot Hooked Up and Hard Over

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    This is incorrect.
    Everyone of the below RR links I have done over thousands of miles, have all had, mapped and unmapped sections involved. All made with Mapsource and ran on our 276c/478 units without fail.
    #10
  11. DockingPilot

    DockingPilot Hooked Up and Hard Over

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    Lets say you are figureing a route here. You know this road goes through or it turns to trail but Mapsource does not depict it correctly, showing it does not go through but dead ends.

    Now in certain situations like when we rode the unmapped Trans Continental RR in Utah for a good number of miles, when plotting it I switch from Mapsource to Google Earth, following the original grade & waypointing the GE image, then I switch back to Mapsource and connect the waypoints in "Direct Routing" mode under "Edit/Preferences/Routing"
    The finished route is seemless.

    The trick is having a good GPS like the GPSMap 276c/376/478 series units that will not recalc your custom route after upload. A soccer van Zumo will destroy a route like this.
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    #11
  12. DRTBYK

    DRTBYK All Things GPS

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    :hmmmmm
    I don't seem to have any problems creating mixed-routes in Mac-BaseCamp and using them on my MONTANA.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    Cheers,
    #12
  13. DockingPilot

    DockingPilot Hooked Up and Hard Over

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    Hmm that's because your Montana isn't a Zumo Its more like a GPSMap series Almost. Lol


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    #13
  14. bemiiten

    bemiiten League of Adventures

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    You can do it on the Mac software, But not Windows. Can you re-open a route and edit without having Basecamp recalculate your route?
    #14
  15. DRTBYK

    DRTBYK All Things GPS

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    Yes, Mac-BC only. No problem editing in BC - just don't request a recalculation.

    Cheers,
    #15
  16. DRTBYK

    DRTBYK All Things GPS

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    On the zumo 66x units you can do your mixed route planning in Mac-BC and then convert the mixed route to a track. Import the track into the zumo as a custom route (not an Off-road Track).

    The zumo will convert the track to route faithful to the track - just keep Recalc=off. Use to do this all the time when I had the zumo.

    Cheers,
    #16
  17. pingvin

    pingvin Been here awhile

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    Ah..slowly starting to understand. Tried to make a test route with auto routing first. Then switch to "Direct Routing" , mark route and extend...and it worked making direct lines between points. Switched back to autorouting an extednd and it continued the route following roads but without messing up the point to point route. Brilliant, just what I've tried :D
    #17
  18. pingvin

    pingvin Been here awhile

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    I can't even find them on garmins web page, only zumos and montana?
    You say that you import TRACK as custom route...but can't you import my mixed route from mapsource (assume mixed route is a route, not track, just a combination of auto routed and direct routed???).

    Seems like the important thing is avoiding recalculation here. If mapspurce and Zumo 66x will do the job fairly well making mixed routes I'd be happy.
    #18
  19. DockingPilot

    DockingPilot Hooked Up and Hard Over

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    Ping, Discontinued model. The Montana is good and you can find used *76 series for sale. Dyrbke can tell you more about Montana as I dont know the unit yet myself.
    But basicly, yes, you can build an entire route like this. Bridging unmapped sections with mapped sections. Then the trick is to not have your GPS recalc it because it will not understand your direct routing sections and attempt to go around them messing it up.
    Having a route instead of a track will give you much more info while riding like eta, distance to next turn and so on. No big deal on a small day route, but big if your on a multi day huge route you want to give all your attention to your surroundings and not the GPS. A route makes the GPS do the navigation work while you just pilot the bike.
    Thats my take on it anyway
    #19
  20. pingvin

    pingvin Been here awhile

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    OK, thanks! Thought the Montana was more a hand held hiking GPS that could be used for motorcycle but on closer inspection maybe that is the better choice.
    #20