Geo-Thermal Pond Loop Problem?

Discussion in 'The Garage' started by kantuckid, Jan 29, 2014.

  1. kantuckid

    kantuckid Long timer

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    My Water Furnace brand of geo-thermal system has a loop in a pond ~250' below my home, with the pipes buried in a 3' deep trench to the pond. System was installed in 1998. While the system "works OK" , the pond loop pipes, a cloverleaf affair, have risen partially(as in slightly) above the surface. They were orginaly sunk in the pond & wires with concrete blocks were placed over them to hold them down. The original contractor is long gone. I called one HVAC guy & his answer was "do you want me to do it or you? No "so-called secrets were revealed" and I'm wanting to do it myself for certain.
    I may wait until it's above zero...:D
    I'm wondering:
    "how do I re-sink these pipes"?
    I've considered using sandbags(never found a source for the ones like the military uses,etc.) & could also use more concrete blocks with heavy romex tied on?

    I tried a google search & never saw a single solution! The comments are always lacking the detail of the actual means to sink the loop. I had the loop recharged a few years back & has performed OK since then.
    :ear Ideas?:ear
    #1
  2. Stan_R80/7

    Stan_R80/7 Beastly Gnarly

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    I would use cinder blocks tied to the pipe with copper (16-12 ga) wire having pvc insulation. I expect that would fix the 'floating' problem for your lifetime +. I figure, if it's good enough for the mafia...
    #2
  3. hpsVFR

    hpsVFR Hoosier Daddy

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    A couple of those giant zip-ties on each brick/block might be easier to get on there, and would likely be cheaper. UV resistance won't matter at the bottom of a pond, so you don't even have to spring for the really nice ones. Honestly, if you're using cheap block, I'd worry about it breaking up before either the romex or the zip-ties dissolved.

    But then, I've never done this before either.:deal
    #3
  4. troidus

    troidus Long timer

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    A quick poke around showed the loops being attached to a framework and then weighting the frame.
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  5. broncobowsher

    broncobowsher Long timer

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    Are the pipes made of anything special?
    Is it just a decorative pond or do you swim in it in the summer as well?
    Or is it a cattle pond where you would have to worry about wildlife?
    Is it fixed water level or does it go up and down with the seasons?
    #5
  6. CycleDoc59

    CycleDoc59 Wrench Rider

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  7. kantuckid

    kantuckid Long timer

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    It's a non cattle farm pond with fairly stable water level. No swimming & I only let children fish it under supervision so no casting at pipes area. The deer stay at edges. Pipes are hvy black plastic roll pipe. They were originally sunk using romex tied to blocks by the contractor in 1998. The cloverleaf shape of the pipes as originally rolled up is intact.
    Would be an ice skate project now-I'm planning for summer now:D
    #7
  8. kantuckid

    kantuckid Long timer

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    The second one is interesting -I need more time to read it all. thanks
    I do recall from having had 4 different contractors bid on the install that there was disagreement as to loop aspects. I called Water Furnace tech people in IN back then & was assured my existing pond was big enough & went forward with whats there. I have a trench like the first video but much farther from house and only one large cloverleaf loop- I'll guess it has ~150' of pipe in that loop plus the run from house to pond. I'm now thinking they did use large zip ties on blocks to sink the loop in the pond.
    #8
  9. kantuckid

    kantuckid Long timer

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    I've thought that 10ga romex inside black plastic pipe draped over the loop would work
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  10. troidus

    troidus Long timer

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    What about internal weighting? Is there anything you can put inside the loop tubing that will sink the tube without taking up too much volume?
    #10
  11. gsweave

    gsweave Yinz, blinkers are on, since 05

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    Don't see why you wouldn't just want to use poly rope, to tie blocks together
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  12. Motornoggin

    Motornoggin Two-Bit Throttle Bum

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    I would think the blocks would disintegrate after a while. Go to garage sales and buy old bar bells and cast iron weights. You can usually get them cheap and they would last hundreds of years submerged.
    #12
  13. FixerDave

    FixerDave KLR650 - XR200R

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    Well, I suspect your problem is that you're searching in the wrong place with the wrong search terms. I'd start by getting off Google and into the dark net, then start looking with search terms like 'Mafia', 'disposing of bodies', 'submerging in pond', 'stays down a long, long time'. Stuff like that. I'm sure you'll find all kinds of creative solutions from people that have a lot of experience keeping 'stuff' at the bottom of a pond. :evil People with a lot more at stake than some vanishing contractor... unless, that is, they had something to do with said vanishing :eek1

    Just make sure you don't offer anyone money to make stuff stay at the bottom of your pond. And, be very, very sure your wife does not decide to just up and disappear any time soon. That would make way too many people very interested in what you searched for and what's at the bottom of this pond, and you don't want that, right?



    Sorry,




    It's late,



    Couldn't resist... :rofl
    #13
  14. kantuckid

    kantuckid Long timer

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    This guy's reading too many murder mysteries?:D Ala where is Jimmie Hoffa...

    "my contractor" vanished cause he got old and died naturally.
    I don't see poly ropes lasting long-the barbell theory could be "twerked to work" in some fashion like maybe cast some concrete on the ends of a steel T fence post stuck through some plastic pipe then placed on top via a brief double canoe trip into the pond?
    #14
  15. kantuckid

    kantuckid Long timer

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    I never have dived down there to see if they fell apart or the ties that held them broke apart... a mystery for the ages :huh huh?:huh
    #15
  16. jeiff

    jeiff Been here awhile

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    Normally, standard concrete block will withstand immersion just fine. The trouble would start only if the block is saturated, then frozen.
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  17. St_rydr

    St_rydr Strider

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    #17
  18. Stan_R80/7

    Stan_R80/7 Beastly Gnarly

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    I would expect that if the blocks disintegrated (which is unlikely unless allowed to freeze) then the ties are on the pipes. A jon boat trip to the assembly in the early spring would answer that question. Personally, I would be curious enough to try and fish out a few of the anchors to see what went wrong.

    If nylon ties were used, then the mystery is solved. Good luck!
    #18
  19. kantuckid

    kantuckid Long timer

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    FWIW, I built a cistern out of block in 1980 & stuccoed the inside. It had spring water flowing in at one end continuosly 24/7 for all the years until i got "city water"(UGH) in ~2008. The blocks were still solid when I collapsed it with a backhoe. Except the water level blocks that had eroded from slight wave action, I suppose? I do wish I'd have had the $$$ to have poured it as the blocks at that level were hard to keep sealed as time they wore out & leaked at joints too. The lower blocks were all solid. There could have been some freezing above ground but not likely where water stayed against them as spring water is ground temperature.

    I'll take a bigger look at the "slimjim" thingy,thanks.
    #19
  20. BossMaverick

    BossMaverick Been here awhile

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    What about getting some 3" or 4" diameter sections of PVC pipe, filling them with concrete, and then tying the PVC sections inline with the geo-thermo pipes with stainless or copper wire (or romex)? It would be more durable and snag-less than cinder blocks, yet it would still be a cost effective solution. I suppose you could also pour sand in the PVC pipe sections and cap them, and not have to worry about messing with concrete.

    I personal hate cinder blocks under water, but that is just me.
    #20