got GPSMAP 276 (can i sell the ZUMO CityNav NT and nuMaps lifetime DVD's)?

Discussion in 'Mapping & Navigation' started by hotwheels22, Dec 25, 2017.

  1. abruzzi

    abruzzi Long timer

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    As mentioned your welcome to ask Garmin to transfer maps and updates to the 496, but it’s highly unlikely that they will agree. Maps and updates are tied to device and non-transferable. That has been the case for the last 14 years or so.

    I’ve had the same problems with connecting to a Mac, and I haven’t got it sorted. The GPS pops up a message saying the USB is connected, but the Mac doesn’t see it. I’m using a old XP laptop, but I’d much rather use my Mac. I’m not sure the issue is hardware or software, so if you can boot your Mac to Win7 using Boot Camp, I’d try it. I tried windows inside a VMware vm and it didn’t work, but that doesn’t have direct control of the hardware so a dual boot may have better luck. I’ve never used express or lifetime updates, but I’m guessing that that will be a requirement if you want to buy lifetime updates for the 496.

    As for whether you are better with the Zumo or 496? The 276-496 series were, for years, the most desirable Garmins for lots of reasons. They are great GPSs with some awesome capabilities. For that reason Garmin kept selling them even after they obsolete in terms of hardware and compatibility. Realistically making them fully work with modern PCs and Macs is less than ideal. The memory card is strange and archaic with limited storage capacity. Even if you get a reader for the Garmin Data Card, it doesn’t behave like an SD card where you can just copy files. You have to use Garmin applications to load data to the cards.

    All of these things mean that if you want the level of PC integration with the 496 that you get with new GPSs you need to be prepared to jump through some hoops to make it work. If you do that, you get one of the best GPSs made. On the other hand if you don’t want to deal with old tech and you want something that requires a lot less manual futzing and is more or less turn key, then a more current model may be a better idea.
    #21
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  2. hotwheels22

    hotwheels22 motorradRP

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    OK. i am going to start studying those links. some info below and some more questions if i can.

    Q1. what maps do i use and where do i go if i can't use or don't want to use garmin maps? also, how do i LOAD them to the unit? through Garmin Express or through MapInstall?

    i was able to get the 496 to be recognized by windows 7 (under boot camp) run on a 2012 mac pro using USB 2.0. images are below. for instance i was able to run a software update to the unit. in the coming days i will try on the mac air which uses USB 3.0.

    garmin has informed me that i can download US TOPOS and some other regional topos for this unit (images below) but that they do not have any other data that i can load to this unit. this means i have North America v8 which i guess is circa 2006?

    also, supposedly the hard drive has 64 MB or space and the garmin stick has 512 MB. i am sort of having a hard time imaging going cross country with it.


    Q2. i guess i would PRE-LOAD data to the 512 MB garmin data cards and plug them in as i move from place to place?

    Q3. i bought this unit very cheap and i have some accessories with it (XM satellite and multiples of a lot of stuff) so i am sure i could get some money for it if i sold it. everything works great. i'd love to use it for aviation someday if i was ever able to take some flying lessons (sort of a bucket list item).

    Q4. that said, would i be looking at a 276c if i bought new or used for a more recent machine? what does this get me? the ability to work on a mac with 3.0? the ability to simply load THIRD PARTY maps directly to the unit in a no hassle way?

    if i did sell this unit i would obviously lose the aviation stuff which is sort of cool but it might not be bad to have a unit that did one thing for the bike or the truck.

    Q5. i got some error that said the software could not transfer "waypoints, routes or tracks" and that "either the device does not support the items or basecamp needs to be upgraded".it is shown in image 4. is this an issue?!

    any and all help is appreciated..!

    jon

    other info:

    i did not understand that the /data/ that you get through garmin is tied to the device. so for anyone following along that was key to my starting to understand what is going on. in this case, both the CD's (north america NT and the nuMaps lifetime subscription were activated for the zumo). so they will travel with the unit. i think i actually activated the nuMaps so there is some question as to whether i could have transferred it to a new unit if i hadn't activated it.


    1 IMG_5327.JPG 2 IMG_6419.JPG 3 IMG_9848.JPG 4 IMG_7598.JPG
    #22
  3. abruzzi

    abruzzi Long timer

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    As I mentioned, I've never used Express. My MO was always to buy the DVD, install it to my mac (or PC) then use mapInstall to install the different map segments to the device ot to a memory card. The benefit this has is that if you have a device with limited storage, you don't have to install everything. For my 276C one 512mb card can hold pretty much the entire western half of the continental US with the CityNav version that came with it. (I'm sure more current CityNav maps are less space efficient.) I also have a second 512mb card that I installed Topo 2008 for NM, CO, UT, NV, AZ and bits of TX, CA, ID, and WY. Garmin doesn't seem to sell in DVD format any more, so you have to go through Express. I'm not sure how express works to install, and whether you can do smaller portions.

    If you want to skip garmin entirely, you can get OpenStreetMap data for routable road data. My experience with these are:
    - roads and routing is pretty darn good, though not perfect.
    - waypoints (gas stations, restaurants, hotels, etc.) are very spotty.
    - they are space hogs if your limited to 512mb cards. 512mb barely holds NM, CO, UT, and AZ. This is probably because there is a lot of unnecessary data like building outlines and such.

    If you want to try it, go here:

    http://garmin.openstreetmap.nl

    Select "generic routable" or "generic routable (new style)", check the box for manual tile selection. Then use the map to select map tiles you want to be part of the map. As you select tile, you'll see a size on the side of the page. The max you can do is 4gb, but that will do most of the continental US. Enter your email and click submit. It will send you an email and start building your map. When its done you will send you a second email with a link to download.

    Since the 496 has the entire CityNav installed on internal storage, it clearly has more than that. I'm not sure if it can be erased to reclaim that space for a new map though.

    As I mentiond above, a 512mb can hold a decent amount, but if you need more maps then yeas that is one option. The other option that I hinted to above is it may be possible to erase the existing CityNav and load anew copy.

    If you do decide to sell it, give me a PM. if I'm not broke, I might be interested. I'd like a backup, and one that, unlike the 276C has onboard space for maps would be useful for me.

    The modern incarnation is the 276CX. Its completely different hardware, higher res screen, modern design. It looks very nice, but I've never used one. Some people here have had some issues, so make sure you read up on it.

    Aviation has gone a different direction with Garmin. They have large dedicated aviation devices. Also a lot of pilots are using iPads as chart books.

    I've never gotten that on my 276C. Did you have the data card in when the error occured? The 496 is newer so I'm sure it supports it, it might just be finding the right way to set it up.
    #23
  4. Emmbeedee

    Emmbeedee Procrastinators

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    Have you actually tried a 276C? I'd hate to have to go back to using something that primitive, having used modern units. They've come a long way.

    I don't think you should be making plans to sell your Zumo before you're sure you made the right decision.
    #24
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  5. hotwheels22

    hotwheels22 motorradRP

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    yeah. sold the zumo. now have to figure out how to get maps to the 476.

    downloaded an openstreetmap per @abruzzi ’s help but now i have to figure out where to go to get it to the device.

    sort of got sidetracked on this.

    on the zumo i just couldn’t deal with the screen interface. hoping working with the 476 will “take”.
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  6. Emmbeedee

    Emmbeedee Procrastinators

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    Well it'll fit right in on a '93 R100GS, better than a Zumo would.
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  7. abruzzi

    abruzzi Long timer

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    Perhaps I’m a bit odd, but when I got my 276C a couple months ago, it instantly felt exactly how a GPS should work. All the newer ones that I had owned like various Nuvis, 2720s, or Colorados felt like it was overlaying an interface that less straightforward than the 276. (I did mostly like the interface on the 2610, but it was hampered by a crappy screen, and an annoying touch interface.) I think the 276's main drawback is that it is saddled with ancient tech that requires working around. At some point I’d like to see how much of the interface the 276CX retained, but I’m already planning to find a spare 276/376/478 to keep this functional for a long time. As I mentioned in an earlier post, I don’t reccomend it to everyone because their uses may be significantly different, or they may not want to deal with the old tech hurdles.
    #27
  8. abruzzi

    abruzzi Long timer

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    The short answer is install the maps on you windows machines (Mac dual booting to windows, right?). Plug in the GPS. Run “map install”. Select the map segments you want to install. And off you go. The couple things I don’t know because mine is a 276, not a 4xx:

    - since you have internal storage (the 276 doesn’t), I don’t know if you can install OSM to internal without affecting the built in maps. I also don’t know how much, if any unused internal storage the device has.
    - if you install a data card in the 496 then USB the GPS to your computer, does mapinstall recognize both internal storage and the card, and let you choose where to install? That’s the way the later devices work, and if you’re still experimenting with OSM, it makes sense to load them to a card so you don’t effect the internal memory.
    #28
  9. hotwheels22

    hotwheels22 motorradRP

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    thanks man. i get my head into this stuff and do ok, then i go do something else and i can't remember how to get my head back into this stuff for some reason.

    i will check on the recognition of the various drives. do you know if there is a specific place i should see this in MAP INSTALL? i should see it in the left pane or in a pulldown or something i guess?

    am i correct in thinking that the MAPS that are installed on the 476 are also on my account with garmin after having registered the machine? i mean, i think if i log into my account i will see the map listed.

    also, i think after talking to the guy at garmin that he was saying there were NO map updates that i could buy and put on the device? i mean, the list for garmin maps i could purchase were all topos for only a certain number of areas (US, canada and a couple of central american countries i think). so basically i can only update the TOPOS.

    this sort of threw me a bit but i am thinking i basically have /very/ old road maps and can only really get current maps by going to openstreetmaps. i mean, am i thinking correctly in that i may as well experiment with getting open streetmaps on this device and then load up the original maps at some point later?

    ACTUALLY, now that i think about it i am not sure how a pilot would use this device if they can't update the street maps through garmin anyway though. don't pilots want the most current street map on their device in addition to whatever other data they need?

    THANKS
    #29
  10. ohgood

    ohgood Just givver tha berries !!!

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    streets change a lot more often than runways. I bet an old set of charts , or nothing at all, would work fine.
    Screenshot_2018-01-04-05-51-12.png
    #30
  11. Emmbeedee

    Emmbeedee Procrastinators

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    I bought a 276C a couple of years ago just to see for myself what people like about it. It's an interesting unit but it could never replace my Montana for me. Too slow, lousy antenna, tiny and expensive storage system.

    So the 276 sits in my bottom drawer with the Monterra I never use...
    #31
  12. abruzzi

    abruzzi Long timer

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    The antena is kind of annoying. Fortunately the brackets I have provide support for the antenna. I do appreciate that under the antenna is a standard BNC connector (which I already have all the tools for crimping) vs the tiny SMA or MCX connectors that they provide on other GPSs. Not really a thing on bikes though.

    The memory is annoying, but since I can fit half of CNNA (well, the western half) on a 512mb card, once I load up the maps, I'll never touch it again. (I have never found the updated maps necessary. I ride in areas where things don't change often, and when they do, a quick glance at the road tells me where I need to go.)
    #32
  13. JR356

    JR356 Long timer

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    Recent post in the FM for someone looking to trade for a Monterra.
    http://advrider.com/index.php?threads/my-garmin-oregon-650t-plus-cash-for-monterra.1275191/

    JR356
    #33
  14. Emmbeedee

    Emmbeedee Procrastinators

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    #34
  15. ohgood

    ohgood Just givver tha berries !!!

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    have you tried a usb-otg cable yet ? I know the 47* and 27* units are ancient, but it's worth a shot to try and see if they're capable of mass storage mode.
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  16. abruzzi

    abruzzi Long timer

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    I have several of the USB to garmin data card readers, and they definitely do not do mass storage mode. The only way to load the cards is with garmin software like mapsource, basecamp (for routes, tracks, and waypoints), or mapinstall. What I'm not sure of is the internal memory on the 4xx series. Mine is a 276C and it has no internal storage for maps, but the 478 and the 496 both do, and I don't know how that extra memory appears if the 4xx us USB'd to a PC.
    #36