GPS for Android - is there an app to rule them all?

Discussion in 'Mapping & Navigation' started by dartmouth01, Apr 27, 2017.

  1. lalispeed

    lalispeed Right handle addict...

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    I used rever to plan my trip around Cali and Oregon its easy to use and , they show you motorcycle , twisties, dirt, etc by colors its a great concept, bit when you try to use it it crash a lot and its super hard to read on the bike... .It needs lots of improvements. Cust support its always not very responsive also.

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    #61
  2. Albie

    Albie Kool Aid poisoner

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    Well, I was getting the 20S for a $100, unfortunately it didn't work. I really don't care about getting a mesh network comm unit. I just use them for listening to music, and GPS voice prompts. Last thing I want is to connect more than 1 or 2 more riders. Any more than that and you'll never get a moments peace. :lol2
    #62
  3. Queen of Spades

    Queen of Spades tall drink of water

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    Interested in Kurviger so I bought the pro version to test out. Meanwhile I went to the Kurviger website to try out route planning on a route I traveled last week.

    Setting the start and finish pins was easy, though the calculated route didn't make sense. The route I took used USFS roads in more or less a direct path from start to end. The site generated this route, which goes way off the USFS roads:

    https://kurviger.de/en?point=34.56897,-84.136562&point=34.708228,-84.220505&locale=en&vehicle=motorcycle&weighting=curvature&additional_weighting=&elevation=true&avoid_main_roads=true&avoid_motorways=true&avoid_toll_roads=true&avoid_ferries=true&layer=Omniscale

    Screenshot at 2017-07-10 09:26:48.png

    Here is the route I took (I did not use GPS last week - reproduced here in google to show the difference)
    Screenshot at 2017-07-10 09:37:48.png


    Does Kurviger recognize USFS roads? If so how can we tell the route planner on your site to use them?
    #63
  4. Dolly Sod

    Dolly Sod I want to do right, but not right now

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    Kurviger doesnt do direct paths, that's the point.
    #64
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  5. Albie

    Albie Kool Aid poisoner

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    +1 it's for riders that want an entertaining route with a lot of curvy roads thrown in.


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    #65
  6. Queen of Spades

    Queen of Spades tall drink of water

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    Got it, though I really like the easy way of creating routes on the Kurviger site then importing with QR code.
    #66
  7. kurviger

    kurviger Bloke from Kurviger.de

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    Thanks for the detailed feedback. Right now the issues of not taking the "direct" road through the forest is that parts of it are marked as not easily doable with a regular street motorcycle. Right now we try to calculate routes that are doable without needing a offroad bike. I am not saying that this is the case for this route, it's just the OSM tagging :). If you look closely at the map, there is a road, but it's very small, this means that OSM considers this more a foot or bicycle road than an actual road to be used by motorcycles or cars. Nevertheless we are looking into improving the current situation, so thanks a lot for the feedback. If you find any other "unexpected" routing results, please let us know. I haven't done any motorcycle riding in the US so far, so it's not easy to judge how good our routes are compared to where the locals are riding.

    I know from my own experience that it's reasonably good in central Europe and south-east Australia.

    Best,
    Robin
    #67
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  8. Queen of Spades

    Queen of Spades tall drink of water

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    Thanks for the response. Can confirm that the USFS roads I traveled last week (shown on the google maps screenshot) are gravel and accessible by car. Even saw a Honda Pilot up there!
    #68
  9. Queen of Spades

    Queen of Spades tall drink of water

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    #69
  10. DaMonk45

    DaMonk45 I B Da Monk

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    have you checked the OSM maps to see how they are tagged?
    #70
  11. kurviger

    kurviger Bloke from Kurviger.de

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    Thanks a lot, I will have a more detailed look and will try to improve the situation in the long term. Unfortunately there is no fast fix available :).

    One part that creates routing issues is for example this part here. It is specified as tracktype=3, which usually means dirt road and ofttimes not fun to ride with a street motorcycle, especially if the surface is a humid ;). If tracktype=3 is not correct, we should raise an error in OSM, or you could change it to tracktype=2. Google Maps uses this road, however they don't use the OSM data. They probably got a different tagging at this point.

    Best,
    Robin
    #71
  12. DaMonk45

    DaMonk45 I B Da Monk

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    @Queen of Spades
    @kurviger
    I see the issue here now. In osm this is listed as a track, osm will not route though a track.
    From what I learned a couple of months ago from @Myway if this is indeed a road of some type
    the tag should be changed to unclassified. This will allow osm and other programs to route through this road.
    Problem is would you want your grandmother in her Prios driving down it?
    There seems to be a LOT of roads here in the US that are tagged wrong.
    So is this a track or a unclassified road?

    Myway has a very good thread on this here:
    http://advrider.com/index.php?threads/osm-openstreetmap-tagging-adv-tracks-roads.668937/
    #72
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  13. ohgood

    ohgood Just givver tha berries !!!

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    just to prevent any good info from happening, I noticed that route rides all around Big John Dick and Little John Dick mountains.

    I just used the map quest plugin. but it's still funny to me.

    Attached Files:

    #73
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  14. Myway

    Myway Long timer

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    A routing program must understand OSM tags.
    https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:highway

    Road as unclassified is set by importance.
    This tells nothing about how the roads looks like.
    If your grandmother in her Prios can ride it?
    It depends on the surface and the smoothness.
    If it is a track by importance and it is track_type=grade1 your grandmother can ride it
    https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:tracktype
    images is only a indication.

    I was tagging in Bolivia from one town to the other, a road higher in importance than unclassified.
    But it was a surface=dirt road then here Prios can not do it. On some parts with some fords in it.
    People have there 4x4 or small trucks ;-) This is for a reason.
    https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:surface

    Then there is a key smoothness
    https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:smoothness
    Set by the osm tagger. It is always a personal choice.
    A man who is a walker tags different than a man who is cyclist, mostly they do not understand the importance of tags for other transportation mode.
    Like a tag as motor_vehicle, this also means mofa and moped.
    They translate a traffic_sign description by law terms to osm. The same term in OSM could mean slightly different. You must always look how it match.

    The more unpaved the more the weather (rains) have a role if it is ride able.
    You can have a unclassified, unpaved road that look bad. Not as the https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/File:Highway_unclassified-photo.jpg shown in the wiki.

    All these a routing program must take this in consideration, if they route you over it.
    For now mostly one choice car, bicycle, walking. not what kind of.
    Motorcycle, take mostly car routing, not much adv routing.

    Then there are obstacles in the road, like fords and gates, all kind of barriers.
    Gates are set by default to foot=yes, so every gate must be set to open for motorcycle=yes or permissive or.....https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:access
    Fords if a Prios can do that, depends on rainy season and how the surface is in the lake, concrete, dirt, grass_paver, etc.

    There is a lot to tag for good routing.
    This asked more insight, it is a learning curve.
    #74
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  15. chrisjk

    chrisjk Been here awhile

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    Reading about this tagging stuff underlines for me, the impressive effort made by so many people - volunteers- to create the maps I now rely on.
    #75
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  16. DaMonk45

    DaMonk45 I B Da Monk

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    When I got started with Osmand and then used Locus as well, I heard about the opensource maps, and the project. But it back then it never really dawned on me how complex this stuff is.
    Back then I was adding address and businesses and such, I updated the roads in my neighborhood. All of that was simple and easy.
    The last few months I have updated roads and bridges. Moved roads.
    That is when you find out how comlex this is and how well organized they are.
    They are not perfect by any means and there are STILL a ton of questions out there to e asked, and answered.
    Overall they have a worthy goal and a goal I think we can accehive if we all do a lil bit of it.

    Just my thoughts.
    #76
  17. kurviger

    kurviger Bloke from Kurviger.de

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    Hi Guys,

    just wanted to give you a brief update on the Kurviger App progress. We added the possibility to import routes while being offline. So if you planned a route you can start riding it, no matter where you are or if you got internet reception.

    You can try this in the Kurviger Pro App.

    Cheers,
    Robin
    #77
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  18. webmonstro

    webmonstro A Aventura Continua....

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    Sorry if this has been answered before . Can you use offline maps ? OSM ?
    #78
  19. kurviger

    kurviger Bloke from Kurviger.de

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    No worries :). You can, we provide offline maps based on OSM data for essentially every country in the world. You can also use the maps provided by OpenAndroMaps, we both use the same format.

    However, this does not include offline route planning, for calculating the actual route you need internet. With our latest update, you can load a previously planned route without needing internet.

    Cheers,
    Robin
    #79
  20. Tenacious B

    Tenacious B inward singer

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    Hi Robin,

    I've been trying out the Pro version of the app and have a few comments for you. Some of them may just be me not using it correctly, but some may drive useful improvements.

    1. When searching for a city as a destination, it is displayed as

    City Name
    Type of City
    Country

    so you get things like

    Anywheretown
    Hamlet
    Unites States

    We have a lot of repetitive city names here in the US, so I've gotten a few interesting routes! Would there be a way for it to display cities in the US in the standard US way?

    City Name
    State Zipcode

    Even just city name and state would help since most of the repetitive city names are in different states.

    2. I haven't had any luck selecting a destination/waypoint by entering a street address. User error?

    3. There doesn't seem to be a way to route with just the app, the route has to be made on the website first. User error again?

    4. When using voice navigation, it would be nice if the voice also said the street name you are looking for. Rather than "In 500m turn right" it would be "in 500m turn right on Main Street". Some people may prefer if there was an option for the voice to use english units, but metric doesn't bother me personally.

    5. I haven't tried a long trip with it yet, but will the app automatically pick up where you left off the day before, or do you have to reload the route? This would apply any time you leave the app in order to use your phone for something else. If I understand correctly, if you have to reload it then you need to save the route file to your phone rather than just use the QR code. This also makes me consider whether it is smarter to make one big route, or split it up into smaller routes (probably by day).

    6. Sometimes the route will take a weird detour off of the road you are on for a short part just to get back on it a block or 2 later, presumably because the algorithm calculated extra twistiness by taking an unnecessary exit. I've had several instances where those detours are really bad ideas, usually around highway intersections where roads merge and have exits/entrances, and loops. Is there a good way around that, like an option to take the fewest roads between 2 points, or don't exit a road if the route plans to get back on it again?

    Thanks!
    -TB
    #80