Helicoil or TimeCert for valve covers?

Discussion in 'GS Boxers' started by pcwirepro, Nov 23, 2012.

  1. pcwirepro

    pcwirepro Aspiring Adventurer

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    I need to do five of these things and wasn't sure if one was better than the other. It looks like the helicoil is actually a coil of steel whereas the timecert is an actual threaded barrel of sorts. ~$25 for the helicoil vs ~$60 for the timecert.
    Any insight would much appreciated.
    #1
  2. sno-where

    sno-where Adventurer

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    Timecerts are better then Helicoil, but for a bolt that does not have to hold a lot of torque, you are probably just fine with the Helicoils. Anything that needs to hold more torque, I would rather trust a Timecert.<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:eek:ffice:eek:ffice" /><o:p></o:p>
    #2
  3. hillbillypolack

    hillbillypolack Grumpy Old Goat

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    I have Helicoils in one of the caliper mounts on my truck. It's low (ish) torque, at 28 ft / lbs. but has held well.

    No experience with TimeSerts or the respective torque they will handle.
    #3
  4. BluByU

    BluByU Been here awhile

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    I had to repair about 7 holes when i first got my old 1100GS (previous owner was a HACK.)

    I used Heli-coils as that was what I had in the tool box at the time, never had a problem, nothing backed out.

    Two valve cover bolts on one head and 3 on the other as well as two exhaust holes stripped.

    Worked for me
    #4
  5. pcwirepro

    pcwirepro Aspiring Adventurer

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    Sweet. I can get them from Amazon pretty cheap.
    #5
  6. LaurelPerryOnLand

    LaurelPerryOnLand Long timer

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    Nice demo video about TimeSerts:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gxnm8J9WXz8
    #6
  7. pcwirepro

    pcwirepro Aspiring Adventurer

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    They both look like good options for the valve covers. My left side is currently blowing hot air/oil out the top.
    #7
  8. Beezer

    Beezer Long timer

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    timecerts are not "better", only different. helicoils have been used on aircraft engines for new installation as well as certified repair for at least 60-70 years. I have 36 years as an aircraft mechanic... never seen a properly installed helicoil fail. to install a timesert you have to drill a bigger hole in the parent metal
    #8
  9. pcwirepro

    pcwirepro Aspiring Adventurer

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    Well then they're certainly good enough for my lowly valve covers. Do they require locktite to keep from backing out? I sure don't want to deal with them every time I adjust my valves.
    #9
  10. Chat Lunatique

    Chat Lunatique aka El Gato Loco

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    35 years of tool and die making has let me replaces 1000's of threads that people have stripped. As Beezer says...Helicoil is the King.
    But watch the video Laurel perry posted. There is a whole tool kit you need to install a Timesert $$$

    IMHO
    #1. Helicoil - strong threads and minimal toolkit
    2. Keensert(self locking) - installs with a standard tap set. see link http://www.newmantools.com/kee.htm
    3. Timset - Good but lotsa tools req'd
    #10
  11. bemiiten

    bemiiten League of Adventures

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    Another vote for Timesert. I was told you have to drill a smaller hole then a Heli Coil to install, so is a plus where there is not allot of extra material. Looks much better for a bolt that will see frequent removal as well because it locks in place. If you go for timesert, be sure to get the right length. You need around 5mm of depth past the Timesert to allow the installation tool to travel deep enough to lock the insert in place.
    #11
  12. def

    def Ginger th wonder dog

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    I used Helicoils when repairing the threads on old Brit bike cylinder heads. Never a failure. No special tools just a bit of care.
    #12
  13. def

    def Ginger th wonder dog

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    Agreed. Always consider the advice of an aircraft mechanic. They repair and rebuild engines, airframes and other systems that lives depend on.
    #13
  14. JimVonBaden

    JimVonBaden "Cool" Aid!

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    I've repaired dozens of valve cover threads with Helicoils, never an issue. It is simple, easy to do freehand, and holds the minimal 8nm of torque just fine.

    I've used Helicoils on head studes and brake calipers with no issues as well.

    Jim :brow
    #14
  15. pcwirepro

    pcwirepro Aspiring Adventurer

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    The kit with tap, tool and 12 inserts is $40. Do I need the tool?
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  16. Twilight Error

    Twilight Error Going nowhere slowly

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    Its much easier to do the job with the tool than without.
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  17. bwprice100

    bwprice100 n00b

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    IMHO helicoils work well when the bolt is left in place but can cause problems when the bolt has to be removed on a regular basis, so I would go for the TimeCert.

    Brian
    #17
  18. JimVonBaden

    JimVonBaden "Cool" Aid!

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    Why? The inserts stay in place when removing the bolt. Remember, these are very low torque bolts.

    No need for the much more expensive Timesers in this application.

    As for the tool, yes, get the tool. Just go to Autozone, or similar, and pick it up. The kit can be gotten from HF, though I haven't used one yfrom them, they look the same.

    Jim :brow
    #18
  19. def

    def Ginger th wonder dog

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    JVB is right. Remember, the stock system uses a steel bolt shouldered with a stop, tightened to very low torque, threaded into buttery aluminum. Used properly, this works for the life of the bike.

    When a repair is needed, a Helicoil (or similar) will easily work for life inasmuch as steel is now the material comprising the working female thread.

    When installing my OHV covers, I use hand snug for these bolts, no more. Bottom the bolt to the shoulder and then give a small additional snug...no more! I use a screwdriver style handle with a square drive and a hex wrench.

    Done this way, you'll not be asking which thread repair system to use.
    #19
  20. pcwirepro

    pcwirepro Aspiring Adventurer

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    I got the M6x1 kit from Autozone. It came with 12 inserts and I used 2 per hole. Piss poor instructions but simple installation. I wasn't sure if the tang needed to be broken off if it bottomed out in the hole. I broke them off anyway. The second (stacked) insert was a little scetchy as I didn't know how tight to make it and it didn't seem to "bottom" on the previous insert. That said the left side is done and the cover bolts went in with confidence. For anyone considering this fix, go for it. Piece of cake with the supplied tool and tap. All you need to add is a 1/4" drill bit and a tap handle. 30 minutes for all four holes on the left side.

    Thanks all for your input.
    #20