Help with mapping for GPSmap 60csx

Discussion in 'GPS 101 - Which GPS For Me' started by bmwktmbill, Nov 9, 2010.

  1. bmwktmbill

    bmwktmbill Traveler

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    Hi everyone,
    I have the basic GPSmap 60csx unit coming with a 2Gig card.
    I need some recomendations on mapping. Especially North america, maybe Europe.

    I ride off road and in the second and third world as well as all over North America.

    My son bought a new unit, can I use some of his mapping for North America or is it locked.

    We have Topo, World map and Roads and Rec kicking around.

    Please help I am ignorant on the new stuff but very familiar with world map in the second and third world(such as it is). I accept it's limitations as the best that is.

    Thanks, bill
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  2. mcnut

    mcnut Long timer

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    To the best of my knowledge Topo, World Map and R&R are not locked as they do not use Navteq data. Some of the early auto-routing map sets (CitySelect) allowed unlocks to 2 units but the new stuff (CityNavigator) is 1 unlock only.

    Keep in mind the 60 has a 2025 map tile limit which is easy to hit before filling a 2 gig card especially with the older maps.

    The maps you have are a good start for the US but will be of little use elsewhere, WorldMap is very limited. I would think you might want a routable map set to take advantage of that feature.

    Bruce
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  3. Norms 427

    Norms 427 Been here awhile

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    So is a 16 Gig micro card sorta useless in a 60CSx? Then would u have to have several 2 Gig cards with different maps installed for different areas?

    Thanks.

    Norm
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  4. 250senuf

    250senuf Long timer

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    That would be the way to do it.
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  5. Countdown

    Countdown Long timer

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    How big of an area do you want to ride in in the next year? The hand helds are much more popular of off road riding and most people only ride in 1-3 states at most in a year. The TAT & CDR riders do cover 6-10 states but that is it. But even all than goes into one 2 gig card.

    If you are more of an Adventure bike rider on a big bike and want to use a lot of routes and autorouting, then the larger touch screens which come loaded with nationwide maps are much more popular.
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  6. mcnut

    mcnut Long timer

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    You got it! Do it by area not by map set so while in an area you can switch between types of maps w/o changing the chip.

    Also overlap the areas a fair amount, again so you don't have to constantly swap chips if traveling near the edge of a coverage are.

    I also keep a small chip available for loading special areas like a flight to FL to visit the in-laws. Most have one that came OE with a camera. It takes a good while to reload a big map file, a spare chip solves that problem.

    Bruce
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  7. Norms 427

    Norms 427 Been here awhile

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    Thanks for your help, guys.

    My area will be primarily the Pacific Northwest, western Canada and Alaska. So I may be able to get by with a couple of the 2 gig chips ~ not sure. I have a 1 gig chip in now.

    But I'm also considering the Zumo 665 in addition to my 60 CSx that I've had for years.

    Norm
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  8. bmwktmbill

    bmwktmbill Traveler

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    Bruce,
    Please humor my questions.
    I do not know what a 2025 tile limit means.

    Also I do not know what base map the 60csx comes with but won't that work as a background map, can you switch maps, base map to chip, without switching cards.

    Also just a general comment. I traveled around North, central and South america plus Russia, Mongolia and Europe with World map and paper maps.

    It all worked out fine with just a couple of screw ups.

    It's the frikkin USA that gives me hell. Roads everywhere that aren't on my old maps.
    bill
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  9. mcnut

    mcnut Long timer

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    I'll give it a go:

    The base map on the 60/76 units is very basic, not as good as base maps on some older Garmin units. Use to be all state highways, now just major state highways and Interstates. Also some POI info at Interstate exits. Remember the the base maps are regional, buy a US unit and get the Americas base map, buy an European unit you get the Euro base map. The base maps can not be changed but if you have WorldMap you can load what amounts to a super base map for any part of, or the whole world.

    The though the 60/76 can take a large microSD (4, 8 gig) they have a built in limit of 2025 map segments or tiles. These are the segments you must select or highlight to be loaded using MapSource. Due to the limited memory in older units the map sets of the day were divided into many small segments. For the areas I'm interested in I load 3 map sets - CityNavigator, Topo and Roads & Recreation. With these maps I hit the 2025 segment/tile limit loading the western states, West Coast to the western slopes of the Rockies. I have a second chip to cover the Rockies Mountain states (with overlapping area). If I were to only load one map set instead of 3 I could probably cover most or all of the US. I hit the 2025 limit having used approx 1 gig of memory making a an 8 gig card a waste. Loading the whole world with WorldMap uses 1600 segments/tiles and 150mb.

    And as you might have gathered from the above, yes you can switch map sets on the fly without changing out the chip. The menu to do so is buried a couple menu levels down but I do it all the time.

    I'm with you though, I always travel with a paper map and hopefully some commonsense using the GPS as just one of several navigation strategies. If you were happy with WorldMap in the past it should still work, I own it. I like and use Roads & Rec but for auto-routing and newer roads you would need CityNavigator.

    I hope I've answered your ?.

    Bruce
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  10. bmwktmbill

    bmwktmbill Traveler

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    Bruce,
    Wat you have written is the smartest, most informative information I have read about mapping since I started traveling with my old Emap GPS. I am astounded at how little most know about the new stuff so your answer is very appreciated.

    I think I have it straight in my head that it is possible to change maps on the fly but not regions so you cover that problem by overlapping the mapping for various contingent regions. That way if a guy know where he is going he can switch out chips as necessary and not get into a need to switch back and forth.

    You are suggesting 3 chip sets for the USA, interpulating, maybe one for Canada and Alaska and one for Mexico and Central America, maybe one for Europe(or more) and so on as necessary.

    For chips you suggest using 1 gig memory and loading City nav, roads and rec, topo and world map for each region, not exceeding the 2025 tile limit when creating a region on a chip because that'sall the 60csx will handle.

    Is this correct?

    Another couple of question please.

    Will your chips or others chips work in my 60csx. In other words can we trade chips with others? This isn't a legal question, it's a technical question.
    I am trying to travel without a computer, how do you do it?

    Thanks,
    bill
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  11. mcnut

    mcnut Long timer

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    I think you got it!

    I'm not a take everything I can on every trip I make kind of guy, I usually have a defined area I'm interested in. If I'm ever planning to visit Patagonia I'll source/load maps of the area then. I own CN, Topo & R&R and each has it's strengths and weaknesses so I mostly load all 3. What areas are covered on what chip might depend on geography as much as political boarders. I don't foresee a trip crossing the plains states so I don't have them loaded on any chip, and my west coast chip also includes Baja.

    As for chip size go with what is priced right, a 2gig chip will have extra room for saving a daily track log. I think a firmware update (EZ from Garmin) is needed on the older units for them to recognize many 4gig and larger chips.

    I think with user loaded locked maps (CN) the chip with the maps is locked to a GPS serial number and cannot be shared with another unit. Not sure about the maps that are not locked (R&R, Topo), try it and see. The maps that come preloaded to a chip from Garmin I believe can be moved between units but cannot be displayed on a PC for trip planning using MapSource.

    Bruce
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  12. bmwktmbill

    bmwktmbill Traveler

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    Bruce,
    Is Topo locked or is it the same as the old Topo I have on my Emap.
    I have that CD, plus Roads and Rec.

    On line I see several versions of City Nav available for download free that are pirated versions, not sure.
    Has anyone tried these or care to comment about them.

    http://thepiratebay.org/torrent/4913848/Garmin_City_Navigator_North_America_(2010)_Unlocked

    Just assumed you would download them and burn them to a CD/DVD, they claim to go around the unlocking codes.
    Anyone?

    Thanks, bill
    #12
  13. mcnut

    mcnut Long timer

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    Bill,
    My understanding is the old versions of Topo, the 100k:1 are unlocked. I have heard the new auto-routing 24k:1 set is also not locked but I would not count on it. Also $$$ to cover entire US.

    City Nav is locked. Navteq, who supplies the road data to Garmin for CN insisted that Garmin get control and thus the locked maps. I will not comment on the copies other then to say you might be close to running afoul of the form rules. You might delete the link. Not my thing and may not work anyway.

    Bruce
    #13
  14. ramz

    ramz Professional Trail Rider

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    Count on it - they are unlocked (as I've posted before). I have installed the Southwest 24K topo maps on three different Garmin GPS receivers and no unlocking was required. :thumb
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  15. bmwktmbill

    bmwktmbill Traveler

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    Bruce, Ramz,
    Thanks for the replies, since we have 3 versions of Topo in the family , including the new one I guess we will get the job done with Topo.

    I understand the copyright issues with data and the need to protect it. I recommend that everyone go to Amazon and buy City Nav so you can count on it when you really need it.

    I'm just curious about the whole mapping problem from a technical standpoint.
    If I am in Mongolia and I was...and my GPS dies I just want to know all my options
    bill
    #15
  16. SnowMule

    SnowMule [angry moth noises]

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    Can't say much about any of the non-North-America maps.... but:

    This is the basemap. With no maps on the data card (or no data card present), this is what you'll see. Basemap is in the firmware on the receiver itself, this cannot be modified.
    Map at my location and the "Find" page.
    [​IMG] [​IMG]

    Same location with CityNavigator loaded. You'll see *all* the streets, and street names for damn near every single one of them. Pressing "Find" brings up the Find page with a ton of categories. I picked "Food", then "Rib City Grill".
    [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]

    Topo has the roads, but only the major ones have any sort of name. These roads aren't routable... I picked a waypoint and it got me to an intersection nearby then told me to turn left. If I follow that route it'd have me going over fences and through backyards. It does, however, have topo lines. One of them is visible in the Map page below. The POI's on topo are quite useless.
    [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]
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  17. bmwktmbill

    bmwktmbill Traveler

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    Snow mule,

    Thanks.
    bill
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  18. sperz1

    sperz1 UnStudly Adventurer

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    Excellent screen shots snowmule.

    I ordered my copy of City Navigator last night. :clap
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  19. bmwktmbill

    bmwktmbill Traveler

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    Guys,
    I am back for more.

    Found this free map...


    http://garmin.na1400.info/routable.php


    It's a Wiki map project...

    Would some of you knowledgeable mappers please comment.

    It seems to have lots of detail. IT IS FREE, not pirated Garmin mapping but compatible with Mapsource and Garmin units

    Is the detail better than World map or City Navigator?
    They say it is routable.

    McNut, Countdown, Snow mule, others can you help clarify what this is and if it will work and on the detail.

    Thanks,
    bill
    #19
  20. mcnut

    mcnut Long timer

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    Bill, I had to go back and reread your OP to see where were at. I think you need to better define what kind of map detail/info you need and for what parts of the world. If you want routable topo maps of the planet at your disposal, the GPS hardware and maps of today are not at that level of development. I'm not sure a thread about GPS map sets of the USA and of western Europe will have any relevance to the same discussion about those of "3rd world countries".

    As for the link, you may need to be the guinea pig/evaluator. That site is very clunky on my W7/IE8 machine. I never was able to navigate to anything useful, maybe you will have better luck. The open source maps are getting better at an exponential rate and I'm sure some are very good today but I don't see them surpassing the commercial offerings any time soon. I haven't found an OS map (USA) yet that had me overwriting or even supplementing my commercial maps. I think the future of the open source maps are niche markets that the big guys choose ignore.

    To use a computer analogy; A little like buying a new computer loaded with W7 and then relying on "Word Pad" in Accessories for your word processing. At least buy MS Works or download free open source office. But don't be surprised if a power user of MS Office isn't impressed with MS Works or the open source office for that matter.

    I still think "you get what you pay for" still applies to some degree, value - that's another matter. Personally I think the price of CityNav is very reasonable for what you are getting.

    Bruce
    #20