How to get proof of ownership for a bike w/no title

Discussion in 'The Perfect Line and Other Riding Myths' started by D0N, Jan 28, 2011.

  1. luniz7

    luniz7 Adventurer

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    Nice, I take it you have went this route before?
    #61
  2. der_saeufer

    der_saeufer ?איפה בירה

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    In Colorado, even... but it was a cage in 2004. For some reason, Vermont sends plates and stickers from separate places, so you get a plate with a T on it and then a sticker and a real registration card a couple weeks later.

    You probably will have to remind the DMV people that Vermont doesn't title older vehicles, and they'll probably have to go look it up. It only took me about 5 minutes longer than a normal Colorado DMV trip.
    #62
  3. luniz7

    luniz7 Adventurer

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    Awesome. Thanks for the extra info! They didnt give you much fight? Other than looking it up?
    #63
  4. der_saeufer

    der_saeufer ?איפה בירה

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    They don't really have a choice. It's a bit out of the ordinary since all western states title everything with a license plate, but it's not something that they'll have trouble figuring out. It's not as if you had a title and lost it--for an old vehicle regsitered in Vermont there is no way to get a title, so the registration is the proof of ownership. In my case, Colorado made a typo in my VIN; fixing that was way more trouble than the initial transfer.
    #64
  5. luniz7

    luniz7 Adventurer

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    Yea, it is odd that Vermont doesnt title old motorcycles. Great for people like myself though. Just curious, do they for vin check and all that good stuff or do they just print up the title?
    #65
  6. luniz7

    luniz7 Adventurer

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    Small update. Just received my sticker and real transferable registration in the mail today. Will update again when I decide to go to the CO DMV to get the title.
    #66
  7. Spitfire151

    Spitfire151 Adventurer

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    I'm super stoked to try this in PA, I thought all hope was lost. They wanted me to jump through quite the hoops but now there's a light (it seems).
    #67
  8. JustBelowCloudNine

    JustBelowCloudNine n00b

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    This forum is sweet!! Thanks for the outstanding information. I have a 1985 Suzuki GS 450, only 7530 miles I am trying to sell. Very hard to do without a title unless you wanna take $100 lol. I live in Chicago and I am going to attempt to make this happen as I had purchased this on ebay, received the signed title, but lost it before I had a chance to register it (bike had a few issues so it went into storage anyway). I will try to come back with updates of my own. Glad to see a lot of happy people riding around on their once thought to be never register-able motorcycles! I will definitely be attempting to obtain a title from IL if/after I receive my VT registration. Thanks again! :clap
    #68
  9. JustBelowCloudNine

    JustBelowCloudNine n00b

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    A few questions before I proceed to attempt to get this done.

    My Bill of Sale is almost 8 years old. Is this going to be an issue? I could probably "transfer" it to an updated form if I'll be forced to pay late registration fees or something.

    My Bill of Sale is also for Wisconsin, and I live in Illinois, is that going to be an issue?

    The only fees I can see that I would be required to pay are

    $44.00 for Motorcycle 1 year registration
    6% Sales Tax of the purchase price I paid.

    Am I missing anything? Did anyone put the entire fee on one check, or two separate checks?

    Looks like I just include those two forms, a check and mail to Vermont Department of Motor Vehicles, 120 State Street, Montpelier, VT 05603-0001 - please let me know - thanks!!!
    #69
  10. luniz7

    luniz7 Adventurer

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    I personally would have your neighbor or good friend do a new notarized bill of sale. Doesnt matter what state the bill of sale is from as long as its you as the buyer. Its $44.00 + the 6% tax on the purchase price. Fee is on one check. My fee was $74.00. You will probably have to have a Visual Vin Inspection as well. This is super easy. I got mine done at one of the emissions stations here in CO. It was $20 and they just make sure that the VIN hasnt been modified.

    Read here: http://dmv.vermont.gov/registrations/drivers/requirements/vinverification
    #70
  11. luniz7

    luniz7 Adventurer

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    Ill be going to the CO DMV one day this week to get a CO Title and will report back. Stay tuned.
    #71
  12. luniz7

    luniz7 Adventurer

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    This might help some people out with what to do on the form. Remember this is for a 15+ year old motorcycle. Im not sure what you would do for something newer. You need to fill out the following boxes on form #TA-VD-119.

    1A- will be NEW
    1B
    2
    3C
    4A- will be you as the owner, ignore the VT DL
    5B- will be the seller you bought it from
    6A- purchase price of the bike and the 6% tax of the purchase price
    8- sign and date
    9- Registration fee. $44.00. Take the tax amount from 6A. You will fill out Registration, Tax, and the Total Fees.

    Send completed Vermont registration form, check for the fee (made out to Vermont DMV, VIN verification form, and bill of sale to 120 State Street, Montpelier, VT 05603-0001.
    #72
  13. JustBelowCloudNine

    JustBelowCloudNine n00b

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    Awesome, thanks for the info! I have a 1985 Suzuki GS 450, so not a problem there! What do you do if the motorcycle isn't running, do they send someone to your house to check out the VIN or am I going to have to tow it there? Either way, thanks for the clarification!
    #73
  14. der_saeufer

    der_saeufer ?איפה בירה

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    Did Vermont accept the Colorado VIN form, or did you get the emissions station to fill out the Vermont form? I never had to deal with that because my VT registrations were for a KZ400, a GPz750 that had been tagged in VT before, and a cage.

    Note that VIN checks are only required on motorcycles that are 500cc or over (or 300cc or over AND <15 years old, which would also require a title), so your '85 GS450 wouldn't need a VIN check for Vermont.
    #74
  15. willis 2000

    willis 2000 neo-quixote

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    Idaho charges sales tax on vehicular transactions. I took a sketchy transaction to the dmv, Nevada title, multiple owners, and I didn't chisel them on the tax.
    My experience (Idaho) is, if you don't chisel them on the tax, they'll process it.
    A positive attitude and the willingness to pay tax makes all the difference.
    Leave tax disputes for another day. Pay up, don't try the Sportster for a hunsky dodge.
    #75
  16. willis 2000

    willis 2000 neo-quixote

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    $100.
    A locally understood term of exchange.
    Pay up, it's a tariff.
    The grease.
    #76
  17. JustBelowCloudNine

    JustBelowCloudNine n00b

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    Thanks for the info, hopefully I won't have to do a VIN check, although the two statements below from the VT application instructions PDF kind of contradict each other:

    A visual verification of the identification number (serial number) of your vehicle is required if the vehicle is required to be titled and:

    Was last registered in another state (unless purchased from an out of state dealer fo rthe purpose of registering in VT) or

    The vehicle is a motorcycle with an engine size of 300cc's or more and last registered in another state or

    Is a non-titleable motorcycle with an engine size of 500 ccs or more cc's unless proof of a previous registration is submitted.

    I am guessing that since the first sentence says "required to be titled" means that my bike does not apply to the 300cc rule because since my bike (Non-running Suzuki 1985 GS 450L) is more than 15 years old, it is non titleable, meaning only the 500cc rule would apply....confirming that I do not need a VIN check. Who knows, government lingo is always worded so they have a way to do either if they choose to. I'll be more than happy to verify my legitimate VIN if it gets me a registration card that will turn into an IL title.

    With the above verbiage Luniz7 should not have had to do a VIN verification. Luniz, did you just have a VIN verification completed before you sent in your application (to be proactive), or did you send it in and they responded with the VIN verification requirement?

    http://dmv.vermont.gov/registrations/drivers/requirements/vinverification - you had provided this link, but it only references New Vehicles and Used Vehicles 15 yrs old and Newer? So happy to see that after the little hiccup with them upping the registration fee, you have a registered bike to ride!

    Hopefully this runs smooth as pie, I think the prime bikes for this procedure are bikes that are 500ccs or less and greater than 15 years old (although I am sure this has been mentioned at least 10x in previous posts of this thread).

    Willis - at least you had a Nevada title at all. I, Mr. Irresponsible, lost my Wisconsin title already signed over to me before I registered because the battery went out and the bike went into storage within 2 weeks of obtaining it. This was an ebay purchase that was completed outside of Ebay so I have no way of finding out the owners contact info (unlisted). I did find on the Wisconsin DMV site that they have a vehicle/driver information request form where you can request the previous owners name/address for $7.00. I've had the bike for 7 years and no theft report has been filed, so even if he got shady all the sudden, he would have no proof in court (plus I have the bill of sale). If contacting him, provided WI gives me the information, doesn't pan out, I'll be happy to increase Vermont's revenue :) I'll also be happy to pay tax on the original sale price to VT if this all works out, even though it is currently not running!

    Happy Riding All -
    #77
  18. luniz7

    luniz7 Adventurer

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    Yes they accepted the CO VIN form.
    #78
  19. luniz7

    luniz7 Adventurer

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    I sent the registration form in to Vermont before without the VIN form and it got returned. You dont need a VIN check. Post 74 describes why.
    #79
  20. JustBelowCloudNine

    JustBelowCloudNine n00b

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    Ahhh, just realized your 1978 KZ750 is 750 ccs, hence the reason you had to get the vin check. Woot woot. Thanks!
    #80