I cannot tell a lie...

Discussion in 'Battle Scooters' started by kittty, Aug 7, 2012.

  1. hexnut

    hexnut Been here awhile

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    We had one of those John Deere tractors. It was a 30 something model. It started on gas and ran on kerosene.

    What gives a Harley its distinctive sound is the rods being together on a single crank pin. They both go up and down at the same time. As the crank rotates 360 degrees the cylinders are separated by 45 degrees so one cylender fires 45 degrees before the other one. That gives the Harley its loping idle and sound.
    #81
  2. Speedo66

    Speedo66 Transient

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    That sounds like it's going to be pretty.

    Please post some photos here on the W650 thread when it's done. http://www.advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=514600
    #82
  3. CaseyJones

    CaseyJones Ridin' that train

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    Well, we're gonna have to disagree on these things.

    Like you; like probably all kids, I liked crude and loud when I was a kid. I had glasspacks on my VW Beetle, fer chrissakes! But I turned on noise and shake earlier; don't know why.

    Certainly my SR500 helped. A great bike in many ways, it was a classic-design big thumper; and I found it tiresome with the vibration and all. It probably helped sway me that at the same time I was learning downhill skiiing. Silent...smooth...fast...exhilarating!

    I no longer find engine noise, anything but...noise. Probably part of THAT is that for twenty years now I've worked swing-shift, having to sleep out of a normal cycle and often in daytime. A pack of Harleys disturbing the peace while I'm in a struggling half-sleep is not my favorite thing.

    And I think a lot of Harley riders and riders in general would admit the same but for their pride. Like I said, I used to ride with two co-workers with their open-pipe Harleys; I had a BMW. I could have beaten them in any speed or twisty test; but where I REALLY beat them was in endurance. They had to gas up more (the computer on one of them helpfully displayed fuel mileage, which was around 38) and get the blood circulating in their backsides MUCH more. And they'd be shaking their arms. And ALWAYS ready to stop for a soda or snack. Gee...do they really LIKE riding?

    Anyway...I got old early for my age; and I'm older even by the calendar now. And I was away from riding for many years, having got back into it four years ago. And I no longer have any need - or hope - to impress young women. So a ride with a good muffler and balanced engine, hidden under shrouding, works fine for me.
    #83
  4. conchscooter

    conchscooter Long timer

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    I have put 66,000 totally trouble free miles on my modern sewing machine Bonneville. It's heavier than the old Bonnevilles which I never owned because when they were new they kept breaking down. It's as easy to ride as a scooter, I find it comfortable I have ridden 35 hours non stop for an iron butt ride and I have ridden in rain and wind and cool Florida winters. I don't see a Harley sportster as being so versatile though I wish I had $17,000 for a Dyna Switchback in glorious red. I am not a Harley hater.

    I owned a Stella and the oil pump broke after 2800 miles and the engine seized. Genuine blamed me! I sold it back to the embarrassed dealer for $1000. It was a mess, bolts nuts and screws came loose, including the rear wheel locknut. How I don't know. Switch boxes lost connections and I spent more time fixing it than riding it. With a top speed of 53 painful miles an hour it was outgunned by anything except a rental scooter in Key West.

    I got a Vespa 250 GTS bound and determined to relive my glorious Vespa youth. I am equally a lover of motorcycles and scooters. My first ride 42 years ago was a Vespa 50R. The modern GTS was comfortable fast and totally complex and unreliable. It blew relays for breakfast lunch and dinner. The exhaust joint bearing broke. The rear wheel was impossible to remove, the engine computer kept malfunctioning. The dealer blamed me. I sold it.

    Enter the Bonneville, perfect reliability, easy ride which some people deride as a bad thing. Have all the loud pipes you want. I like my neighbors, my hearing and my ability to zip by unnoticed. I'm writing this from the Blue Ridge Mountains where I am spending a week and 2500 miles riding the twisties. I pass Harleys wobbling round corners like plastic breakfast cereal toys. On my heaving overweight pig. It's the inexperienced riders not their super expensive rides.

    Now I am crazy enough to be in the market for a P200 Vespa and I might have found a restored model I can afford. I believe like the OP, the best of both worlds is possible. It just takes time money and crappy experiences to find the combo that works for YOU.
    #84
  5. Dabears

    Dabears --------------------

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    Conchscooter-

    Great write-up. Glad the Triumph is good to you. Always had a soft spot for the brand after my '69 Daytona. Loved that bike. Wish I had it back...

    Anyhow, question for you- after your miserable Stella experience and your less than stellar (pun intended) Vespa experience why are you going to get a P200? This isn't meant to be a trick question, as I've got a P200E myself.

    I was just curious what you believe will be different/mo' better with a 30 year old P than a more recently built Stella had to offer. (and yes, I do like my P, but have been very open here about it's shortcomings).

    Incidently, I can gladly offer up a bit of advice on some hotspot items to be aware of with your new old P if you go that route- just PM me.
    #85
  6. JerryH

    JerryH Banned

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    I'm still stuck in the old days, and love it. Back then it took a really special person to ride a motorcycle. Hell, it took a really special person just to start one. and you had to work on them to keep them going. It was said that anyone on a British bike was either a mechanic, or about to become one, possibly in the next few minutes. And that was at least partially true. You had to be really committed to ride a motorcycle. Motorcycles were noisy, oily machines that vibrated like paint shakers. I like the sound and vibration of a Harley, including the mechanical noises. It is after all, a machine.

    A Burgman is about as far removed from a motorcycle as it is possible to get. It is basically a modern car on 2 wheels. It sounds and feels like it has an electric motor. It's mostly made out of plastic. And for the price of a Burgman 650, you can almost get a Smart Car, which is a bit more practical, and probably even gets better gas mileage, has A/C, and protection from the weather. I see both as strictly transportation devices, not for fun. Those old vehicles were fun, todays modern ones are mostly drop dead boring, I see nothing wrong with having a newer vehicle for reliable transportation, but for me anyway, they are worthless as toys.

    I have owned 3 VW bugs, one was a drag race car, the other 2 were souped up street cars. I never did actually figure out what held the VW engine together, but they sure were fun to work on and drive. They were noisy, vibrated, had quirky handling, very stiff suspension (mine were lowered) barely enough brakes, no A/C, no heater, no creature comforts at all. But what a blast they were to drive. Again, they were real machines, not plastic computers on wheels. Like I said to begin with, it takes a special person to love and enjoy something like that. I'm one of those.
    #86
  7. klaviator

    klaviator Long timer

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    I have ridden just about every type of bike including bikes made in Japan, USA, Tiawan, Germany, and Italy. Standards, full dress tourers, cruisers, sport bikes, sport touring bikes, Dual sports, Adventure bikes, enduros, MX bikes, and scooters. They all had one thing in common, two wheels and an engine. Some where more fun and exciting to ride than others but they were ALL fun to ride. As far as I am concerned, there are no completely boring bikes, only boring riders.

    Having said that, for the OP. Get the bike you really want. The only way to find out if it really is what you want is to ride it for a while. Many years ago I wanted to get the one of the fastest and most exciting bikes available. So I did. I enjoyed it but after a couple of years I realized it wasn't what I really wanted. BUT, I had to get that bike. If I hadn't I would still be wishing I did to this day.

    So, get the bike you really want. If it is not the perfect bike, SO WHAT. You will almost certainly enjoy it and eventually you will move on to another bike anyway. The only person who can determine the best bike for you, is YOU.
    #87
  8. Sportsman Matt

    Sportsman Matt Xtremely Bad Example

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    All I can say is I played with a Royal Enfield once,
    As they say Royal Enfield makes mechanics, not riders.....meaning if you can't wrench, you'll be walking. Even with the new ones.
    As for the 883 Iron by HD, I bought one, and after the warranty is up, then that's when the fun will start with the bigger engine, gear changes, maybe even new pipes.

    For the money, unless you want to wait for critical parts, go for American made bikes. If you have all the time to wait (2 to 3 months at times) then go foreign.

    Besides, the 883 goes for $7999, versus the $5000 to $6000 for the RE.
    #88
  9. Renegade_Azzy

    Renegade_Azzy Kamen Rider

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    You want attention and like scooters? Get an MP3.
    #89
  10. Süsser Tod

    Süsser Tod Long timer

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    One of them is not like the others!

    [​IMG]

    One is fuel injected the others are carburated...

    One is a Suzuki, the others are Yamaha...

    One is liquid cooled, the others are air cooled...

    Two of them are blue... Wait, all three are blue! :clap:rofl

    That's part of my stable, the scooter and the two bikes I love the most. CBR and SV1000 are missing on that picture...

    I actually got the scooter because commuting on them, or riding short distances, is not really practical. They don't fully warm up, batteries do not charge up completely, but most importantly, you don't get to enjoy them while slipping the clutch in stop and go traffic or wrestling the heavy girls in low speed maneuvers.

    I loathe cruiser and Harley Davidson culture, I refuse to do the whole gay pirate costume thing...

    When I owned a cruiser I avoided other cruisers at all costs! :lol3 I sold it because I ended up hating the cruiser, too heavy, underpowered, slow, couldn't corner worth a damn, scraped hard parts all over the place, the riding position made me feel like a sail, feet forward means you can't use your legs to raise your butt of the seat when pavement gets rough, etc.

    The Cruiser scene was irrelevant to me, I was out there riding, doing my own ride.

    Your New Beetle or the desired Mini and Fiats are nothing like the originals. The originals were utilitarian cars to get from A to B, comfort was not part of the design considerations. The new retro cars are boutique cars. New Vespa 150/300 is the same to a vintage Vespa than a new Mini is to a real Mini.

    I love rowing gears on my other bikes, the 600RR and XT660R require you to shift all the time (for completely different reasons), but riding a twist and go can also be a lot of fun! The beauty of the CVT is always being on the powerband! Other riders on small displacement bikes are surprised by how fast the lowly twist and go Suzuki can be.

    Honestly, I think you're in love with an idea of what riding should be like.
    #90
  11. kittty

    kittty ScooterGirl

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    This, I am more than aware of. But an air-cooled Beetle is not something I can have for a daily, and not something I have room for as a toy, so it's only a dream. My New Beetle is a nod to the original, that's all. And I'm fine with that for a daily driver. If I had my way, I'd have a fleet of old cars. A DeSoto, a Type 3 Notchback, a RHD Mini... but that day will probably never come.

    Anyway, I have never owned an automatic car, and I don't see a need to own a twist and go scooter, it just won't happen. It's not a opposition to the style of the scooters, it's the transmission. If the GTS Super had a clutch, I'd be into it.
    #91
  12. S/W

    S/W Been here awhile

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    There are many people who never had the chance to row a shxx can junk car around with a three speed on the column when they were young.Or a small Japanese car with a 600cc engine and a four speed.. For the same reason guys got to have a Harley, many people have to get shifting out of their systems. I don't have a problem with that, I was young once. But, If I find myself in stop and go, bumper to bumper, beach traffic, on a hot summer weekend, I want to be riding something with a CVT.
    A long time ago I was listening to a talk show about wine. A call in question was "how do I become a wine expert"? The answer from the expert was simple " drink lots of wine"! It's the same with bikes. Buy what you want, don't kid yourself with the results, and keep trying till you get the bike that is fun to ride. This is not easy, and is why people sometimes have garages full of them.
    #92
  13. Birdmove

    Birdmove Long timer

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    I'm approaching my 59th birthday and started riding at 8 years. I've owned some 25 motorcycles in that time and a few scooters. I've owned two Sportsters. First was a new 1984 XLX1000. Second was a used 2006 XL883. I liked them both just fine. The 2006 was about the perfect bike for me, especially since my wife doesn't ride on the back any more. Be aware that the Iron has lowered suspension for that slammed look. My Sportsters both had standard length suspension. The Iron won't have as good of cornering clearance. I worked at Destination Harley-Davidson in Tacoma, Wa. for 5 years. A coworker that had a Nightster (with the shortened suspension also) followed me to work one morning on my XL883. It was a great winding country road along farms and a river. He couldn't believe the lean angles I got (me being an old geezer too). He couldn't make the corners like I could due to scraping hard parts. HD goes to shorter shocks in the rear and shorter fork tubes up front.
    I also bought a new 2007 Royal Enfield 500 Bullet Classic in the British racing green. Great looking bike and mine did quite well. If you want to be noticed, buy the Enfield. I have never had so many strangers approach me asking about that bike. They handle well, are way lighter than any competition, look great, get great gas mileage, etc. The valves were the easiest to adjust I have ever seen. With the tool (a wrench) in hand and the bike at TDC on compression stroke, I could check the clearance in maybe 30 seconds. Adjusting took another wrench and maybe 5 minutes tops. Oil and filter changes were more involved than most bikes, but still no big deal. Mine used no measurable oil between changes. As in I never had to add any.
    I also rode genuine old timey Britbikes back in the 70s. And I've owned a bunch of dual sport bikes.
    When Triumph (Hinkley Triumph) came out with the Bonneville I rode my Kawasaki 500 Ninja to a dealer and took a test ride. I liked it a lot, and love the looks too. Haven't bought one yet. Life is just too dam short. Right now I want to get another dual sport.
    Best of luck in your choice. Test ride that Iron. At least HD dealers still do test rides.
    #93
  14. CaseyJones

    CaseyJones Ridin' that train

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    Brought back a memory.

    Know when I really decided shifting wasn't worth it? In Sturgis, of all places - when I stumbled into town a week before Bike Week; and was locked in traffic. I thought I would burn out the clutch of my R1200GS, all the creeping along. Engine was overheating, too...I took to leg-pedaling it forward. Until a way opened up to get me OUT of there...

    Shifting on a bike, as a routine...ain't all it's cracked up to be. In some uses, some applications, sure. Not for urban areas or stop-and-go situations.
    #94
  15. JerryH

    JerryH Banned

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    "Your New Beetle or the desired Mini and Fiats are nothing like the originals. The originals were utilitarian cars to get from A to B, comfort was not part of the design considerations. The new retro cars are boutique cars. New Vespa 150/300 is the same to a vintage Vespa than a new Mini is to a real Mini"

    I want the originals. The "real deals" not some modern plastic computerized "imitation". I especially love the air cooled Beetle. I have owned 3 of them, and will most likely own another. Other than my former '70 Dodge Charger with a 440 Magnum, they were the most fun cars I ever owned.
    #95
  16. mrphotoman

    mrphotoman Long timer

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    I feel the exact opposite, I see absolutely nothing about a harley that I like. Underpowered, overweight, poor handling and low quality compared to the others. I just do not see why anyone would want one.


    #96
  17. kittty

    kittty ScooterGirl

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    I've always driven Volkswagens. Started with a 1988 Fox and as new as a 2007 Rabbit. In no way do I think my Beetle replaces the original, that's not the point of it. I got the Beetle because I wanted a convertible, and I knew if I got a Cabrio I would mod the hell out of it, because I had already owned two others on the MK3 platform and I knew too much about what was available for them. I knew if I got a Beetle, I wouldn't do much beyond suspension and wheels. I didn't buy it with the intent of it being "retro," I just wanted a convertible and they're cute.

    I like that older people often approach me in parking lots or chat with me at stop lights though. besides the rough shape, it's nothing like the original, but it still brings them back to the one they had. Also, kids on the side of the road punch each other, that's probably the best part.

    The biggest thing the New Beetle has in common with an air-cooled though, is that neither have a badge. I know the air-cooled weren't technically called Beetles, but it obviously caught on, and they never said Beetle on them. Well, the new ones don't either. What other car doesn't have a badge on it? Nothing I can think of, outside of exotics. It doesn't need a badge, it's so iconic everyone knows what it is from any angle. That, I like. I know cars, and when new Nissans and Hondas and whatever come out, you rarely know what they are anymore when you see one on the road for the first time. That's never a problem with the Beetle, of any era. That's what still evokes warm fuzzies even with the new ones. It's familiar and comforting. And it comes stock with a bud vase :rofl
    #97
  18. SilkMoneyLove

    SilkMoneyLove Long timer

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    I think HD quality is very good. I owned an 883R and enjoyed it. I sold it because I rode it too fast for what it was and almost crashed...a couple of times.

    I have a Ural for putting around and riding with the kid. Have you checked those out? I know you dealer doesn't sell them, and they aren't going to go over 70mph, so it might not be what you want.
    Downside, they don't lean or go that fast and your dealer doesn't support them.
    Upside - Depending on the year, they are basically the same sine the 70s. Mine is a 1997 and is kick start only.
    You get noticed...a lot. It has reverse!
    #98
  19. Süsser Tod

    Süsser Tod Long timer

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    Well, Kitty has backed herself into a corner, and...

    The only options would be a Royal Enfield or a Ural. The Ural Solo ST doesn't have a sidecar and looks the part of an old BMW...

    The new Royal Enfields with the UCE are much better than the old ones. They look like brand new bikes from the 50s, but the UCE is a brand new design, with technology from the 70s, but new.
    #99
  20. kittty

    kittty ScooterGirl

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    I don't think the Ural is an option. I don't need a sidecar, that's for sure, and there doesn't seem to be a good reason to get the Solo one over anything else, like the Royal Enfield. No dealer nearby.

    I still really love the Royal Enfield, but I don't think it's the right choice for what I need to do. I want something that will be comfortable for fairly short highway trips, like visiting a friend a half hour away, that sort of stuff. Something that will be easy to maintain, which while some people have had luck, I don't think it's known for it (even though they tout it on their website).