Is it ok to filter to b 1st?

Discussion in 'The Perfect Line and Other Riding Myths' started by GSAragazzi, Sep 30, 2012.

  1. Too_Tall

    Too_Tall The Belgian

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    Lane split all the time here in Europe. Won't zip past a traffic jam at a +/- 50 km/hr speed difference like some do :huh but at a slower pace, or at traffic lights with a minor queue, I do it all the time.

    I always keep the bike in 1st, and make sure I make a good clean getaway at the green though, sometimes someone won't like you filtering to the front (most times they were startled to see a bike pull up in front of them when they were at the front row) and they will try to keep up. A little throttle and I'm a few lengths ahead.

    General EUR attitude (cagers and bikers) = Why keep a carspace occupied at the middle with a motorcycle, when you can take off from the front alot faster then most cars and free up some space in the middle/back of the queue?
    #21
  2. 390beretta

    390beretta Long timer

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    Uhh.....when you filter to the front at a light, you wind up right between the two cars who are first in line. So what do you do when the light changes, count on one of them to let you get ahead in their lane? Riding some dual sports, you may not have the juice to force the issue and would more than likely piss off the driver anyway. What's the problem with just taking your turn, aiming for an escape route in case someone tries to make a sandwichh of you from behind, watch your mirrors, as others have said, until you have a car or two buffer behind you (of course keeping the bike in gear)?
    #22
  3. Too_Tall

    Too_Tall The Belgian

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    I never filter so I end up between 2 cars.

    I filter to the front, as in I park in front of the right car.

    It's Europe, people can't drive for sh*t so they pull up leaving a good carlength before the white line.

    I always check, if the cars are all the way upto the white line I just stay in the lane, don't want to end up next to a car...
    #23
  4. Tjocksteffe

    Tjocksteffe I was

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    Filtrer smilter, schmatagat....

    <iframe width="480" height="360" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/WuSYy7uaHTY?rel=0" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>
    #24
  5. Human Ills

    Human Ills Useful Idiom

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    uhh.. I gently roll on the throttle and easily clear all traffic.
    #25
  6. el queso

    el queso toda su base

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    Filtering up is a nice way to say you're snaking all the stopped cars, and saying it's for safety is just trying to justify your snakeyness. Nobody likes a snake...
    #26
  7. Tjocksteffe

    Tjocksteffe I was

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    I've to agree to disagree, if you're filtering without holding someone up, what's the problem?
    #27
  8. LittleRedToyota

    LittleRedToyota Yinzer

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    unless you run the red light, skipping to the front of the line holds the line up relative to what would have happened had you not skipped to the front of the line.

    if it's only you, and you nail the throttle the instant the light changes (and the 1st car in line would not have done the same), the hold up is very short and probably has no real effect.

    if skipping line becomes common place and you have several bikes doing it or you don't nail it the instant the light changes, the hold up starts to have an effect.

    if one car does not make it through the light because of your skipping line that would have made it through the light had you not skipped line, you have negatively impacted another in a selfish act--which is lame.
    #28
  9. Human Ills

    Human Ills Useful Idiom

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    Here's the problem, some people have tiny genitalia. Anybody who calls themselves a rider better know that the safest place is in a bubble and that the best way to create a bubble is by being first off a light.


    It's a perk, just like air conditioning is a perk for people in cages.

    We have a lot of riders in California, and filtering is legal and your hypothetical doesn't match my practical experience/observation.
    #29
  10. Tjocksteffe

    Tjocksteffe I was

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    :rofl well here in spain it's comon practise, the most important part is to make sure that no'one is filtering faster than you from behind:D
    #30
  11. LittleRedToyota

    LittleRedToyota Yinzer

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    i haven't ever ridden or driven in cali to know.

    but, others have described to me that when filtering in cali, you stay between the cars on multi lane roads and, so, you and the cars still pull away at the same time...so, you aren't holding the cars up at all. you aren't skipping line, you are creating another line. is that correct?

    if so, that is different from what the OP asked. (he asked about the kind of "filtering" i see from time to time around here...where you go around cars and then cut back in front of them.)

    if not, and you are actually pulling in front of the lead car so that the car that was 1st in line is now 2nd in line, the 2nd in line is now 3rd in line, etc. how do you surmise you are not having an effect? how did you measure how many cars would have made it through the light had you and several other bikes not skipped to the front of the line? have you timed how long it is between when the light turns green and when the first car starts accelerating (in cases where no line skipping has happened vs. in cases where line skipping has happened)?

    obviously, the 2nd person in a line cannot begin to accelerate until the 1st person has pulled away. the 3rd cannot begin to accelerate until the 2nd has pulled away, etc. so, obviously, moving someone from 1st in line to 2nd in line (or 2nd in line to 3rd in line, etc.) is going to delay them to some extent.
    #31
  12. Tjocksteffe

    Tjocksteffe I was

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    #32
  13. AZbiker

    AZbiker Crunkin' with crackers

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    When I do it I end up a hundred+ feet in front of the next nearest cager. :dunno

    That was even in Phoenix on my 883 XLH, a bike that wouldn't get out of it's own way. :lol3

    I've been riding that way for a long time.
    #33
  14. Human Ills

    Human Ills Useful Idiom

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    I don't want to say never, but I've never seen a rider filter to the front, only to move back over and wait in front of the first car, in the crosswalk or the intersection, for the light to turn green.

    Occasionally, two people will filter to the front and one rider is somewhat at the mercy of the first rider to clear out. But typically when the light changes, the gap between the cars are excruciatingly massive and tend to shrink as the time to yellow winds down, another reason why it's safer to be at the front of the light as opposed to far in the back.
    #34
  15. eatpasta

    eatpasta Lawnmower Target

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    all this says to me is that you've never ridden in California and have never needed to lane split.

    I've been riding almost every single day in Los Angeles for the past 10 years and I can tell you, without question that 95% of the time if I leave when the light turns green, the cars haven't even cleared the crosswalk.

    You have no idea how much safer it is for bikes to make their way to the front.


    and if you have never ridden in California, or lane split, why are you critiquing people that do? I certainly don't give Tuba lessons.....

    :dunno
    #35
  16. LittleRedToyota

    LittleRedToyota Yinzer

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    no one ever *needs* to lane split.

    if you have cut back in front of the lead car, that proves nothing. the lead car can't begin to go until you are out of the way. so, obviously, the cars will not have cleared the crosswalk until after you are already gone.

    (but, it sounds to me like you do not move back in front of the lead car. in that case, as i have said before, no problem. but, i don't think that is what the OP was talking about.)

    yes i do. but i choose to ride a motorcycle. thus, i choose to put myself in additional danger relative to driving a car. thus, it is i, and not others, who should bear the downside of that choice. forcing others to be inconvenienced to accommodate my choice would be lame.

    if someone asked "is it OK for me to go play my tuba next to someone's window?" you could probably answer "No" even though you don't play a tuba.

    at any rate, as i mentioned above. if your definition of "lane splitting" does not involve cutting back in line after skipping past people, then what i'm saying doesn't apply. but the version of "lane splitting" or "filtering" or, really, "skipping line" that happens (from time to time, not a lot) around here does involve cutting back in line.

    you can justify it however you want, but the bottom line is that going around people who are in a line and then cutting into the front of the line is skipping line. it means everyone else in the line has to wait a bit longer. that's the way lines...all lines...work.

    also, as i said before, if it is just one bike and you are on the ball, it probably does not mean a car that would have made it through the light won't get through the light. but, if it does end up meaning a car that would have gotten through the light does not, then you are being a selfish a-hole.
    #36
  17. dbuzz

    dbuzz Citizen of the world

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    Meh ... if the car drivers all suddenly decided to ride bikes they would be the ones filtering / splitting with the rest of us. The only reason they don't do it now is they can't.

    I'm usually gone before they even realise I am there. You do get the occassional nob who tries to block .. I just wait my chance.
    #37
  18. JonU

    JonU Been here awhile

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    When I lived in Germany, lane splitting didn't bother me at all (and yes i was driving a car then). I could care less if somebody on a motorcycle was to make his/her way to the front at a light. So what if they get through and I don't, that's the benefit of riding/driving a small vehicle; it opens up spaces other people can't use. Anyways, if your route or trip is timed so tight that missing a light or two will make or break whatever it is that you are trying to do, then maybe you didn't give yourself enough time in the first place. I am definitely for lane sharing/splitting. WIll I do it? Not unless it is made legal, and even then I probably still wouldn't do it very often. But it would be nice to have the choice.
    #38
  19. eatpasta

    eatpasta Lawnmower Target

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    Have you even ridden in a city with 17,000,000 cars? Bikes overheat in 90F+ heat very quickly when stopped - so yes, bikes NEED to lane split in Los Angeles. The entire reason that it is legal in California is so that the CHP bikes wouldn't overheat in traffic.

    again, you've never done it, you dont understand. Very rarely is the bike directly in front of the car. Because you came up between the cars, yes you are in front of the cars but still in between - therefore, never impede their forward motion. I can tell you that from the times I have stalled my XR650R and when the light turned green, the cars never had problems going around me while I was trying to kick start the dammed thing....

    When you are lane splitting, you are essentially using a different lane. You are virtually NEVER getting in the way of the cars and vice versa. Being in the middle, does not, impede traffic flow. I don't understand how you are coming up with these answers with zero experience.

    Now.... let me end this post with a personal footnote.

    One morning commuting to work I came to part of the road where it was too narrow for me to lane split. So I filed in with the rest of the cars....and then....

    [​IMG]

    I could have very easily have been killed by this industrial lawn mower and why it was on Santa Monica Blvd., ill never know. Had I been lane splitting, I could have avoided this whole ordeal.

    I was very lucky.

    Now, had these guys been allowed to lane split, a bunch of innocent people would still be alive.

    http://www.azcentral.com/arizonarep...-phoenix-motorcycle-crash.html?nclick_check=1
    #39
  20. LittleRedToyota

    LittleRedToyota Yinzer

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    again, as i have explained a couple times, i am not commenting on what you described.

    i am commenting based on what i see people doing from time to time around here (not what you describe...but, rather, going past the line of cars and then moving back over in front of the lead car).

    and, more relevantly, in response to the actual wording of the OP:

    to me, that sounds like what i have witnessed (moving back over in front of the lead car), not what you are describing (creating another line rather than moving back to the front of the existing line), but maybe i misunderstood what the OP was envisioning.

    anyway, i think i've made myself clear and i'm just repeating myself, so i'm done.
    #40