KTM 525 EXC as an Adventure Bike

Discussion in 'Thumpers' started by Karnage, Jan 31, 2007.

  1. Stu

    Stu Buffo Maximus

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    Leesbian.

    KTM USA does NOT want the RFS on the streets here and has made that clear over the years. I suspect it has something to do with our government regulations and enforcement, but I am speculating. KTM USA says that the LC4 wheel will not work on the RFS. Not what they supply, that is. I will check on the 244 wheel. If I have to I will get one from over there. Thanks!

    Stu
  2. vuugti

    vuugti Pretty much...

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    Stu -
    Pat indicated he had a bunch of guys buying the EXC wheel for their 640 Adventures and none of those guys are having problems. Also, I had the gap you have now they I understand the problem fully. After 100 mi no gap. It fit really damn tight too. Now, no problem. I also used some alcohol upon assembly to lube things up a little hoping they'd slide together easier.:wink:

    Leesbian -
    I sold my stock rear wheel, sorry I don't have any part numbers. The bike is an '05 525 EXC.

    Cheers,:D
    Andy
  3. leesbian

    leesbian Been here awhile

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  4. vuugti

    vuugti Pretty much...

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    Not sure, Pat has a 304 area code phone number though. Super cheap and a stand up guy. I can PM you his number. At any rate, that is what I paid. Remember the carrier and the six dampners. The "complete" wheel does not include that. The ol' bait and switch.

    If you have a problem with shipping let me know. I've shipped untold amount of P-car parts back and forth across the pond.

    Andy
  5. leesbian

    leesbian Been here awhile

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    OK, can you PM me the number of this guy and I'll call him tonite.

    Just to clarify - I need the complete rear wheel, the sprocket carrier, and 6 dampeners?

    Also, what size bags are your tank and rear bags? (small or large). Want to get those ordered today.
  6. DaddyBigDaddy

    DaddyBigDaddy AKA -Evel Kneilson

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    Just have one built by Woodys'...the best.

    www.woodyswheelworks.com


  7. vuugti

    vuugti Pretty much...

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    Leesbian -

    Small expedition tankbag

    Large expedition rear bag. The only reason I went with that one was my sleeping pad is 28 in. wide. Not skimping on the sleeping pad.:lol3

    Yes, those are the parts you'll need (wheel, carrier, 6 dampners). Pat's number has been PM'd to you. Tell him the parts Andy got, as I talked with him yesterday to get the part numbers for you guys he should remember, are the ones you need. Plan B have all the part numbers above ready to go. I also went with 15-42 gearing. No vibes at 75 mph. You can do 44 or 46 if you are riding any tight stuff. I'm buying both to experiment.

    Stu & Leesbian -

    All KTM wheels from '96 on are the same width. Soap up the rubbers (dampners) slap it together and ride it. Check periodically for axle nut torque, correct as needed. Should have no issues, better a tight fit than slack in the carrier.

    Cheers,
    Andy ------snowed in!:wings Break out the skis!
  8. Stu

    Stu Buffo Maximus

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    Andy,
    I tried the universal tire mounting fluid -- Dawn dish soap. No go for me. There is a gap between the bottom of the rubber dampners and the wheel. I am going to carefully file down the ribs on the inside of the wheel by about 5mm and see if the wheels and backing plate will fit, even if tightly. You are right, it will not take much.
    I presume you meant guys purchasing 640 cushioned wheels for their RFS EXCs (and in my case, my 2 stroke as well).
    Stu
  9. vuugti

    vuugti Pretty much...

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    Stu - I had the exact same issue. Mine didn't go all the way at first either. Have you tried mounting it and riding? Just curious, not trying to insult you. I am pretty anal about fit as well, being an engineer I repsect the tight tolerance issue, but, I reach a point where I just resort to floggin the bastard. :lol3 The cool thing about German stuff is it is usually over built in contrast to the asian stuff so there is tons of leeway. The info is from long time KTM riders. I know numerous guys who swap these wheel sets out regularly- SX, EXC, LC4, etc. RFS or 2 stroke.
  10. Stu

    Stu Buffo Maximus

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    Andy,
    I know what you mean by close tolerances. As a former software engineer I can agree with you completely. I will see if I can force it in and ride it for a while. When it is off by 7~8mm I hate to do that. Angstrom units I can see.... Even my Maicos, and especially the 125s, didn't have these sorts of mis-fits. I am also going to relieve the wheel's 6 webs by about 5mm, radiusing carefully.

    My post on KTMTalk gave me the same results: guys are sticking this wheel on their bikes. The supermoto guys are doing it the most.

    Again, Thanks! Stu
  11. The Cheat

    The Cheat Tard

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    Mine did the same thing, but it snugged up nicely once on the bike for a bit.
  12. mewerj

    mewerj Been here awhile

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    Everybody on this thread is seems to be a big fan of the 640 cush on the 525 for D/S use. Does the 525 have a weakish transmission or what is the deal? We would probably all agree that a DRZ400 is a pretty bulletproof dualsport and there are a bajillion of those running around cushless. I would think that running knobby tires and not wantonly abusing the bike you could be okay running cushless. Wide sticky SUMO rubber might be a different story though. Eh, just my thoughts.
  13. John E Davies

    John E Davies Runs at Mouth Adventurer

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    The RFS tranny was considered "weakish" when the bikes came out due to the thin 5th and 6th gears (to reduce weight) and the complete lack of any drivetrain cushioning, even in the clutch hub. The DRZ and most other motorcycle engines have a rubber bushing in the clutch hub that absorbs a lot of the jerk and snatch.

    Then there is the small oil capacity, which ends up causing high oil temps at sustained heavy load/ high road speeds. Thus the need for a cooler/ reservoir. Joe Racer claims that the high temps cause oil breakdown, which results in chipping of the 5th and 6th gear faces, and that cooler oil temps stop the problem. No one has proven this yet, that I am aware of.

    The cush hub is probably only a requirement for LOTS of pavement or where you run sticky rubber. There's plenty of cush in a knobby tire.

    The supposed excessive "failure" of these trannies is still hotly debated at KTMTalk. No owners have come forth and shown conclusively that there is a problem. KTM still says to keep these bikes off the highway, and owners keep doing it.

    Sooner or later everyone will know for sure how long these gears hold up.
  14. Stu

    Stu Buffo Maximus

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    John,

    Repeatedly assulting long uphills in deep sand or running 100 MPH down the highway for sustained distances might (maybe, perhaps, some small percentage of a chance, fill in favorite qualifier) cause oil overheating and the gear face to flake off, but I doubt it. I have never seen it. KTM most likely has, but in events like the Dakar. You can do this sort of stuff on an RFS but, Yo you KLR and DR lovers, you could not get this level of performance on the Japanese DS bikes so potential problems of this sort would not come up. Problems with the RFSs are minor irritations. We do not have to fix timing chain adjuster problems left undone for years by the factory, for example.

    Years ago Maico transmissions were similarly branded, against all evidence to the contrary, and the charges were repeated ad nauseam. I rebuilt lots of Maicos. The only tranny problems I saw were from a season of clutchless shifting under power. The gears were small, light, had high rotation speeds and were nevertheless durable. Good engineering and a very careful selection of materials with time put into the hardening process produced results. KTM trannys get the same attention to detail in manufacturing and get the same (read: more expensive) selection of materials.

    Stu
  15. The Cheat

    The Cheat Tard

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    I have a set of Supermoto wheels from my 625 SXC LC4, which I plan on using on my 450 EXC. I have the cush hub, but the problem is the front axle diameter. I think my SXC had a 20mm front hub and my EXC has a 26mm . Does any one know where I can find an axle adapter to make the 20mm wheel work with the 26mm fork.
  16. leesbian

    leesbian Been here awhile

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    OK chaps - things are getting exciting now. :clap

    I've been Speaking to Chris at Renazco about a seat, and have that sorted out (cheers dude!), and also Pat at Dirt Works about the rear wheel from an Adventure (hopefully get that sorted out today).

    I've ordered my Wolfman luggage, Acerbis tank (boy, do we get dicked! over here £249 - from ktm-parts $249! [£1 = $1.90]), 270W stator, Scotts reusable oil filter and K&N reusable air filter (less consumables to carry!), G2 Ergonomics throttle cam (tame the beast, maybe increase fuel economy - us Europeans are obssessed with that :D), Skid plate...

    Going to get PivotPegz tomorrow...

    All that remains now is the GPS mounting from Touratech, Scotts damper, HT racing oil cooler (know where I can get one other than from HT themselves? - perhaps a place that can also sell me the Scotts damper?)

    I also need to figure out how many teeth I want on front and rear sprockets, and which chain... I figure that for my RTW trip, starting in Europe, I want road oriented gearing and tyres, and then when the good roads run out, switch over to offroad gearing and tyres with tireballs in them :evil

    I'm going to try and resist putting any of it together until its all arrived, which I hope will be by this time next month. Then I've got a few days to fit it all... I'll take some pictures once thats all done :D
  17. DaddyBigDaddy

    DaddyBigDaddy AKA -Evel Kneilson

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    Last things first.....do you have any experience with TireBalls? They are a nightmare to install in a shop environment with 3 mechanics, let alone in TimBukTu with a stick and a rock. Try Bridgestone Ultra Tubes with Tubeless Tire "Slime" in them and Michelin Desert tires (EXTRA PLY SIDEWALL PREVENTS PINCHES)....on a 525 you will have no worries.

    Get a DID VMX Gold X ring chain and never lube it...never! Run stock 15/45 for street and just bring 14 and 13 primary's, no need to swap rear. Start with an Ironman or SideWinder Tri-metal 45 Rear...they will last 10k miles!

    The HT is overkill.....the LC4 motor is only .25 liters more in oil capacity and 20% larger in displacement. Use Motul Synthetic 300V Double Ester 15/50 - I have run these set-ups in every RFS, LC4 and LC8 Baja bike we have built for the last 5 years without one failure.

    The RFS gearbox issues are a myth, a fable, a hoax....run hard and fast in any gear all day long.... it wont break!

    Look into the RTT steering damper built into the triple clamp with remote control.....awesome units.
    www.rttmotorsports.com/steering_stabilzers.htm


    .
  18. flux_capacitor

    flux_capacitor I know a shortcut!

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    Just thought I would share with you all that I bought a PIAA bulb from my dealer that he says I can run without changing anything on the bike (i.e: Stator rewind, etc) that only draws 55/60 (or 65/50....I can't remember) watts and puts out 110/100. I won't be able to run any heated grips but that is fine for now. Next winter I'll be able to get the stator rewound and power more things off of it.
  19. Stu

    Stu Buffo Maximus

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    I run HD tubes and 11/12 lbs. rear/front with no problems with Dunlops.

    The Motul is excellent. The 5W-40 synthetic Rotella T gives great protection everywhere. I think I would run a heaver weight if I were doing Baja in the heat at full throttle.

    The RFS gearbox is tough as nails. I agree completely. KTM USA does NOT want the RFS on the streets. THEY are the ones responsible for the rumor that the gearbox will not hold up. THEY are the ones that say that only the SM 17" wheel complete cushioned hub will work on the RFS even though lots of riders report that they use their LC4 wheels with great success. KTM USA needs to knock it off and support the riders that will use this great bike for all sorts of riding rather than hiding behind a veil of corporate silence and resistance to riders. That approach will only alienate "the base".

    Stu
  20. potatoho

    potatoho Cheese and Rice!

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    I've found more issues with chain snatch during long whoops sections. I go through chains more often then tires on my 300 EXC, which does have a cush clutch but not cush hub. That was with primary drive brand chains. I'm trying out an RK brand to see if it does any better. If that fails then I'll switch lubes. With longer rides (250-300 miles), I got to the point with a primary drive brand chain that it would stretch during the ride to be out of tolerance.

    I'm just wondering if a cush hub would save me some cash on chains.