KTM 530 EXCR- More better!

Discussion in 'Thumpers' started by neduro, Apr 3, 2008.

  1. bigborefan

    bigborefan Making new friends

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    I think the TT stator is in order. I have the XC-W, with a fan, but my bike won't start with the button at all, even with a fresh battery. It is in the shop right now getting a new starter and possibly some kind of wrong way bearing. It kickstarts pretty easy though, But I still want my button to work.

    I ride with a guy who has an 08 530 XC-W. He had to upgrade to the TT to keep his battery charged. Running his lights seemed to kill his battery. He is good now with the TT stator.

    The dealer told me, in his opinion, that the charging system was adequate, but, slow, tight riding, fan running a lot, long term, will kill the battery.

    I say get the TT or ride faster to keep it charged.
  2. neduro

    neduro Addict Super Moderator

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    OK, here goes with the quick and dirty.

    I'm not an expert on engine work, so I find it stressful. The key for me doing this kind of work is to take my time, never use any force on anything, and be ready to just step away and come back if things are going my way. In this case, everything did and it was easy, but that's not always the case. :deal


    Step 1: clean the environment so that no dirt goes in the open motor.

    I powerwashed mine with the tank off using plenty of simple green, then I sprayed some WD-40 on the whole frame/ wiring harness/ over the motor area on the theory that any remaining dirt would be less likely to drop off if held by something. YMMV.

    Step 2: Make space.

    For the head to come out, you need to remove the radiators, head pipe, carb, etc. Here's the order I did it in, pics are a little scarce of the stuff I thought was basic:

    1) Drain Coolant: on the waterpump, there's one bolt with a copper washer beneath. Pull it out (it will only drip until you crack the rad cap), position your catch container, and then pull the radiator cap.

    2) Remove radiators... simple unbolting and set aside carefully. You also need to remove the R/S thermostat/ center hose assembly.

    3) Remove silencer, then pull springs and bolt near kick start and pull head pipe forward. You can remove entirely but it's not necessary.

    4) Make space with Carb: there's a bunch of ways to do this. I pulled the rubber boot from the airbox (see pic below) so that the carb could slide back. You can also tilt up the subframe, and you can also just wrestle the carb out of there. My method is pretty easy, so I recommend it. Pop off the rubber intake manifold, too. In any event, you need at least an inch and mabye 2 between the front of the carb and the back of the engine.

    [​IMG]

    5) Remove the valve cover (as you would for a valve inspection).

    Now you've got your working area.

    Step 3: Disassemble

    Make a space on a countertop and lay down some shop towels, so that you can pull things out and arrange them in the orientation they came off in. Give yourself plenty of room...

    1) Lock at Top Dead Center on the power stroke. Both valves should be shut, check your clearances quickly so that you can get shims if needed. To lock the motor there, pull the bolt with the thick copper washer out on the Right side of the motor, remove the washer, and wind it into the groove on the crank @ TDC.

    [​IMG]

    2) Remove lifters, as you would to change a shim. That requires pulling out the plugs on the right side of the head, pulling out the vertical bolts that pass through the lifter rod, and sliding the rod out to free the lifter.

    Note: The lifter rod (not sure what else to call it) is not symmetrical- note how it comes out and put it back that way.

    Note 2: On 08 530s, you may need to cut the frame if you've never changed a shim... see instructions elsewhere, just making a side note here.

    Note 3: You may as well pull your shims out right here, and put them somewhere labeled so you can reinstall them where they came from.

    3) Remove the CCT. Easy as pie, back out the small cover, then the big one, and pull out the CCT carefully getting both a very small O-ring and also a larger one. The cam chain should now have slack, verify with your finger.

    4) Remove the cam retainer:

    [​IMG]

    Now the cam will slide to the left, drop down once the race clears the roller bearing, allowing you to lift the chain off, and you can set the cam aside. Take a longish piece of safety wire and wrap it around the cam chain so you have a way to handle it without dropping it into the cases.

    [​IMG]

    5) Remove head bolts:

    Start with the little hidden 8mm that you can see in this picture:

    [​IMG]

    And then go for the actual bolts that tighten the head onto they cylinder into the cases, which are the monsters. IIRC they are an 8mm allen head... my personal method is to crack them just a small amount in a criss-cross pattern, until they are all loose, then wind them out. That way, there isn't a ton of force on one side of the head and none on the other, which seems like a good way to warp something. You'll tighten this way, too, but I always take them out that way which may be unnecessary.

    6) Now you're ready to pull the head out of the frame. It takes some doing, it will be angled up on the left and as far back as you can get it toward the clutch cable when it comes free.

    [​IMG]

    7) Even if you don't need to work on the cylinder, you should probably put in a fresh base gasket now that you've taken the pressure off everything, and I threw in fresh rings even though that might not have been necessary. That means the cylinder has to come out.

    Getting it out is easy, you'll just pull up and slide it off the piston. Mine didn't want to move and took a little convincing... the trick is getting it back over the rings, but we aren't there yet.

    Resist the urge to touch the piston, you can knock carbon into the motor and set yourself back. :deal

    Now your bike is here:

    [​IMG]

    Looking pretty impotent.

    For the head, I gave mine to a buddy who does this stuff for a living. He cleaned everything up, and installed new valve seals. It's not hard if you have a valve spring compressor, it's standard stuff so I'm not going to cover that in depth here.

    I would note that one intake valve seal was off, and the other one required next to no pressure to remove. The exhausts were on firmly, but the valves themselves had oil residue on the shaft and were a bit sticky to move. Long story short, I recommend having someone with a parts washer get all the oil residue out, all the carbon cleaned up, and etc.

    Your shop should charge you an hour if you bring them the head to pull the valves, drop the head in the parts washer for a while, and then reassemble with new seals. They will know this, but make sure all the parts go back where they came from- valves wear in and you can't swap them around, and you may as well keep all the retainers and springs in their homes too.
  3. neduro

    neduro Addict Super Moderator

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    Reassembly:

    Far and away the hardest part is installing the new rings into the cylinder. It really helps to have a friend, so that each of you can take a side and make sure the rings are going in as they should.

    1) Check your ring end gap.

    [​IMG]

    Mine were about 20-25 thousandths. Rule of thumb is 4 thousandths per inch of bore, so they were a bit worn. The new rings were a little tight at ~14 thousandths, so I went ahead and filed them out to 16ish. Use a flat cross-stroke of the file so that you aren't putting an edge on, and make sure there's no burr when you're done.

    2) Put the rings on the piston. This takes some patience and care... especially the oil sweeper ring.

    3) Wipe off the surface where the base gasket will lie. Just get it clear of oil.

    4) Lay down the new base gasket.

    5) Position the cylinder, feed the cam chain hangar wire up through the cam chain tunnel.

    6) Set the ring end gaps @ 180 to each other in the relief provided on either side of the base of the cylinder. Lower the cylinder on, using your thumbnails and/or a small screwdriver to keep the rings compressed as the cylinder comes over. The compression ring is usually pretty easy, the oil ring is kind of a bear. Just take your time and don't let the cylinder settle until the rings are where they need to be, it's easy to bend or break a ring at this stage.

    Sorry, no pics, I was kinda involved.

    Now the cylinder is settled down on the new base gasket with the piston home where it belongs. From here out, it's just basic reassembly.

    7) Lay down the new head gasket

    8) Feed the cam chain hangar wire up through the head, and then play your game of angles trying to get the damn thing back in. It came out, it will go back, just be patient and creative.

    9) Drop the 5 bolts into place- small bolt in chain tunnel, 4 head bolts. Tighten methodically in a criss cross pattern to torque spec- see manual. You'll see there are two torque specs- the idea is to bring them up to the first one, and then go to the second, to avoid warping things.

    10) Reinstall cam with dot pointing up. Install retainer, using some loctite on the retainer bolt. If the retainer threads are oily, make sure to clean them with some solvent so the loctite sticks, that would not be a good thing to have come out.

    11) Reinstall shims, lifters, and lifter rods. Check valve clearance. If it moved a bit from disassembly but is still in spec, don't sweat it, they'll bed back in.

    12) Unlock the engine by reinstalling thick copper washer. Turn the motor over slowly by hand using the kick start or rear wheel. If you did something wrong, you don't want to find out by mashing the starter button.

    13) Reinstall valve cover

    14) Reinstall thermostat, radiators, refill cooling system.

    15) Reinstall header, silencer

    16) Reinstall intake manifold, carburetor, fuel tank.

    That's about it! It's really not that bad, if you're careful and methodical it will take a couple hours to strip everything down and have the head off for cleanup. The next night, after the head is done, put everything back together.

    Holler with any questions...
  4. Country Doc

    Country Doc Wanderer

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    Ned;

    Thanks so much for taking the time to put together your reply. It will be invaluable when I tackle this shortly. I'll try to add a few more detailed pics when I have a go at mine.

    Cheers,
    Dan
  5. jrproper

    jrproper Been here awhile

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    How's the gas tank protection stickers holding up?? Any signs of them bubbling up because of the gas fumes?

  6. osteo

    osteo Motion is Life

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    Ned - as C.D. said above, thanks. I will be (or should be) doing mine possibly over the winter.

    D
  7. Michhub

    Michhub Major Medical

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    So far so good...they are perforated pretty well...
  8. JayBo1

    JayBo1 Long timer

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    Hiya Michelangelo. The tank is an Acerbis 13 liter tank. Might be interesting to know that the CPW Safari bikes took out 1st, 2nd & 3'rd overall in the Australasian Safari last week:clap . Slightly different set-ups, with various options of rear tanks and front tanks used depending on the fuel range required for each day's stages, but all were finished in the same extremely high quality that you appreciated in the '09 Gas Dash bike.
    My 530 will have several CPW Safari parts for the Abu Dhabi Desert Challenge in April next year:deal .
  9. jrproper

    jrproper Been here awhile

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    Hey Ned, very nice write up.:clap I'll probably be doing this after the winter.

    But a question, what's with the single throttle cable? You don't need the 'push' cable?

    [​IMG]
  10. Country Doc

    Country Doc Wanderer

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    Hey, I can field this one!

    Nope, you do not need the push cable.

    dc
  11. Yardstick

    Yardstick Hydrophobic

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    I thought I remembered seeing that second cable referred to as a "lawyer cable" somewhere in here. :lol3
  12. Michhub

    Michhub Major Medical

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    Damn dude, you got the Orange fever...nice lineup for any occasion...
  13. mototifosi

    mototifosi What does this one do?

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    Location:
    Sillykone Valleys
    This may be a no brainer but I have a new to me 08 530 EXCR. Though I have only ridden it a few times, I find the stock computer unit a bit tedious and lacking. I thought I would tap the amazing knowledge of all things "Orange" on here and have you weigh in on replacing it with the Trail Tech Enduro. Are there any concerns compatibility wise with getting rid of the stocker and replacing it with the TT unit? Is the TT quite a bit better than stock?

    Thanks in advance...
  14. DaveInSt.Augustine

    DaveInSt.Augustine Been here awhile

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    Do any of you guys do any long pavement trips on your 530? I think I read you can go 100hrs without needing to do a valve adjustment, is that true if your 50/50 riding? Any thoughts on my questions would be greatly appreicated. Are there any 530 owners in north FL?
  15. osteo

    osteo Motion is Life

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    There is a thread of a guy that did the TAT on his 450exc. I know he did regular oil changes, but I cannot recall if he did the valves or not during his trip. I can't recall his online name, maybe someone else knows the thread...

    D
  16. 400psi

    400psi Cropdusting

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    Nichelob

    http://www.advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=358010
  17. tobys

    tobys OCD Hobbiest

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    I'm at 85 hours, 1950 miles. About to check valves when I hit 100. I checked at 75, and they were just fine. So far I've not had to touch them.
  18. neduro

    neduro Addict Super Moderator

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    I think the question is why- if that's what you want to do, there are better bikes.

    FWIW, it takes me about 15 minutes to check the valves. There's no reason not to keep track of them frequently (15 hours or whatever), if they start moving you can figure out where to buy shims. It would be silly to not check them to avoid a 15 minute job.
  19. DaveInSt.Augustine

    DaveInSt.Augustine Been here awhile

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    yeah no doubt better bikes for long road trips, its nice to know if you wanted to do 1 or 2 trips a year on 530 it could easily do it. I am going to buy one for more trail riding not really going to rack up alot of road miles. There are definitely great deals on used 530, half off for barely used bikes.
  20. JayBo1

    JayBo1 Long timer

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    Dude, I ran my 530 in on a Rallye - did the first oil and filter change in the midday refuel/service. The bike has now done the '09 Yilgarn Rallye (1 day), the '09 Australasian Safari (7 days), a 3-hr Cross Country Ironman, a 2-day enduro and the '10 Abu Dhabi Desert Challenge (5-days).

    I have checked the valve clearances a few times and essentially haven't needed to make any changes. (I did change an inlet shim on Day 4 of the Safari but later changed it back as the valve clearance wasn't changing - the change I made was just precautionary as it was on the tight end of the range and I had marathon day looming).

    The bike has now done 102 hours of racing and reasonable liaison sections on the slab. I will give it a birthday before the 2011 season but then do another season of Rallye racing, maybe including a few more WCCR rounds. The 530 engine is brilliant. Just keep changing the oil (I use Motorex 15W60 full synthetic and change every day) and ride.