KTM 690 E & TuneECU

Discussion in 'Thumpers' started by Maurizio, May 9, 2011.

  1. Maurizio

    Maurizio 2 smoker

    Joined:
    May 24, 2003
    Oddometer:
    163
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    Turin, Italy
    Last week I received the second half of the OBD II cable:

    http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=220395457531&viewitem=&sspagename=STRK%3AMEWNX%3AIT

    to match this:

    http://cgi.ebay.it/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=120705053271&ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT

    So yesterday I take my laptop for a trip in our country house, where the 690 sits asleep since last autumn:


    [​IMG]

    ... I know, I know... TuneECU is a Windows based application...

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    Then I take this:

    [​IMG]

    and this:

    [​IMG]

    ... and connected them to the mac:

    [​IMG]

    ... and to the KTM diagnostic connector:

    [​IMG]


    [​IMG]


    [​IMG]


    Let's Parallels connect to the cable:

    [​IMG]

    Then I've launched TuneECU and started the bike:

    [​IMG]


    [​IMG]


    So I discovered that the dealer did really install the Akra maps (free of charge) last year:

    [​IMG]

    I've not played with the maps, besides saving them on the laptop, as the bike runs flawlessy with this map, the Rallye Replica air filter and Akrapovic slip-on with db-killer, but it's nice to see that everything worked as expected.
    Also, I've found out that no errors were stored in the ECU: good!

    Now, if some fellow 690er will create a new map, it will be nice that it will be shared and I will be happy to test it on my bike.
    #1
  2. GezwindeSpoed

    GezwindeSpoed Been here awhile

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    Nice, I would love to play with the EPT map. I will have a look at the connectors
    #2
  3. beaney

    beaney rally racer

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    So basically what your saying is that your quite willing to let someone like myself or crankshaft spend a load of money on dataloggers and dyno time, plus the time involved to create new maps, and then just get and use them.
    #3
  4. Maurizio

    Maurizio 2 smoker

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    Beaney, I don't mean this.

    And I don't want to steal your money and time.

    I probably will spend money as you and others do on dataloggers and dyno, if I will really want to dig into this maps affaire.

    But in this case I surely will never ask for money to sell a map, as it will be an hobby and not a work, and I will be glad to share my work with others.

    On the other hand, I don't think that anybody will do beta testing on maps created by a perfect unknown maps nerd, so feeling free to fry an ECU will be a personal choice.

    Take it easy...
    #4
  5. beaney

    beaney rally racer

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    You're quite right, only an idiot would download a map from the internet and put it in their bike.
    Always start from a known point, ie akra map and tweak in small steps to be safe.

    I do remap other peoples bikes but only use maps I have proven in my own bikes.

    I'll willing help people to understand the fi system and how to work with it, but wont do all the work for them.

    So any question just ask.
    #5
  6. Seth S

    Seth S Will _____ for _____

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    Sounds good.. and hurry up :rofl
    #6
  7. Vector Leto

    Vector Leto Adventurer

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    I'm sure you could figure some way to exchange $ for your files or settings ... how about something like i-tunes?:rofl
    #7
  8. Maurizio

    Maurizio 2 smoker

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    Great! The very same day of the publishing of a "tune", everything will be available on some torrents site...

    BTW I completely understand Beaney's point.

    What hurts me is the fact that his post seemed, to me, a little out of place here, where most of the fellow 690ers have always shared their own experiences and researches; just to make an example: maybe I was one of the firsts to sort out the parts for the air filter from the RFR spare parts catalogue, and to order those parts and fit them on my bike: now someone sells them as a kit.
    Years ago, well before TT will start the production of the high fender mod for the LC8 Advs, a German guy did the same, searching from KTM parts everything needed to do that modification.
    Again: I did some photoshop for the first idea of adapting a Dottori EXC fairing to a 690: now he sells them (and he has developed the idea to realize one of the nicest tank/fairing combo in production, IMHO).
    I am happy that people with the ability to produce things, or sell them, will make money, but I think that sharing infos (maybe only infos, in this case, and not precompiled maps) is the foundation of a community like this.

    Just my 2 cents. (... no, I don't need a refund of those 2 cents... :rofl)
    #8
  9. Maurizio

    Maurizio 2 smoker

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    I remember that too, and I don't want to dig his work.
    he offered me parts for testing that I already had, temporary for free, with the promise of paying those parts if I will keep them: I kindly rejected his offer.

    And yes, I purchased parts from John, as like the tank filler and cap and countersprocket protection, and I am very happy to have done it.

    One more thing: I don't think John needs a lawyer...

    Take it easy, again.
    #9
  10. bobzilla

    bobzilla Dirty Old Man

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    As Beata testers the 08-09 owners would have been up the creek if it was not for the shareing of ideas and solutions. There are guys on this board that I have listened to enough to tell which ones are in the know and which onesto just not pay much attention to. I know that some guys are gooing to sort out the FI issues with this bike and if they offer it to me Ill try it. If some of them want to sell it and they are ones I trust I may buy it. The notion that we all want something for free is bull shit. If the person that spends the time testing and developing settings wants to be reimbursed he will not offer it for free.

    Some times its hard to get where you are coming from on the internet and I may be wrong but you seem a bit off base here Beaney
    #10
  11. Velociraptor

    Velociraptor TrackBum

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    I used some settings that beany posted here and have been very happy with those settings, so perhaps he is not thrilled about having posted them. I really don't know. I can also see the frustration of spending lots of time and money to figure the mapping out and then see tons of other people use that information for free, more so if you are trying to develop a business from that work. In general though it seems like fuel injection maps get posted up somewhere and then are available for free. That seems to be the case with the Power Commander. When I bought a Power Commander from Dan Kyle Racing for my RC51 they loaded their own custom map into it that they had developed from a lot of dyno time. Of course they were selling me a product too and making some money. I would be willing to pay for a good map via paypal or whatever. I already made a donation to TuneEcu since a lot of work goes into that program and it is a free download. I have had some requests for the map I cobbled together using beany's settings but have not sent it out since anyone can make the same map by getting the info at adv rider and they are not my settings-add to that the fact that I am just changing numbers in a map and not doing any dyno runs or data logging. In fact I would be willing to send some money beany's way for the settings he already posted here. Should we all do that if we have used his stuff? How about it beany?
    I also feel a little different now knowing that he is not affiliated with Rally Raid, as I thought he was, and I have spent a ton of money with them.
    #11
  12. bayarearider

    bayarearider Been here awhile

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    I agree with you on this. I am willing to pay Beaney to get my ECU tuned and I already sent a PM to him 3-4 days ago but he is yet to respond. I also contacted John at Rally Raid and said they do custom mapping too but I would need to bring the bike to their shop, because the cost of loosing the ECU in mail is too risky to deal with.
    #12
  13. Bartron

    Bartron 'Tenacious B' the Bike Punisher

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    I have a TuneECU cable coming and am excited at the possibility of dialing things in. I was excited at seeing this thread...at first.

    I get Beany and some of the others have a huge investment made in time and resources to come up with optimal mapping. They have a right to recoup on their investment. One way they do is by offering their tuning services in person or by mail.

    However, this TuneECU 'phenomenon' has the potential to significantly alter the riding experience for many of us. This would be a grassroots approach to tuning. Cranky, Velociraptor and others are donating their time to dial things in. I would too if I had the time or knowledge but I can 'share' in the process differently.

    Here are some ideas:

    1. Beaney may choose to offer TuneECU tuning guidance by phone with a fee for said service. It's hard to copy a phone-call conversation and distribute it.

    2. We can collectively gather funds for someone to a) do the dynotesting/datalogging and thus support the end product or b) send in an ECU (with bike or not) and have Beaney/Rally raid do their magic. (I realize this is as subversive as it sounds)

    Either way, as soon as someone has a solid, proven map on their ECU it will be shared one way or another. This is and has been the ADV way. I'm willing to financially help pay for a map for my bike but since the settings would then be easily transportable from my bike to my friends' bikes, I would not charge them for my investment. Hell, if I'm having a great time, I want to see them have a great time too.

    In closing, to Beaney and others. We recognize your intellectual investment now lets find a way to work together to get everyone dialled in.
    #13
  14. road_donkey

    road_donkey not really into it..

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    +1
    #14
  15. crankshaft

    crankshaft Guns are for pussies

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    Hey Beaney,

    I for one appreciate your time and I also understand where you're coming from. Its a double edged sword for the most part.... you help a guy out, his motor blows for some unrelated issue and you look like the jerk. It's nice being helpful and working together to fix a common problem, but you'll always have "That guy" to contend with at some point.


    So, my theory about plugging the LM-2 into the OBD port on the 690 petered out. The Innovate people said that the OBDII language used by KTM is some sort of proprietary language special to KTM. He did mention that they are working with Tuneboy to offer a specially programed LM-2 that will data log piggy backed to the Tuneboy software.

    I wonder if they tried emailing tuneboy lately:lol3
    #15
  16. crankshaft

    crankshaft Guns are for pussies

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    My cousin has been helping me with the tuning and has surpassed my limited knowledge already but we still work together testing and tweaking. The most difficult part has been fabricating wiring harness to read TPS and MAP. Using RPM is great but having TPS and MAP would make the tuning experience much better. We've been tossing around the idea of maybe going to the KTM Adventure rides and doing some map tuning for interested folks. Imagine how perfect that would be, go ride for the weekend and get your bike tuned while you have a beer in the hotel lobby:lol3

    Memorial day weekend, we plan on really fine tuning on a 240 mile dual sport loop here in VT and Seth's 690 will be getting the treatment also.

    Moving forward.... slowly:lol3
    #16
  17. CHRIS_D

    CHRIS_D Been here awhile

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    Let me try this question here: Has anyone been able to adjust the THAD using TuneECU? I was able to adust the APAD with TuneECU but haven't had a chance to try and adjust the computer controlled portion or THAD.
    #17
  18. Bartron

    Bartron 'Tenacious B' the Bike Punisher

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    Craig from CJ Designs makes the TuneECU cable, would he have access to whatever components you'd require?

    As a funding source, you guys could negotiate a cut of cable sales perhaps since availability of a map would increase demand for the cable and you can't do the ECU work without the cable. Thus, revenue would come from the means to map and not the map itself.

    Just some ideas.
    #18
  19. Velociraptor

    Velociraptor TrackBum

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    One thing we also have to think about is that mapping can be very bike specific if you want the perfect map. It works OK to use a map for your general bike setup but if you want the best map then you have to take your own bike to the dyno. I am happy enough with the map I made as all I wanted was to get rid of the stalling problem. If someone posted a map for my bike setup that worked great then I would try it but until then I really have no issues.
    #19
  20. crankshaft

    crankshaft Guns are for pussies

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    The Tune cable is easy, I'm referring to the cables to measure TPS and MAP using the LM-2 wide 02 band tester. Basically, it's a DYNO in a box.
    We're finding that most Dyno tuning shoots for highest HP and not for best riding overall. The LM-2 will allow us to tune by using the trails as a dyno.

    Sharing maps over the internet is a bad idea, I see many potential problems. Confirming sensor values and health of the bike is important as part of the tune process.
    #20