KTM 690 E & TuneECU

Discussion in 'Thumpers' started by Maurizio, May 9, 2011.

  1. MeinMotorrad

    MeinMotorrad Long timer

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    I've got the KTM alloy slip on with cat, the EVO 1 foam filter and open air box cover. i'm wondering what map I can use to get rid of the stalling issues. I'm guessing the Akra map won't be the one. Perhaps a modified 215? Anybody else got this combo?

    Got the slip on to reduce weight and heat rather than any performance gain (KTM make no claims for a performance increase with this can), and I need to keep the cat for legal reasons. The EVO 1 stuff is again for convenience - cleaning the filter instead of replacing it.
  2. AMa.

    AMa. Topographer

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    <TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=4 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD class=alt2 style="BORDER-TOP: 1px inset; BORDER-RIGHT: 1px inset; BORDER-BOTTOM: 1px inset; BORDER-LEFT: 1px inset">Originally Posted by Estydeez [​IMG]

    As far as I can tell, there are no differences between the '12 and '13 model engines, but when I asked the dealer they said "we can't do the 2013's yet".

    Puzzling, but tomorrow is the next step forward.

    </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>No there is not. '12 and '13 stock maps are different and '13 EVO1 map is a combination of '12 EVO1 FI-map and '13 stock EP-map. So you can make your own '13 EVO1 map with TuneECU copy-paste tables -function. Just take '12 FI untouched and copy tables from '13 stock EP and paste them to '12 EVO1 EP. Voilá.

    '12 EVO1 map works well in '13 bike also.

    2012 Stock: KM765EU12B0215 (EP, FI)
    2012 EVO1: KM765EU12B0231 (EP, FI)
    2013 Stock: KM765EU12B0216 = KM765EU12B0202 (EP, FI)
    2013 EVO1: KM765EU12B0233 (EP, FI)


    MeinMotorrad:

    It would be helpful if you mention the model year of your bike in your post or maybe in your signature?
  3. bruceca2002

    bruceca2002 Been here awhile

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    Hi AMa

    With the modifided stock air box in post 162, how does it compare performance wise and noise wise to the KTM hard parts air box? Thanks
  4. Parigi

    Parigi Hoinar

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    This is the part I would like to deal with for now. That's why I asked how can I find a slightly richer map for the stock parts.
    Thanks AMa, your help is appreciated. :clap
  5. MeinMotorrad

    MeinMotorrad Long timer

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    Sorry about that, I meant to mention it in the post. It's a 2012 690cc
  6. AMa.

    AMa. Topographer

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    I Assume that "KTM hard parts air box" means the evo1 lid with the mesh?
    [​IMG]

    I have not "road-dynoed" this part. It feels very much alike the modbox. A little bit louder, I might say.

    As you can see from post 162 road dyno results, the more airflow (intake & exhaust), the more low end torque. And Noise.
  7. AMa.

    AMa. Topographer

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    You won't find. EVO1 map is 15-20% richer than stock.

    You can modify your stock maps. Find out what is your current stock map, modify it with the TuneECU and download it back to your bike.

    Modifying is easy; you just "paint" the fuel table cells yellow with left mouse button down, release the button and the cell corner right next to your mouse pointer appears a clickable % adjuster. Adjust fueling (to all 3 slots) and save + download. 15 min idle and you are ready to ride.

    The sweetness of this method is this: Normally all 3 fuel maps (1:soft, 2:performance, 3:standard,) are the same. Now you can put for example +2% to Soft map, +4% to Performance map and +6% to Standard map. If you copy-paste for example a 1:Soft EPT map to all 3 slots, the only difference you have is the fueling. Then you try all 3 slots on test ride and find out what you like the best.
  8. AMa.

    AMa. Topographer

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    That is a hard one. If the performance gain is not in mind, I would put the stock airbox snorkel back on and erase the ECU adaptations by re-mapping it with the stock map (215). Then run a 15 min idle. Stalling may be gone but in exchange you probably get the jerky ride of the stocker.

    If performance is in mind -as it usually is- but the bike must have e-approved parts on, I would get rid of the airbox lid and remap with EVO1 map. And let the rich mix ruin the kat (in time). I won't ruin the e-stamp in it... and remembering that the EVO1 map (or "Akro" map) does not give any performance gain at all if the engine's gas exchange is still equivalent to stock. I have no idea what is the back pressure of the Powerparts slip-on with kat compared to stock pipe. Go and give it a try with a EVO1 map and if it does not lift the front wheel any better, go back to stock map.

    Obviously the best thing to do would be a wideband lambda and do some tweaking, testing, tweaking, testing and tweaking again...

    Do you have a TuneECU-laptop + cables in your use?

    Have you erased the adaptations and tried a fresh 15 min idle with the parts you have already on? Does it pass 15 min?
  9. Estydeez

    Estydeez n00b

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    I think it should be announced sitewide that AMa is THE MAN.

    I Dremeled off the top of the airbox lid after work today. It was a good way to pass the time while I backed up the stock maps, which took about 40 minutes total.

    As AMa recommended, I loaded the following maps onto my 2013 KTM690 Enduro R (US model):
    KM765EU12B0231EPMap
    KM765EU12B0231FIMap

    I didn't bother keeping my '13 throttle map, as AMa mentioned. I figured I'd start with the '12 throttle map. It works too well to bother fussing with again.

    I followed the simple procedure laid out by this dude:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ctNjC_7HtjE

    I went out for a ride after to see how it runs, and it idles better, has more crisp throttle response, accelerates noticably harder. The engine runs a lot more like you'd expect such a burly motor to. Also, no more popping in the exhaust on decel. A nice first hint that things were better immediately was that it ran the full 15-min idle on the Standard ("3") settings without stalling. No stalling issues noticed on a 30min ride. :happay

    A good test will be to see how it starts again when much colder tolmorrow morning when I leave for work. It should be about 40 degF.

    Here is some other info I think it worth sharing
    (even some redundant info).
    -The full EVO 1 kit is comprised of an Akra header, the Akra slip-on, and a KTM hard parts less restrictive airbox cover.
    -I have an FMF powerbomb header, an FMF Apex slip-on, and I Dremeled out a huge hole in the Airbox.
    -The 2013 690 US model maps have the following names:

    KM765US12B0216EPMap
    KM765US12B0216FIMap

    I don't think there's anything else, but to summarize, my stalling issues appear to be gone, the bike runs like a scalded ape, and I think the way it sounds is going to give the neighborhood children nightmares. There is no reason any dirt bike should ever be so ferocious.

    If I could mail AMa a beer, I would! :clap
  10. MeinMotorrad

    MeinMotorrad Long timer

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    I've got TuneECU and Lonelec cables (haven't used them yet) but no access to the bike, possibly until next week so I can't play with it. I wonder how quickly a richer map will damage the cat' and what, if any, the consequences are for the can. As you mention the emark is needed - the bikes emissions are not tested by the legally required UK MOT test at a later date, so damage to the cat is less of a concern.

    I might give the local bike tuning specialist a go if their prices aren't too high, and see what they can do if the evo1 map doesn't work out. I still want the 70mpg (UK) I get now if possible - but the stalling must stop no matter what the cost to mpg.

    When I swapped the snorkel for the EVO 1 lid (like pic above) the bike immediately felt better, no surging and better low down torque, it also seemed to stall less, but it's still dangerous to ride. The bike is at the dealers for warranty work at the moment so I'll ask them to stick the EVO1 map on and see what happens.
  11. Parigi

    Parigi Hoinar

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    I'll vote for that :clap
  12. fluff34567

    fluff34567 Long timer

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    i have a 2010 with a leo vince can and that pops, farts and frightens old people and frogs with the noise it makes on deceleration.

    i used the ackra map but im not too happy with the performance TBH. im using the stock airfilter and scoop so maybe i swap to the mesh filter box and use the evo 1 map and see....

    unless ama has an alternative suggestion :deal:evil
  13. AMa.

    AMa. Topographer

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    Get rid of the lid. It is a plague.

    Hey, high tuned engines -like race cars and race bikes have- run ugly on idle and decel but they sing beatifully on WFO :D
  14. AMa.

    AMa. Topographer

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    I managed to get a 2013 US stock map. I compared it to it's european cousin, a 2013 EU stock map.

    2013 US Stock: KM765US12B0216 EP/FI
    2013 EU Stock: KM765EU12B0216 EP/FI

    EP maps were totally equal. Only difference was in FI map's "submap" F (fuel pulse / throttle position @ RPM) where :

    [​IMG]

    Same difference in every slot. (1,2,3 underseat switch)

    I can't imagine any reason why ECU would use these cells unless a) user modified F-L switch to 0,0,0,0,0 or b) faulty MAP sensor which forces the ECU to use only F map. ???

    So it is very unlikely to achieve anything using EU stock map in stock US bike. Of course there can be something that TuneECU software does not tell us, so I can't be 100% assured.
  15. Canadian_Bacon

    Canadian_Bacon Been here awhile

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    Hey everyone,

    I have a 2010 690 and am going to be installing the uni foam filer (keeping the snorkel), and wings exhaust. Do I need to do a remap, if so which one? I really don't know a ton about the whole remapping thing...

    I'm turning her into a true Adventure bike with the Rally Raid EVO 2 tanks and fairing and whatnot. So with that in mind any help would be much appreciated!
  16. gporteous

    gporteous n00b

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    My setup: 2012 690 EnduroR with Akra slip on, spark arrestor OUT (loud!), Evo-1 air box lid (noisy), K&N air filter. Had the bike at the dealer recently for stalling issues (+ backfires, farts, snorts, surging ... the usual). He installed new throttle cables (said they were broken (?) and likely the cause of my troubles. He also installed these maps: KM765US12B0216 EP/FI, which according to AMa are the stock 2013 maps. I thought that KTM somewhere along the line had issued Akra/Evo1 maps? No? BTW although running a bit better problems persist. Has my dealer done all he can do? Are these maps appropriate, but need 'tweaking' (via TuneECU I'm guessing - although I don't consider myself remotely 'qualified' to do this). At a loss here ...
  17. AMa.

    AMa. Topographer

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    The correct map for you is KM765EU12B0231 "EVO1". You have the EVO1 hardware on, in fact exactly the same as KTM Tuning KIT 1 except the EVO1 software. Call your dealer and say something nice to him. Then ask him to do his job as it should be done. Or insist to get a official KTM info which recommends that map to your bike's hardware. At least you have document with which to fight for warranty when you have melted your piston.

    This is not the first case and probably not the last. I have heard many of these stories. Does these so called "dealers" spin a wheel of fortune to select these random maps ?
  18. AMa.

    AMa. Topographer

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    Gorasz the-Wings-dealer told me:

    "WINGS mufflers are designed in the way that there is no need to remap the EFI with either small or large dB-killers mounted.
    If you use the mufflers without dB-killers you should remap using the Akrapovic-KTM map for non-cat. mufflers
    [FONT=Gisha, sans-serif]otherwise the engine will run to lean. [/FONT]

    [FONT=Gisha, sans-serif]Best regards,[/FONT]


    [FONT=Gisha, sans-serif]Gorazd Marovic"[/FONT]
  19. gporteous

    gporteous n00b

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    Thank you AMa. I specifically asked if that map was appropriate for my setup. They just don't seem to be very knowledgeable when it comes to these FI issues. Very disappointing. Thanks for the info though, helps me out a lot. Back to the dealer!
  20. Canadian_Bacon

    Canadian_Bacon Been here awhile

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    Thx man!