Kymco Downtown 300 with ABS

Discussion in 'Battle Scooters' started by hexnut, Sep 29, 2011.

  1. hexnut

    hexnut Been here awhile

    Joined:
    Feb 6, 2011
    Oddometer:
    603
    *
    #1
  2. HandKPhil

    HandKPhil Been here awhile

    Joined:
    Oct 26, 2009
    Oddometer:
    509
    Location:
    Southeast Michigan
    First of all, let me state that I have nothing against the Downtown 300i - in fact I really thought about getting one a few months ago.

    After a little searching I discovered the nearest dealer was about an hour away, and when I contacted him he told me he would order a 300i for me, but that I'd have to pay MSRP of $5599.

    Well I was not too keen on ordering a bike I'd never sat on (let alone seen), so I decided to hold off for a while. About a week later I saw a Majesty at another local dealership, and suddenly a light went on above my head. I wanted fuel injection, and like the 300i the Majesty had that. I wanted a stronger engine than the one in my Helix, and the Majesty checked that box off too. I wanted a modern suspension, Japanese build quality, and I wanted a bike I could lay my eyes and hands on prior to making a purchase.

    To make a long story short I found an '09 Majesty at a local dealership, and it only had 127 miles on it. It was a repo. I bought it for $4350, and the dealer threw in a free HJC helmet and an oil change.

    In a straight up comparison, is a Majesty a better bike than the Downtown? I don't know the answer to that, having never owned the Kymco. Is a very lightly used Majesty a valid option over a new Downtown, especially when you can find them for a thousand bucks cheaper? I think it's worth considering. (..and I would have bought the Downtown if it had been priced around $4000.)
    #2
  3. lifer

    lifer Been here awhile

    Joined:
    Feb 19, 2007
    Oddometer:
    200
    Thanks for the heads up on the DT 300I being available with ABS brakes here in the states. I believe it will be a good seller and I will be looking into one for next spring.
    The Majesty is a good value for the money . The big news here is that the DT 300I can be purchased with ABS brakes which the Majesty can not. From What I have read about the Kymco it will out perform the majesty in almost every way but as you stated it can be had much cheaper than a new Kymco if you buy used. I want all the safety features I can get and the power of a 400 with the milage of a 250 is a very good plus. Of all the scooters vailable in the US the DT300I is an exellent buy and the best value in the small maxi scooters. The Burgman 400 is the only other one in its league but costs much more to buy new and does not have a 2 year warrenty. The removal of the Honda Reflex left a large hole in the scooter line up available in the U.S. and the Kymco fills that hole very well. I have a Reflex and will add the Kymco to my stable. I live 20 miles from any town and the DT will work well for 50 -200 mile round trips that I take on a regular basis.
    #3
  4. Warney

    Warney Been here awhile

    Joined:
    Jun 6, 2010
    Oddometer:
    568
    Location:
    Omaha, Ne
    Breeze Cycles in Omaha has one new Downtown 300i for $4500 OTD. Gene will hook you up.
    #4
  5. lifer

    lifer Been here awhile

    Joined:
    Feb 19, 2007
    Oddometer:
    200
    Does it have ABS brakes? It is an option, not all DT's have them and they are about $500 extra. Up until hexnut found one on the show room floor it was thought that ABS was not available in the U.S. on the DT300I. I had checked with my local Kymco dealer just 2 months ago and he told me it was not available.
    #5
  6. Warney

    Warney Been here awhile

    Joined:
    Jun 6, 2010
    Oddometer:
    568
    Location:
    Omaha, Ne
    Don't know if it has ABS.
    #6
  7. btcn

    btcn Long timer

    Joined:
    Jul 1, 2010
    Oddometer:
    2,880
    Location:
    Morgan Hill CA
    I think it really depends on what you want. In general, the extra 100 cc will be nice on the Interstate, IMO the bigger the better for Interstate. No, I didn't say faster, I know a Ninja 250 will smoke a Majesty 400, but having a little extra torque and power for 70 MPH cruising is nice.

    THe 300 is a damn nice scoot though, bad sides are its probably got a highly optimistic speedo like most Kymcos. But good quality scoot. Hear its also fine on the highway and pretty impressive for a 300.
    #7
  8. HandKPhil

    HandKPhil Been here awhile

    Joined:
    Oct 26, 2009
    Oddometer:
    509
    Location:
    Southeast Michigan
    Over the last 7-8 years I've been all the way up and down the displacement ladder, on both scooters and motorcycles. I've owned everything from a 1300cc Honda VTX to a 70cc Honda Passport. Probably the two funnest bikes I've owned during that time were my current '03 KLR250 and my recently sold Honda Helix. I've realized that a person can wring a heck of a lot of fun out of just 250cc's.

    Having said that, both the KLR and the Helix could have been even better, had they had 10-20% more power.
    I've come to the realization that for my personal needs, a mid-sized, light, reasonably powerful scooter or motorcycle is the one that will give me the most enjoyment.

    This realization is the one that steered me towards the Downtown 300i (and also the People GT300i). It seems to me that the Downtown 300i is the logical evolution of the Honda Helix - with obvious upgrades to the suspension, brakes, engine, handling, etc. In other words, it's relatively light, it has a good horsepower to weight ratio, it has fuel injection, ABS, and it's certainly a huge improvement over the Helix in the looks department. Unfortunately the price, and proximity to the nearest Kymco dealership tipped the scales in favor of my Majesty.

    I hope Kymco sells tens of thousands of these bikes here in the States, so that I can pick up a clean used one a few years from now for $2500

    Now if only Suzuki would modernize the DR350, and brings it back with a water-cooled, fuel-injected engine, I'd be all set.:D
    #8
  9. Cortez

    Cortez BAZINGA!

    Joined:
    Apr 22, 2006
    Oddometer:
    7,169
    Location:
    Croatia
    The Downtown is known for it's agility and Majesty is exactly the opposite,
    so you should notice a big difference there. The Majesty is more comfortable
    and has a better wind protection without a doubt.

    The fuel consumption is about the same, the Downtown is probably faster
    up to 60mph, but the Majesty has a higher top speed.

    I'd get the Majesty for more straight roads, more 2up riding, longer trips.
    For everything else, especially city use and commuting, the Downtown is
    very hard to beat, regardless of price range.
    #9
  10. btcn

    btcn Long timer

    Joined:
    Jul 1, 2010
    Oddometer:
    2,880
    Location:
    Morgan Hill CA
    hexnut thats very impressive, I'd think it'd be about 10% off or more like most of the Kymcos. 2 MPH off at 60 MPH is pretty damn accurate, I wish they were all like that! Maybe it really isn't slower than the Majesty in the top speed department? Maybe the Majesty has a higher indicated top speed but its not as accurate?


    HandKPhil I think it just depends on what you want from a bike. Me for example, I like a big V-Twin at least 600 cc or more. But I also can have a blast on a 125 zooming around town!

    One thing I found is you don't appreciate a big motorcycle unless you've had a small displacement motorcycle as your only transportation. For example I had my Elite 150 for a couple years as my only transportation. While it was a blast and had fine power for almost everything, any high speed roads with 50+ MPH limits [especially single lane roads] the bike was running near flat out and I'd LOVE just a bit more.

    Then when I rode my Shadow man the thing felt like a frekin rocket! Putting it in 6th at 55 MPH and having the RPMs so low it almost stalls is an AWESOME feeling!

    If you start out with a 700 or bigger bike then you'll probably never quite appreciate the extra power as much.

    Now I love Scooters but for me nothings ever gonna replace a V-Twin! Except around town and for fun zipping around. I still love riding my Elite though, 100 MPG is unbeatable and its got great speed for backroad cruising and everything except interstate.

    Yes a 250 cc Bike can put out impressive power and be surprisingly fun. But many people will always wish for just a "little" more power. I think a 300 or maybe a 350 hits the spot between big, heavy and sluggish and quick and agile yet still fast enough. For MOST riding, sounds to me like the 300 is a good balance.

    But if your looking on doing some serious miles, a big heavy slow sluggish bike is of use. The wind won't blow you all over on the interstate, and semi trucks don't scare the hell out of you. But I think the Majesty should be more like the Downtown, people who are looking to do mainly serious miles will likely opt for a Burgman 650 or Silverwing.

    I think until you start getting to 500+ cc you'll likely want a little bit more speed, more acceleration, something if your doing lots of high speed riding though. But for me my Shadow has more than enough power. If I could get anymore power from it I wouldn't want it. It'll cruise at 85 MPH without breaking a sweat, and has plenty of acceleration.
    #10
  11. Cortez

    Cortez BAZINGA!

    Joined:
    Apr 22, 2006
    Oddometer:
    7,169
    Location:
    Croatia
    I can confirm that the Downtown and People 300 are the most accurate
    Kymco models from what I've tried.

    I have an Agility 125 that's 20% optimistic at 40mph!
    Thankfully, it gets better later on, but it's waaay off.

    The Downtown was just a few mph off at top speed, if we can trust
    our GPS stuff.
    #11
  12. HandKPhil

    HandKPhil Been here awhile

    Joined:
    Oct 26, 2009
    Oddometer:
    509
    Location:
    Southeast Michigan
    Not to turn this into a Kymco Downtown 300i vs. Yamaha Majesty thread, but after seeing some of the conflicting specifications and performance figures that have been tossed out, I decided to do a little digging. Not that my figures are to be taken as gospel, but I did find a few interesting tidbits:

    Downtown 300i horsepower = 29 hp (22 Kw)

    http://www.kymco.com/showroom/showr...4823-8486-D60301F4D49B&selPropertyName=ENGINE

    2008 Majesty horsepower has been reported at anywhere from 32 to 33.5 hp

    http://www.motorcycle-usa.com/281/4552/Motorcycle-Article/2008-Yamaha-Majesty-Scooter-Review.aspx

    I saw several articles which stated Majesty top speed to be either 105 or 106 mph.

    I saw two different sources which said Downtown 300i top speed was 95 mph.

    Zero to 60 mph figures for both bikes has been reported at 11 seconds. (This is a measured performance figure for the Downtown 300i, in the other Battle Scooter 300i thread)

    Wet weight for the Majesty is listed on the Yamaha site as 467lbs.

    Dry weight for the 300i is shown on their site as 367 lbs. Add 3.3 gallons of gas, plus a quart and a half of oil, and my guess is that wet weight is around 390 lbs.


    So if the figures above are correct, the wet Majesty is 20% heavier than the wet Downtown. If the 32-33 hp figure for the Majesty can be trusted, that works out to 15% more horsepower than the kymco's 29 hp.

    The 300i only has to move 13.4 or so lbs. per horsepower. The Majesty has to move around 15 lbs. per horsepower. My guess is that both bikes feel pretty much the same from the saddle, performance-wise. The lighter bike will probably be the more nimble one, and the heavier one will likely be more stable. Build quality is probably very close.
    I'm guessing the Majesty is more comfortable, with a plusher ride. I'm betting the Kymco handles a tad sharper.
    Usable torque probably goes to the Majesty. A new Majesty is more expensive than a new 300i.

    Pick your poison, and enjoy :1drink
    #12
  13. lifer

    lifer Been here awhile

    Joined:
    Feb 19, 2007
    Oddometer:
    200
    Handkfil, you missed the whole point of the DT300I ABS. The DT is called the down town for a reason. It is more nimble than any of the 400's. Its weight is about the same as my Honda Reflex 250 ABS. It is marketed and fills the same spot as a 250. It was not ment to compete with 400ccs. The 400s are a starter touring scoot that can be used in town. The DT300 is a city scoot that can be used on the open road. I love the size of my Reflex but it is right on the edge for open highway. The DT300 has a 10-15 mph higher top speed with more aceleration with the same weight and agility as my Reflex. The DT has the weight of a 250, nibleness of a 250, ABS brakes, more acceleration than a 250, with the fuel milage of a 250 , and the cost of a 250. Its a winner no matter how you slice it. Your 400 is a great bike and can be had at fire sale prices. I would not throw stones at a majesty at all but it is out classed by the Burgman 400.

    The Dt300I ABS has no competition in the U.S. at this point in time. I hope it sparks some competition but probably will remain alone in its market. Either way I am Glad its here finally.
    #13
  14. Brooktown Geezer

    Brooktown Geezer scooter guy

    Joined:
    Feb 9, 2009
    Oddometer:
    497
    Location:
    Fallbrook, CA
    Or unless you have used a smaller displacement bike to do the work a larger displacement bike does better.

    I recently rode my Vespa GT200 from San Diego county to the Canadian border. While we mostly stayed off the interstate, and most of the roads were 55mph or lower, you really couldn't classify the roads as twisty either (with the exception of Big Sur and a portion of highway 199.)

    The Vespa handled it fine, never sputtered or complained, and I only lacked for power on a couple of occasions going up long steep grades.

    On the other hand, I would have enjoyed a heavier bike with better wind protection, a better saddle, and the power to keep speed up the long steep grades. On my next trip I am going to try a larger windscreen on the GT200 and have the saddle altered. I think it will make for a more comfortable ride. I would be lying if I said I wasn't thinking about Burgmans and Silverwings by day 5 of my ride...
    #14
  15. HandKPhil

    HandKPhil Been here awhile

    Joined:
    Oct 26, 2009
    Oddometer:
    509
    Location:
    Southeast Michigan
    Actually, I think you missed a few of the posts in this thread.

    "I've come to the realization that for my personal needs, a mid-sized, light, reasonably powerful scooter or motorcycle is the one that will give me the most enjoyment.

    This realization is the one that steered me towards the Downtown 300i (and also the People GT300i). It seems to me that the Downtown 300i is the logical evolution of the Honda Helix - with obvious upgrades to the suspension, brakes, engine, handling, etc. In other words, it's relatively light, it has a good horsepower to weight ratio, it has fuel injection, ABS, and it's certainly a huge improvement over the Helix in the looks department. Unfortunately the price, and proximity to the nearest Kymco dealership tipped the scales in favor of my Majesty.

    I hope Kymco sells tens of thousands of these bikes here in the States, so that I can pick up a clean used one a few years from now for $2500"


    I'm not championing the Majesty over the Downtown - in fact I think my last post was pretty fair in showing the specs and performance figures for both bikes. I just said that for my money, in my personal situation, the Majesty was a better buy for me.

    And as I said in my last post, "Pick your poison and enjoy".
    #15
  16. btcn

    btcn Long timer

    Joined:
    Jul 1, 2010
    Oddometer:
    2,880
    Location:
    Morgan Hill CA
    Cortez 20% off? NO excuse for that!:huh Thats just scary for a noob who don't know about optimistic speedos and buys a Agility 125 and takes it to the road and does around the speed limits indicated on the speedo!:eek1 Yea thats a big selling point on the DT300! Shit if I were looking into a scooter and they put "Has extremely accurate speedometer" as part of their marketing, I'd be twice as likely to buy it!:deal

    HandKPhil maybe the Majesty has an indicated top speed of 105 MPH, but I don't think it'll do a GPS 105 MPH. I think its top speeds in the mid 90s by GPS from what I've heard. If the 300i has a top speed of a true 95 MPH or so, I think its some REAL competition for the majesty!

    Now the Majesty is a great scooter, but to many the 300 makes lots of sense. If its top speed is roughly the same, acceleration is probably about the same [ the 400 will likely have much more high end power over 60 MPH though]. But the 300 gets a bit better fuel economy from what I've heard, handles much better, and is cheaper its a good competition. Now I suppose even with the same top speeds the Majesty would be the choice for Interstate. Pretty much for long cruises on the Interstate bigger is better, the Majesty is probably not working as hard to hold higher speeds, and is probably smoother and the extra weight helps it not gets blown all over and ride nicer. Yes, your right its clearly designed as more of a small tourer with city abilities.

    Brooktown Geezer I'm with you there. Your right, when I had my Elite 150 as my only transportation, I wanted a Harley every time I rode it. I guess I was expecting a 1600 cc Big Twin from a 153 cc Single!:deal

    I was frustrated on roads with speed limited of 50 MPH and over. Around town and on most backroads its perfect, PLENTY of acceleration for me, runs like a dream at 45 MPH, and is a blast. But on high speed roads, it feels kinda gutless at 50+ MPH. I wanted low RPMs, and a higher top speed desperately. But I had no money, so I delt with it for a long time.

    Now just before last summer I bought my Shadow 700. What a dream to ride! I can pop it in 6th and Cruise at 70 MPH all day long with the RPMs below 4,000. Its more than powerful enough, all I care abouts cruising I guess! Kinda strange for my age, most my age are tryin to get the latest fastest crotch rocket seeing how fast they can die, but I'd take a Shadow over an R1 any day. Just not my style.
    #16
  17. mrnoitall

    mrnoitall Banned

    Joined:
    Jan 15, 2012
    Oddometer:
    146
    I've been lusting after a DT300 since before they were released. The problem for me is the price and resale value. I already know as I'm going in that I'll keep any given bike for 1-3 years before selling it. Used Kymcos are impossible to sell here in the states. I would likely lose 60% maybe more of my investment if I purchased a new DT300i. I saw a brand new Kymco 500 on ebay with a buy it now of $3500 and I'm not even sure if it sold at that price.

    By contrast I can buy a low mileage like new 08 Burgman 400 for $3000 or so and get 90% of my investment back when I'm ready to try something else. That's the only reason I haven't bought the new Downtown. My loss for sure but I just can't do it.
    #17
  18. lifer

    lifer Been here awhile

    Joined:
    Feb 19, 2007
    Oddometer:
    200
    What you say is true. A few months ago I could have purchased a 2009 Exciting 500 for $2000 off of the local craigslist. It was for sale for quite a while before it sold. If I were not wanting ABS I would definatly buy a used burgman 400. I have not seen a used abs burgman for sale yet but if I do I will buy it. I love the DT300 but I am concerned now that it might be too tight for me, I am 6'2" and a 32 inseam. I have heard that about 6' is about it for the DT. If I find a used exciting 250 I might buy it though.
    PS: I also called my local Kymco dealer again about the availability of the DT with ABS brakes in the USA and he had to call Kymco . They told him it is not available in the USA yet. So I have no idea how a dealer in Tennesee had one on the show room floor.
    #18
  19. Phipsd

    Phipsd Been here awhile

    Joined:
    Oct 30, 2010
    Oddometer:
    785
    Location:
    West coast British Columbia
    At six four and a half I'm a little taller than you and when I went looking for scooters I quickly found that I didn't fit well on most of the usual suspects including the Downtown. The two bikes that fit me were the Burgman 400 and the SYM Citycom.

    I've had the Citycom for two years and now that it is well broken in the performance is excellent. When I'm closer to retirement I'll be getting rid of my big Suzuki C90 cruiser and getting a Burgman 400 with ABS for camping touring.

    Both bikes can cruise comfortably at an honest 70 mph which is fast enough for long distance riding. Riding faster doesn't get you there faster with the much more frequent fuel stops.

    The GTi 300 would be of more interest to me than the Downtown if I wanted a Kymco.
    #19
  20. mrnoitall

    mrnoitall Banned

    Joined:
    Jan 15, 2012
    Oddometer:
    146
    :huh No competition?.. Why because it's slighlty bigger than a 250 scooter and slightly smaller than a 400 scooter? That does not mean it creates a brand new category. It's got plenty of competition and that's why it's not selling well. For the price you can get a 400cc Japanese scooter that will be worth something when you sell it.

    If I were in the market for a new scooter... which I'm not because I never buy any vehicle new, I would buy the 300DT if it were $2000 less than a Majesty or Burgman. I really like the looks of it and something a hair more powerful than my 250cc scooters would be nice for the highway but for the price and resale value it makes so much more sense to buy a Japanese bike... at least for me since I keep them for two years and sell them. I do however keep my eyes open for a used example. for a 40% discount!:evil
    #20